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Dear Fat People

I too would like to hear this.

There are obvious exceptions for why some people are larger than others, but by and large, we have absolved people of personal accountability. I mean, why blame ourselves when we can blame our bosses for not paying us enough, the politicians for not giving us enough, and capitalism for ensuring that our food is no longer healthy? It's all somebody else's fault, not mine!


ah of course- the typical neoconservative drivel. Look, we can either wait and expect an entire nation of fat people to suddenly undertake incredible efforts to cumulatively shed their weight through shaming (and we have decades of evidence proving the effectivity of this approach) or we can do what other nations do.
 
It's absolutely comical that people think that all it will take is a country figuring out that other people aren't responsible for their own weight gain, or that we need to stop fat-acceptance, in order to end the obesity epidemic. But again, it's this sort of mindset that has established the problem.
 
ah of course- the typical neoconservative drivel. Look, we can either wait and expect an entire nation of fat people to suddenly undertake incredible efforts to cumulatively shed their weight through shaming (and we have decades of evidence proving the effectivity of this approach) or we can do what other nations do.

You're implying a lot, per usual. Was I talking about shaming? Did I mention it? Nope. I just want people to be responsible. Hell, I'm a little chunky, you know whose fault it is? It's mine. I like to eat. I know what's healthy and what isn't, I know I should work out, but those are choices I make.

Would you be happy with a parent that let's their kids smoke at a young age? Of course not. So why should we abstain parents from the blame of obesity. It's certainly more difficult to eat healthier/less, one might actually have to cook! But it is still a choice, and we're still responsible for our choices and the impacts they make on the people around us.
 
None, she's an attractive young lady.

well, I guess we should not be arguing about taste when it comes to women...but I personally can't understand how such an obese and unhealthy person can be attractive. All I can feel looking at people like that is sympathy for their unhealthy bodies trapped behind slabs of fat.
 
However, if your real-life persona is anything like your on-line persona, I might need a drink just to avoid spitting in your face.

Its sad you feel that way. I am very nice person in real life. Don't like sugarcoating things and be politically correct though, so if you do not like honesty then I get it. We have saying in my homeland - bitter truth is better then sweet lie. I try to stick to it no matter how much it can hurt somebody.
 
You're implying a lot, per usual. Was I talking about shaming? Did I mention it? Nope. I just want people to be responsible. Hell, I'm a little chunky, you know whose fault it is? It's mine. I like to eat. I know what's healthy and what isn't, I know I should work out, but those are choices I make.

Would you be happy with a parent that let's their kids smoke at a young age? Of course not. So why should we abstain parents from the blame of obesity. It's certainly more difficult to eat healthier/less, one might actually have to cook! But it is still a choice, and we're still responsible for our choices and the impacts they make on the people around us.



1) who said I'm implying that youre the one who is shaming? I am firmly proposing that that has been the main social response to obesity. And you're wrong if you don't think so

2) I absolutely love that you brought up the smoking example. Look. It wasn't until the government undertook regulating actions, that smoking became dramatically less accessible, more firmly stigmatized, and rates dropped everywhere. AKA the government actually did a fantastic job with it (I know some in your circle enjoy characterizing the institution as wholly inept)
 
Its sad you feel that way. I am very nice person in real life. Don't like sugarcoating things and be politically correct though, so if you do not like honesty then I get it. We have saying in my homeland - bitter truth is better then sweet lie. I try to stick to it no matter how much it can hurt somebody.

this is some stupid **** dude. You're embarrassing yourself. Who gives a **** if anyone doesn't conform to a societally-constructed beauty norm? Our women have it so much ****ing worse than you (who's probably the typical Euro with male-pattern baldness and dry flaky skin).


We need to be acceptant of a variety of different body shapes. Along with that, we need to attach obesity, which requires undertaking a societal effort and confronting social determinants of obesity.
 
well, I guess we should not be arguing about taste when it comes to women...but I personally can't understand how such an obese and unhealthy person can be attractive. All I can feel looking at people like that is sympathy for their unhealthy bodies trapped behind slabs of fat.

Let's be clear: 1000 years ago women of that size were considered more attractive than the skinny women. The reality is that neither is inherently better looking; this is conditioning foisted upon by society/mass media. Once you know that, you can continue to buy into it or you can make a decision to reject it.
 
Its sad you feel that way.

I was being deliberately provocative to basically change the tenor of the conversation. I have never been the type to spit in anyone's face, even when sober.

Talking about "to force yourself upon something like that" is demeaning to the young lady in at least 3 different ways, all based on one of the least-important you can know about her as a person. You can be better than that.

I am very nice person in real life. Don't like sugarcoating things and be politically correct though,

This is contradiction. Engaging in "political correctness" *is* just being nice, except we (societal we) use the slur term for the types of niceness we don't feel like practicing at a particular point in time.

so if you do not like honesty then I get it.

Everyone really loves being honest when it allows them to insult people without fear of reprisals.

If you want to be honest, ask yourself how you would feel about some one else saying this about a good friend or a relative.

We have saying in my homeland - bitter truth is better then sweet lie. I try to stick to it no matter how much it can hurt somebody.

Blindly following social conventions on beauty does not make for bitter truth, nor any other sort of truth.
 
Talking about "to force yourself upon something like that" is demeaning to the young lady in at least 3 different ways, all based on one of the least-important you can know about her as a person. You can be better than that.

Well, knowing her as a person would not change my ways about her sexuality. She could be nicest person in the world and be my good friend but I would never ever have sexual thoughts about her as she is just absolutely unattractive.


Everyone really loves being honest when it allows them to insult people without fear of reprisals.

If you want to be honest, ask yourself how you would feel about some one else saying this about a good friend or a relative.

I would appreciate honesty. I don't find it insulting telling to somebody that I find them unattractive. Matter of taste, that's it, nothing personal.

Blindly following social conventions on beauty does not make for bitter truth, nor any other sort of truth.

Oh trust me it is not blindly at all. I have my own reasons which have nothing to do with social conventions.
 
this is some stupid **** dude. You're embarrassing yourself. Who gives a **** if anyone doesn't conform to a societally-constructed beauty norm?

Ok, I see so you would not mind dating girl like that? Somehow I do not believe you.
 
Ok, I see so you would not mind dating girl like that? Somehow I do not believe you.

I date smart, confident women who care about themselves as well as others. If she has a bpdy-frame that isnt conducive to the bizarrely narrow standard of 'what is beautiful for women', then I dont give a ****. Why would I give a **** what some person thinks of how my partner matches up to the societal stick of beauty? If she's beautiful to me, and she's a good person, that's all I need.
 
That's all good and dandy and nobody is arguing about it. But lets talk about woman in One Brow example - is she beautiful to you?

she could be-- I would have to see her and meet her. If I didn't purely because of her deviant appearance, it would be reflective of my societal conditioning thanks to years of mass media telling me how to think of women.
 
I have maybe 50 posts on this topic, probably in this thread alone. Take a read.


How's this for an answer: placing the blame on parents for their fat children will be as successful in solving the obesity pandemic as it has been up until this point in time.

Now, a couple of questions: is America home to the worst parents in the developed world? Why the inflated rates here vs. elsewhere? Are Canadians generally better parents? Germans? The English?

Placing the blame squarely on individuals, and ignoring systemic, societal factors is incredibly naive, foolish, and the precise reason why America has this epidemic in the first place.

Dal, I appreciate the response.

I don't know what the quality of American parenting rates in comparison to other folks from around the world and since I have only lived in America, I can only speak for Americans regardless of whether they are parents or not. Americans in aggregate are fat and like most articles on this subject state, Americans are wholly rotund in comparison to the rest of the world. But not only are my fellow Americans obese but they have all sorts of medical and physical complications as a result of their obesity.

That being said, I completely agree with you. Ignoring systemic and societal factors IS 100% naive and foolish. The food system in this country is horrendous and the medical establishment has been giving us the wrong information for years when it's come to diet. Though at the end of the day, personal choice trumps all and what we put into our collective fat mouths is ultimately a personal choice. And as others have mentioned in this thread, they know their choices are poor and they know they might be slightly overweight or in Log's case, "huggable."

All of this changes though, when we, you or I decide to have children because we are no longer living and making decisions for ourselves. Once we have children, we are instantly arbriters of what is good or bad for our children and if we have fat children, children whose metabolism allows them to burn through most everything you feed them, we are not doing a good job. Most fat kids are probably being fed complete garbage and if you're a "parent" who is feeding their child soda, candy, fast food, then, yes, you are a bad parent.

tl;dr nothing is more rich than ppl individualizing and depoliticizing obesity. Commonly done via genetic and/or parental arguments. A simple comparison across time and nations easily deconstructs this moronic argument.

Id' be more than interested in seeing these comparisons and how they affect some of the folks that have been part of the images I've posted in this thread...those folks that celebrate their fat even while knowing they are being unhealthy.

ah of course- the typical neoconservative drivel. Look, we can either wait and expect an entire nation of fat people to suddenly undertake incredible efforts to cumulatively shed their weight through shaming (and we have decades of evidence proving the effectivity of this approach) or we can do what other nations do.

What do other nations do? I think you're abroad right? How the weight issue in your home country?

It's absolutely comical that people think that all it will take is a country figuring out that other people aren't responsible for their own weight gain, or that we need to stop fat-acceptance, in order to end the obesity epidemic. But again, it's this sort of mindset that has established the problem.

Should fat acceptance be encouraged? Or met with science and information?
 
If she has a bpdy-frame that isnt conducive to the bizarrely narrow standard of 'what is beautiful for women', then I dont give a ****.

Damn, son. I'm into thick girls too! Love me some junk in the trunk.
 
Dal, I appreciate the response.

I don't know what the quality of American parenting rates in comparison to other folks from around the world and since I have only lived in America, I can only speak for Americans regardless of whether they are parents or not. Americans in aggregate are fat and like most articles on this subject state, Americans are wholly rotund in comparison to the rest of the world. But not only are my fellow Americans obese but they have all sorts of medical and physical complications as a result of their obesity.

Of course. Obesity is a huge huge hurdle for American society, moreso than probably any other nation on Earth right now.

That being said, I completely agree with you. Ignoring systemic and societal factors IS 100% naive and foolish. The food system in this country is horrendous and the medical establishment has been giving us the wrong information for years when it's come to diet.

This simply cannot be understated. One of the best examples of this is the faulty food-pyramid which fat consumption was discouraged, and carb-consumption was encouraged. This sky-rocketed obesity even more. There are quite literally too many examples to list. It's exhausting.

Though at the end of the day, personal choice trumps all and what we put into our collective fat mouths is ultimately a personal choice. And as others have mentioned in this thread, they know their choices are poor and they know they might be slightly overweight or in Log's case, "huggable."

You are conflating those who are overweight with those who are obese. There is a massive, massive difference between the two. Those who argue for obesity-acceptance make up a miniscule minority in the fat-acceptance movement, which at large argues for the expansion of the (predominately female) conception of the acceptable female figure.

All of this changes though, when we, you or I decide to have children because we are no longer living and making decisions for ourselves. Once we have children, we are instantly arbriters of what is good or bad for our children and if we have fat children, children whose metabolism allows them to burn through most everything you feed them, we are not doing a good job. Most fat kids are probably being fed complete garbage and if you're a "parent" who is feeding their child soda, candy, fast food, then, yes, you are a bad parent.

Unfortunately, having full agency and access to healthy diets and lifestyles and exercise routines across entire families is a privilege that most Americans simply will never possess.

Id' be more than interested in seeing these comparisons and how they affect some of the folks that have been part of the images I've posted in this thread...those folks that celebrate their fat even while knowing they are being unhealthy.

There is no scientific evidence from robust, longitudinal studies that show that the fat-acceptance movement has lead to spikes in obesity (and it is rather foolish to even think otherwise, out of pure logic). Feel free to try to prove otherwise.

What do other nations do? I think you're abroad right? How the weight issue in your home country?

They address systemic factors, undertake numerous actions to limit access to seriously harmful food whilst simultaneously providing most of their populations with the means of accessing fresh produce, non-processed foods, and the time/means for incorporating some activity into their sedentary lifestyles. There is a laundry list of actions that are not difficult to find.



Should fat acceptance be encouraged? Or met with science and information?

First off, again, you need to stop conflating obesity with 'overweight', because it shows a lack of intellectual sophistication in your arguments.

One is a medical condition. The second is a socially-constructed label. Fat acceptance isnt a movement enabling illness. It's a movement recognizing overweight as a loose term based on perpetuated and created societal standards of what 'proper weight' is deemed to be-- something which has had different definitions in the past (as One Brow mentioned) as they do now. And they will continue to change.

The ideals of those fighting for fat acceptance need to be encouraged while social determinants of obesity need to be encouraged as well. A two-pronged solution that will stop this crisis.
 
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