Sorry gun advocates, you'll just have to suck it up

[Deleted member 848]

I don't think that anyone actually believes that reasonable, prudent gun control measures will wipe out gun violence. What we do think, however, is that it will reduce it at the margin, without eliminating anyone law abiding citizen's rights to owning guns (although not all forms of weaponry). The projected benefits is reduced loss of life and injury at a de minimus cost to gun, or would be, gun owners.

That a public policy does not solve a policy problem is not reason to argue against it--very, very few public problems lend themselves to being solved by a single policy. The question is whether the projected benefits exceed the projected costs. I believe they do, but ultimately I suppose it is an empirical question.

The problem is that we cannot discuss rationally even the most reasonable/prudent/measured policy because then the NRA and its legions of irrational gun nuts start yelling 'slippery slope' at the top of their lungs, and next thing you know, a very measured policy to keep guns out of the hands of the mentally ill becomes a nefarious government scheme to enslave the American population and impose Nazi-style tyranny on them.

could not have said it better myself.

 

[Siro]

It's not like America is the only country with inner city crime, action movies, crazy people, or nationalist.

The biggest reason is the ease of gun access, clearly.

Then why does the US lead in knife homicide? Why do states like Utah have low rates of gun violence?

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

I don't agree fish, if they legalize drugs it would end so many issues at hand, prison population would decrease, drug cartel mafias would become obsolete, and people would actually be more interested in doing research on drugs if they knew they could use them if they wanted to. I think it would encourage a more responsible consumption, not more consumption.

Yep, agree 100%, or close to it. The cartels would not become obsolete--they have too much invested to disappear--but would diversify into other areas, or would go legit in supply drugs through the legal pipeline, or something else.

Our drug policy is a proven failure, makes one wonder how much evidence is required before we are willing to stop a failed policy?

 

[Stoked]

Why isn't there a tons of guns flowing into Canada and England then?

Neither one of them have nearly the border issues that America has. Horrible comparison.

 

[Stoked]

What rights and privileges are there with gun ownership? Im not a gun owner so I dont know what else there is to lose.

Would a certification or training program you must attend be considered infringement on rights? Personally, I would like to train people to
properly handle guns starting at a very early age. We dont have to run away from guns. They arent going away,
and dont have to. In europe kids can drink beer, and wine at 16. There seems to be a different attitude towards drinking. We dont run away
from it, we accept it, and even embrace it. At the end of HS at age 16 the teens take crates of beer to the center of town and drink together. Its quite
shocking for Americans to see this. Maybe if guns were seen as something to enjoy, but responsibly we could educate more people. Teaching people how to be
really profincent in gun use, and safety. Its something that we aspire to, its not something that just falls in our laps without any warning. A training program that
requires someone to fully grasp what they are holding in their hands, and how to properly use it. Obviously this kind of goes away from the thinking of taking away
guns, but properly arming the millions of people with them.

I mean what other rights would need to be violated along the way to have a gun free society on the level of say England.

What would need to be done to get from point A (Current gun laden American society) to point B (current relatively gun free America society).

Simply outlawing the Future selling of guns isn't enough. Will there be warrantless search and seizure? What else would need to be done? House to house searches?

 

[Hotdog]

If you had the decency for courteous discourse you would simply ask this question instead of attaching implications and pejoratives to it several times. In fact, as a long time member you are well aware that I am the biggest advocate here of curing America's problem of inner city violence and poverty. But you're not interested in sincere discourse or actual cures to problems. You want to turn this place into a steaming pile of **** and get your kicks in trolling anyone who will give you an ear. Take your crap back to spurstalk and every other NBA forum you troll.

Well said.

Love it!!

 

[Siro]

I mean what other rights would need to be violated along the way to have a gun free society on the level of say England.

What would need to be done to get from point A (Current gun laden American society) to point B (current relatively gun free America society).

Simply outlawing the Future selling of guns isn't enough. Will there be warrantless search and seizure? What else would need to be done? House to house searches?

Hypothetically speaking, the government can institute a buy-back program, and outlaw resale of guns. Eventually, the number of guns will be greatly diminished.

 

[fishonjazz]

It's not like America is the only country with inner city crime, action movies, crazy people, or nationalist.

The biggest reason is the ease of gun access, clearly.

Seems pretty obvious to me

 

[fishonjazz]

Neither one of them have nearly the border issues that America has. Horrible comparison.

They also don't have lax gun laws.

 

[Hotdog]

My first post to you was pejorative-free-- but either way, it's quite rich that you expect me to conduct non-inflammatory conversations with you when you do this with other posters here on Jazzfanz. How am I supposed to take you seriously when I see the posts that you type in response to ElRoacho?





I'm genuinely unaware of this.



I think I asked you 4 separate times in this thread for diseases, or cures to problems. You're being melodramatic.



Jazzfanz's biggest troll asking me to stop trolling. K.

franklin is a 100 times more sincere in his debates, and actually provides insight.

You on the other hand only provide garbage to burn.

 

[Stoked]

Hypothetically speaking, the government can institute a buy-back program, and outlaw resale of guns. Eventually, the number of guns will be greatly diminished.

There are already buy back programs all over the country. Many police departments have them.

Also the gov, could ban the sale of firearms (they wont because but I digress) but that won't solve the problem. There will be, as I have mentioned before, a dramatic increase in gun trafficking over the southern border and a dramatic increase in home made firearms (already exists).

Will the number of over all weapons go down? I think so. But I don't think by a big enough number to truly make a difference.

 

[Deleted member 848]

franklin is a 100 times more sincere in his debates, and actually provides insight.

You on the other hand only provide garbage to burn.

send me more angry PMs pls. In the mood for another laugh.