Playoff centers, the Jazz, and Fes
- Thread starter zman1527
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If both of those guys are there at 6 I would take Knight. But I wouldn't complain if we got Bismack at 6 in the least
Thee Jazz Fan
Well-Known Member
Ostertag was lazy, but the difference between him and fes is Ostetag played good defense. Ostertag new how to alter shots take up space. All Fes knows is to flail his armed around like a monkey and foul people.
Ostertag also seemed to care from time to time, at times he came up with a clutch rebound or block. When at the foul line and when the Jazz needed it most he often made both foul shots as a 50% career foul shooter. Simply put he had a higher work ethic and higher concentration. When will some of you realize Fes is compete wast of talent.
So you see there is a reason thoughs plYers you mentioned get mor playing time then Fes, they actually give a damn.
Not true. Asik and Fess have nothing in common other than being tall. Asik is very athletic and coordinated for his size. He knows how to challenge shots without fouling. He has basketball IQ. He has hands. Fess in a bumbling idiot who can only guard a player who relies on strength to dominate opponents.
Yes, I noticed how bad he was that last game he played against the Lakers. Bynum is such a chump, everyone stops him completely like Fes did.
Fes will never be a great basketball player. He IS an effective basketball player, the best big defender the jazz have by far (favors may change that). Those personal D stats that someone posted from Locke showed him with a rating near Dwight Howard's. Until someone better comes along, he should average 20 mpg.
And the playoffs are PROVING that a team can be very successful giving significant regular minutes to a center who plays D only.
Garsh, how was the Jazz playoff run this year? How was their interior D?
You are not coming from a position where you can be the *******. Your position is that it's everyone else's fault that a guy couldn't find minutes on good teams or bad and under two different coaches. That's absurd, chill out.
The brilliance of Locke's analysis is that it did NOTHING to take into consideration team defense. At all. None. You're attacking an argument I didn't make. Fes is a big dumb ox and he does well with his matchup, but so what? The game is so much more than one-on-one, and positionally, the position that matters least in one-on-one is the center position for the PRECISE reason you brought up this thread: centers in the modern NBA are schmucks when it comes to offense by-and-large.
You answer my charge that Fes is inconsistent by mentioning one game? AND you're going to get obnoxious with me and doing so with the implied point that Fes was the reason the Jazz didn't make the playoffs? Keep that **** coming, Auerbach.
If you want to look at the reason the Jazz had bad interior D, it's the opposite of the reason you think it is. Jefferson is a retard on team D (but he's good against his matchup) and he uses all the minutes. Plugging in Fesenko who's worse at that and that's not going to help. And even if it did, 20 mpg off the bench (and against bench players) is supposed to turn the team around?
Interior D is paramount to success in the league. Absolutely paramount. But Fes isn't even close to the answer. More importantly than all of that, you have to have a coaching staff that is dedicated to teaching, emphasizing it, scheming it, and finding a way to get the players to buy into it. I've seen little evidence the Jazz have the brains up-top to even implement the right players. Thibodeau has done a lot with little on four different teams now in that regard (on any of those teams, you will find half the roster wasn't considered a stopper individually). The Jazz haven't done **** on D since 2004, and it's not just the players. Defense is 5-players and a coaching staff.
Interior D is paramount to success in the league. Absolutely paramount. But Fes isn't even close to the answer. More importantly than all of that, you have to have a coaching staff that is dedicated to teaching, emphasizing it, scheming it, and finding a way to get the players to buy into it. I've seen little evidence the Jazz have the brains up-top to even implement the right players. Thibodeau has done a lot with little on four different teams now in that regard (on any of those teams, you will find half the roster wasn't considered a stopper individually). The Jazz haven't done **** on D since 2004, and it's not just the players. Defense is 5-players and a coaching staff.
We disagree. Fes plugs the lane and contributes to the team D that way. I think the team D gets much better with him in there. While you can argue with those D stats, it does not mean they have zero importance. I think they reflect reality. I do agree with you about jefferson. I am not sold on him at all and guess what, the D stats agreed: he was ranked about 168 if I remember.
Is Fes lack of PT why the Jazz did not make the playoffs? No, but he would have improved their chances. They just had too many other issues.
Is it puzzling that he does not get more PT? Yes, and as I stated above one can only guess. I think when you see them play Jefferson and Sap together you have to question just how important defense is to them. I suspect it is over emphasis on the offensive scheme and guys who fit that best, defense be damned. Remember the old quote from Sloan about starting a certain suspect player (Benoit?) was because "he got to the right spots on the floor"?
What I see when Fes gets significant minutes is a very positive impact. He should get more PT on a regular basis.
Zerol
Active Member
Gray plays for the Hornets, not the Bulls.
BENTLEY
Well-Known Member
I see the positives of having Fes on the court - at least half the time. The other half he's still really big. Fes is a bit of a tease since if we could just give him a brain transplant all that potential might be maximized. But at least he's got a big dumb body. For the right price I'd rather have that on the bench than Mutley (Jeffers).
But if we could put Jeffers head on Fes that would be a good player to have.
Anyone want to guess my take on this?
BENTLEY
Well-Known Member
I give up.
Gyp Rosetti
Banned
If you really care about him, you'll reach out to him, let him shack up with you in the Bay Area for the summer, stress to him and his agent that he needs to push hard for a Golden State signing, and then continue said partnership, all the while pushing him to his physical limits much like Apollo did for Rocky in preparation for Clubber Lang. That is, if you really cared about him.
I don't plan on living in the Bay Area by the time the season starts, so that would be pretty counter-productive.
Gyp Rosetti
Banned
I can only assume you're alluding to an Arizona move. If that's the case, push Phoenix. Jesus hack, think out of the box.
i totally angry, fes is certainly not the answer. He is so not agile to be a good defender. He just has a big body, nothing else
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
I will always believe Fes didn't get an opportunity more than he didn't deserve one. I don't doubt Fes' professionalism had something to do with it. But he was not the sort of player Jerry would play. We won't pick him up and I hope he does well wherever he goes.
Fes was given opportunities to play and sometimes he played well others not so much. I think the problem was he was out with a "problem" or just not ready to play all the time so it was hard to commit to him because he never committed to be ready to go every time he was called. I just don't think he has the attitude to be an NBA player. Agree that the Idea is correct. Fes just isn't the guy I would give the time 2. He has had 3 years to prove he can be just the player this tread is talking about. He hasn't done it. Time to go a different direction.
Me too buddy. Me too.