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Yesterday - Bundy Ranch

america is dead.

seems like the constitutin is no more.

WHOAHAHHAHAHAH welcome to mother america. bow down to your supreme dictator osama bin barack obama
 
Ryan Bundy said of Sunday’s incident with his brother. “America is not the land of the free and the home of the free anymore, and this is the evidence of it.”

Isn't brave in there somewhere?
 
Sunday marked the first reported physical confrontation between family members and the agency since the BLM announced this week it would start impounding cattle that it says has been trespassing on U.S. land without proper grazing permits for more than 25 years.

How hard is it to get a grazing permit? Is this an issue of not wanting to go to the trouble to get a permit? Lots of activities require permits, so how bad is it to secure the proper grazing permit to begin with?
 
According to this specific story the BLM started to round up this ranchers cattle on Sunday and the family showed up and started filming them. BLM had snipers that trained their rifles at the family and BLM agents forced them to leave. One guy did not and was tackled and arrested, he has since been released. Now Washington and Iron counties, along with the Sherriffs of the two counties, have sent letters to the BLM supervisor for the state of NV (where this all happened) and have blasted them for focusing on this families cattle instead of the wild horse populations that they are supposed to control and are not. The two counties have vowed to take the wild horse "problem" into their own hands.

This has people in the area quite upset at the Feds.
 
I must have misunderstood something I read. Thank you for the correction.

Not a big deal. That kind of stuff is in my area of "expertise". Not saying I know it all, but I know more than the average person.

It's one of those things where people that don't know a lot about agriculture are going to be confused by it, so we just have to do a better job at explaining it.
 
What I am hear ing is that this is blowing up.

The NV governor wrote the BLM and voiced his displeasure
Washington county sheriff's would not let the BLM trucks with the cattle enter Utah
The auction house in Utah is trying to hide their FB pages as its blowing up
A support the Bundys web page had the three founders placed on the terrorist watch list
Iron county threatened to arrest the drivers of any BLM trucks found in iron county for robbery

All rumors and none of it supported by fact or reporting yet.
 
I just got home. Spent the evening with the Bundy kids. Good people.
The real issue is they have been raising cattle for more than a hundred years on the land. In times of financial hardship they freely fed surrounding communities and in times of uptick they profited. Later, the feds come in and demand payment for the grazing lands... they've been arguing the validity. Now the feds want to remove all livestock in an interest to provide more land for the desert tortoise (what an immense pile of ****). The ranchers are being called trespassers.. but they counter, "who is the trespasser here."

I have to say.. I am PISSED. I've never been one to be anti-government, but I learned A LOT tonight and our abuse of power and govt WASTE is on FULL display in Bunkerville, NV.

Imagine, the govt is saying they will spend $3mm rounding up 900 cattle. Thats something 3 or 4 cowboys on horse could do in a few days.

Disgusting. Going back on Saturday.

Godspeed to the Bundy's.
 
Yes free speach zones are bs.

The idea that the Bundy's have a right to graze on public land without a permit is also bs. I am for the fed turning over blm land to the states but I cannot support this. Over grazing is a problem and it isn't fair to other ranchers or wildlife. I view what they are doing exactly the same way I view poaching.
 
^ I don't have time to debate this (at least right now) on a message board, but reading that post tells me exactly which article(s) you read after a quick google search on the matter.

I assure you, had you spent the day and evening with the Bundy's as I had, understood more details from their perspective, you'd see it a bit differently.

I'll admit there are two sides, but to believe either side is patently correct is to merely read a force-fed newstory and not understand the issues from the core basic elements of the real lives involved.
 
I just got home. Spent the evening with the Bundy kids. Good people.
The real issue is they have been raising cattle for more than a hundred years on the land. In times of financial hardship they freely fed surrounding communities and in times of uptick they profited. Later, the feds come in and demand payment for the grazing lands... they've been arguing the validity. Now the feds want to remove all livestock in an interest to provide more land for the desert tortoise (what an immense pile of ****). The ranchers are being called trespassers.. but they counter, "who is the trespasser here."

I have to say.. I am PISSED. I've never been one to be anti-government, but I learned A LOT tonight and our abuse of power and govt WASTE is on FULL display in Bunkerville, NV.

Imagine, the govt is saying they will spend $3mm rounding up 900 cattle. Thats something 3 or 4 cowboys on horse could do in a few days.

Disgusting. Going back on Saturday.

Godspeed to the Bundy's.

Well according to the law the Bundy's are the trespassers. According to the article I read none of the other ranchers are supporting the Bundy's because they all got permits to have their cows use public land to graze. The court issued a decision that said they were not allowed to have their cows graze on public land and they ignored it. Now I am not for the sniper action but in the article I read there were quotes from other ranchers criticizing the family. I am not a pro-government person either but I do believe in following the law and it seems like reasonable people could have avoid this situation.
 
Well according to the law the Bundy's are the trespassers. According to the article I read none of the other ranchers are supporting the Bundy's because they all got permits to have their cows use public land to graze. The court issued a decision that said they were not allowed to have their cows graze on public land and they ignored it. Now I am not for the sniper action but in the article I read there were quotes from other ranchers criticizing the family. I am not a pro-government person either but I do believe in following the law and it seems like reasonable people could have avoid this situation.

I totally understand this point of view. Tbh, this was mine, entirely, before I spent time with them. Here are some FACTS that differ from the articles being written (someone has to feed the story to the 'journalists' (aka, bloggers) so it's not hard to see where they are getting their info.

1) The 'ranchers not supporting them' thing is TOTAL bs. I was there, with them, and there were hundreds of people there supporting them, including other ranchers (there are not many, at all, remaining). Nonetheless, they have far more local support than not. Of that I am certain.

2) These permit-paying ranchers are the johnny-come-lately's. They were not there grazing in the 1800's. Part of the Bundy's claims is they have been supporting their neighbors, when in need, with beef for more than a century and now they're being told they have to pay the federal government without any acknowledgment of their past good deeds.

I can see where the vast majority of Americans would find little to no sympathy for Clive Bundy. It's simply the law. However, we have been passively giving over more and more of our freedoms and inalienable rights to the federal government, continuously, for two centuries.. and now the pace has seemed to have quickened.

Alexis de Tocqueville rearing its head? Have we been 'recreated' to the point we've fallen asleep and simply get in line and follow the law regardless? The answer is yes.

A few questions.
Could the government possibly pass laws that are unconstitutional and unfair to the people?
Is there a point at which for you, personally, you draw the line and refuse to follow the law (think of China and baby girls)?
If there is a point we feel the government (other 'men') can cross into our civil liberties, what is that line.. and, specifically, do you believe that line is different for different people?

I TRULY believe we have become the cattle in America. UGLI is not the only robot on this forum. We are slowly handing over our rights and I fear too few people will have the eyes to see it in time... I am almost certain, in fact.
 
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