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Official Sign DeAndre Jordan Thread (Note from Jazzfanz: Thread not official)

GVC said:
and?

Also, the team rebounds better with Millsap on the court than with Big Al on the court, FWIW.
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And what?

I'm sure that .8% team defense rebound difference is HUGE. Gives the Jazz an extra rebound every, what, 3, 4 games?

And the team rebounds better offensively when Jefferson is on the court.
 
GVC said:
More missed shots to grab...
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Nope. Rebounding PERCENTAGE.

Stats say Millsap is a net negative (or even, for all intents and purposes) on and off the court, while Jefferson is a net positive.

EDIT: Need to notice the difference between a "-" and a "+." Sheesh. Jefferson is net negative, as well.
 
Darkwing Duck said:
Nope. Rebounding PERCENTAGE.

Stats say Millsap is a net negative (or even, for all intents and purposes) on and off the court, while Jefferson is a net positive.
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No they don't. How do you figure?

The Jazz offense is 3.4 points per 100 possessions better with Jefferson on than with Jefferson off the court. The Jazz defense is 7.2 points per 100 possessions worse with Jefferson on the court than with Jefferson off the court.

The Jazz offense is 4.2 points per 100 possessions better with Millsap on than with Millsap off the court. The Jazz defense is 2.o points per 100 possessions better with Millsap on the court than with Millsap off the court.

The Jazz, as a team, rebound better with Millsap on the court than with Jefferson on the court.

Adjusted +/- is hilariously in favor of Millsap.

Individual offensive efficiency is hilariously in favor of Millsap.

Again, Al has the better individual defensive stats (but, again, the Jazz as a team are terrible defensively with Big Al on the court, and, I'd say, with reason).

But, oh boy, the Jazz are slightly better grabbing offensive rebounds with Big Al on the court. He should get 48 minutes per game, while Millsap is dumped for Robin ****ing Lopez. Brilliant.

Edit: Whoops, the Jazz are actually better (v. their competition) grabbing offensive rebounds with Millsap on the court than Jefferson...
 
Archie Moses said:
lol this stuff is funny.
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That's kind of the point. Can't just throw the stats out there like most people are in this thread, especially me. They don't tell the whole story. I actually have no intention of giving my actual opinion on this thread, and it may actually surprise some of the posters.

Oh wait, maybe I just did give my opinion. HO ON!!! I mean, OH NO!!!
 
Darkwing Duck said:
That's kind of the point. Can't just throw the stats out there like most people are in this thread, especially me. They don't tell the whole story. I actually have no intention of giving my actual opinion on this thread, and it may actually surprise some of the posters.

Oh wait, maybe I just did give my opinion. HO ON!!! I mean, OH NO!!!
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Most people in this thread aren't throwing out any stats at all. Hell, they aren't even responding to the stats that are being posted. I've yet to hear how Big Al can be called an elite low post scorer, despite his mediocre numbers. Maybe Billy can enlighten me, like he's enlightened us all about CJ Miles.
 
GVC said:
No they don't. How do you figure?

The Jazz offense is 3.4 points per 100 possessions better with Jefferson on than with Jefferson off the court. The Jazz defense is 7.2 points per 100 possessions worse with Jefferson on the court than with Jefferson off the court.

The Jazz offense is 4.2 points per 100 possessions better with Millsap on than with Millsap off the court. The Jazz defense is 2.o points per 100 possessions better with Millsap on the court than with Millsap off the court.

The Jazz, as a team, rebound better with Millsap on the court than with Jefferson on the court.

Adjusted +/- is hilariously in favor of Millsap.

Individual offensive efficiency is hilariously in favor of Millsap.

Again, Al has the better individual defensive stats (but, again, the Jazz as a team are terrible defensively with Big Al on the court, and, I'd say, with reason).

But, oh boy, the Jazz are slightly better grabbing offensive rebounds with Big Al on the court. He should get 48 minutes per game, while Millsap is dumped for Robin ****ing Lopez. Brilliant.

Edit: Whoops, the Jazz are actually better (v. their competition) grabbing offensive rebounds with Millsap on the court than Jefferson...
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Now that's a bit better, except for the +/- crap.
 
Lance-A-Million said:
Over 400 million brain cells, 0 intelligence
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uh huh. Your contribution to this thread: Height is all that matters.

I've responded to that. You've yet to respond to the stats illustrating quite clearly how mediocre Big Al is operating in the low post. In fact, no one has. It's blind support for Big Al, and irrational hatred for Paul Millsap.

I'm still waiting for something, anything, substantive ("HE'S TALLER" doesn't count). I'm open minded and intelligent enough to change my mind if presented with compelling evidence, but non has surfaced.
 
GVC said:
Only, AGAIN, he didn't dominate. His true shooting in his best stretch was still a far cry from "domination", as I've pointed out before. It seems getting anything through your thick skull is near impossible. I'm not surprised you've yet to respond with anything substantive to my last few posts in this thread.

meh.
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And yet again your whole argument is TS% is the only stat of any consequence. We've already been down this road. Zach Randolph dominates in the post. He's 34th in TS%. Aldrige and Boozer take up 36 and 38 on the list. No one disputes that Al needs to get to the line more. But saying any power forward is or isn't dominant based on TS% is silly.
 
billyshelby said:
And yet again your whole argument is TS% is the only stat of any consequence. We've already been down this road. Zach Randolph dominates in the post. He's 34th in TS%. Aldrige and Boozer take up 36 and 38 on the list. No one disputes that Al needs to get to the line more. But saying any power forward is or isn't dominant based on TS% is silly.
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Did you miss my post about his postup numbers? Do you have anything substantive to add? Are you willing to concede that Big Al is NOT elite in the post, since all available evidence points to that conclusion? Do you have anything at all that supports your conclusion (like, maybe you think Big Al is a good passer out of double teams)?

Still waiting.
 
GVC said:
uh huh. Your contribution to this thread: Height is all that matters.

I've responded to that. You've yet to respond to the stats illustrating quite clearly how mediocre Big Al is operating in the low post. In fact, no one has. It's blind support for Big Al, and irrational hatred for Paul Millsap.

I'm still waiting for something, anything, substantive ("HE'S TALLER" doesn't count). I'm open minded and intelligent enough to change my mind if presented with compelling evidence, but non has surfaced.
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Um, no. Is it that hard to think conceptually for you? And why do you have this assumption I'm an Al Jefferson fan boy? I understand that he can be inefficient in the low post. That's easily visible to anyone. Conversely, Millsap's offensive efficiency is incredibly obvious as well. However, the way Millsap's lack of height can cause him problems on the defensive end, especially against larger front courts is equally as obvious. I've said so many times I'd love to see Millsap give it a go at the 3. But not at the 4 as a starter.

As far as stats are concerned, defense in the NBA is such a hard thing to quantify. Yeah, there are stats which try, but all of them are flawed. Which is why my judgement says the best thing is the trusty old eyeball test.
 
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