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RealGM: Is Quin Snyder’s offense a good fit for the Jazz or is it holding them back?

BabyPeterzz

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https://basketball.realgm.com/analysis/243762/Five-Question-Season-Preview-Northwest-Division

Entering year three of his tenure as Utah’s head coach, this is far and away the best roster Snyder has had at his disposal. The Jazz are virtually 15 deep when it comes to viable (and at least semi-proven) rotation players. The addition of George Hill this offseason has plugged a major hole at the point guard position. With such a stocked cupboard, this should be Snyder’s first year helming a team that finishes in the top half of the NBA in offensive efficiency.

But the offensive scheme Snyder relies on is one of the more unique systems in the league. The Jazz play at a snail’s pace -- they’ve finished last in the league in both of Snyder’s seasons -- and have a huge variety of plays containing multiple reads and counters. Perhaps no team in the NBA has more mindless reversal passes and non-penetrating dribble hand-offs in their base system. It’s those concepts that cause the Jazz to eat up so much of the shot clock every possession.

In general, Snyder’s offense relies very heavily on false action -- basically decoy movements that hide the possessions real goal. But what often happens during Utah’s offensive possessions is that this emphasis on shifting the defense before getting to the core element of the play leaves the team with precious little time on the shot clock to find good looks. By procrastinating so long before getting to the meaty part of their sets, the Jazz have little margin for error when it comes to avoiding tough, bailout shots.

Yet given these critiques of Snyder’s system, it’s hard to tell if it’s really all that limiting. For all the talent on the roster, there isn’t a single player who can run at a set defense and consistently create good looks. Rodney Hood, Gordon Hayward, Alec Burks and the newly acquired Joe Johnson are all, skilled versatile wings, but they’re not LeBron James. Hill represents a massive upgrade at point guard, but he is not Chris Paul.

Those players are all best suited for the role of second-side operators -- players that can successfully navigate a defense after some previous action has caused their opponent to be pulled out of position. And the team’s bigs, while improving their offensive skills, aren’t striking fear into the heart of opposing defenses when they post up, roll to the rim or spot up looking for open jumpers. That’s why, in theory, the endless dribble hand offs, ball swings and elbow touches may be necessary to generate good looks for this group.

Up to this point, that “theory” is essentially the only thing we’ve had to go on when critiquing Snyder’s offensive approach. Because in the first year of his tenure, Snyder took over a team in transition while his second season was undermined by the personnel limitations at a crucial NBA position (point guard). Those outside factors made it hard to truly evaluate if more could be done to boost Utah’s middling offensive production.

Even with Hayward out to start this upcoming season, there is now enough talent on this Jazz roster to get a better feel for the strengths and shortcomings of Snyder’s system. If Utah continues a steady climb up the offensive efficiency rankings, it should take the pressure off Snyder to change up his approach on that end of the floor. But if the Jazz fail to show improvement on offense this year, it could stall their efforts to establish themselves as bonafide contenders out West and start to raise serious questions about Snyder’s approach.

Some here have been critical of Q's offense (franklin), and for good reason IMO. We're slow as ****, and rely on multiple reads to get the desired shot. Its a complicated offense and we see saw the team stagnate on O often last season. But we've made some upgrades, specifically at PG, so maybe we'll see a more free flowing offense?

Is it Quin's offense that's an issue or is it personnel? Did we address it properly this off-season?
 
the article ended on saying that this season will answer a lot of the questions regarding Q's offence and whether it's the proper offence given the talent of the squad-- and i think the writer is correct in saying that.

It's hard to critique the visual appeal & effectiveness of an offence given injuries + Quin probably having to work with the worst stable of PGs of any NBA team over the last five years
 
If Gobert and Exum didn't give Snyder a direction to play the Jazz would have been in trouble because of Snyders slo-mo offense.We saw too many examples of not being able to get baskets at the end of games because of passes doing nothing but burning clock.
If Exum is the future PG ,then his speed and PG skillz are wasted playing slo-mo ball ,they need to use their speed and young legs.
 
Good article and some valid points. Didn't the Jazz try to practice with a 14/second clock? We'll see if that translates into a faster pace. With the youth and depth the team has, and the altitude factor at home, Utah SHOULD be playing at a very fast pace. Get opponents doing Exum impressions: hands on hips, tongue hanging out.
 
Good article and some valid points. Didn't the Jazz try to practice with a 14/second clock? We'll see if that translates into a faster pace. With the youth and depth the team has, and the altitude factor at home, Utah SHOULD be playing at a very fast pace. Get opponents doing Exum impressions: hands on hips, tongue hanging out.

Yes, there were some practices with a 14 second clock. According to some reports at least. I don't expect the Jazz to be a "very fast" paced team under Snyder but hopefully they will improve to somewhere in the middle of the pack.
 
There is no correlation between pace and offensive efficiency. Playing a faster, more free flowing offense is just some BS cliche to keep fans excited. You need to play at the pace that fits your personnel. The Jazz had a 7'2 center, a PF that doesn't run the floor, and the worst PG situation in the league. Of course the Jazz are going to want to slow down the game. The system doesn't need a change, the players need to execute the system better.
 
https://basketball.realgm.com/analysis/243762/Five-Question-Season-Preview-Northwest-Division



Some here have been critical of Q's offense (franklin), and for good reason IMO. We're slow as ****, and rely on multiple reads to get the desired shot. Its a complicated offense and we see saw the team stagnate on O often last season. But we've made some upgrades, specifically at PG, so maybe we'll see a more free flowing offense?

Is it Quin's offense that's an issue or is it personnel? Did we address it properly this off-season?

I don't agree with the below. It's outdated.

But the offensive scheme Snyder relies on is one of the more unique systems in the league. The Jazz play at a snail’s pace -- they’ve finished last in the league in both of Snyder’s seasons -- and have a huge variety of plays containing multiple reads and counters. Perhaps no team in the NBA has more mindless reversal passes and non-penetrating dribble hand-offs in their base system. It’s those concepts that cause the Jazz to eat up so much of the shot clock every possession.

There was very little read-react in QS's system LAST SEASON. If this preseason is any indicator, Snyder is going to run a much more versatile, attack style, north-to-south offense. I think he feels he has the tools to up the tempo as we saw in the Phoenix game. They ran and ran and ran, daring the suns to outscore them.

The set offense is different as well. We don't have Trey Burke or Neto running the pnr. They are attacking now in pnr with a definitive difference in style. The guards go hard to the hole trying to draw both the switch and the guard, then passing instead of looking for their own shot. Gobert and Whithey have been getting to the line a ton as the weak side defender comes either on their back, to the side, or late in front of them. The guards have been getting throws as well. They are averaging a whopping 34 free throw attempts per game this off season compared to 23 last year. The difference is QS is putting the ball into the big's hands in traffic and forcing the defenders to put them on the line.

Teams have been countering that by sucking in the opposite side defenders and have also been giving the guards a step at times. I've seen a lot more wing threes instead of corner, as the weak side corner defender has to stay home but also attempt to cover the roll man, so the wing defender has to help defend (this is where the fouls are coming from).
 
jazz1_zpstrpzaoif.jpg


Here is similar to what I'm talking about. [MENTION=253]Saint Cy of JFC[/MENTION] mentioned the 4 out 1 in offense. This play started that way with Diaw as the in man and evolved into basically a 5 out offense.

--Notice how deep the ball handler gets. The dish is around the backside of both defenders.
--Question marks. The left defender cannot keep his eye on the ball and his man. He doesn't know if he needs to help on Rudy or cover his man. The other wind defender is equally confused as a reversal by the ball handler would lead to a wide open 3 by Diaw.
 
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I don't agree with the below. It's outdated.



There was very little read-react in QS's system LAST SEASON. If this preseason is any indicator, Snyder is going to run a much more versatile, attack style, north-to-south offense. I think he feels he has the tools to up the tempo as we saw in the Phoenix game. They ran and ran and ran, daring the suns to outscore them.

The set offense is different as well. We don't have Trey Burke or Neto running the pnr. They are attacking now in pnr with a definitive difference in style. The guards go hard to the hole trying to draw both the switch and the guard, then passing instead of looking for their own shot. Gobert and Whithey have been getting to the line a ton as the weak side defender comes either on their back, to the side, or late in front of them. The guards have been getting throws as well. They are averaging a whopping 34 free throw attempts per game this off season compared to 23 last year. The difference is QS is putting the ball into the big's hands in traffic and forcing the defenders to put them on the line.

Teams have been countering that by sucking in the opposite side defenders and have also been giving the guards a step at times. I've seen a lot more wing threes instead of corner, as the weak side corner defender has to stay home but also attempt to cover the roll man, so the wing defender has to help defend (this is where the fouls are coming from).

The offense has looked a little bit better, but I disagree with your analysis here. The Jazz run sets, they don't run set plays. The offense is heavily dependent on reads. I don't follow on your point about the FT's either. It's a 6 game sample size, half of the games are garbage time, preseason is always foul happy, and we had 53 FT's in one game that had a total of 106 FT's. Regardless, you made a statement that the Jazz are getting the bigs the ball in traffic. It's the opposite. The Jazz bigs are getting to line because they are open and putting the defense in a position where they have to foul. That's the difference, and I don't think it comes from systematic changes.

Rudy has gotten significantly better at setting screens and rolling, but he's also been playing a lot more with Boris Diaw. Diaw is making passes that Favors could not even dream of. It's the same offense, but it runs much better when you replace a bad passer with an elite one. Same idea holds for the PG position. George Hill is an obvious upgrade, and Mack/Exum are getting much better at getting to the rim than Neto/Burke. The system is no different, the personnel is different.
 
the article ended on saying that this season will answer a lot of the questions regarding Q's offence and whether it's the proper offence given the talent of the squad-- and i think the writer is correct in saying that.

It's hard to critique the visual appeal & effectiveness of an offence given injuries + Quin probably having to work with the worst stable of PGs of any NBA team over the last five years

Hey you, get off the fence
 
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