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Tough Day To Be In Law Enforcement

Great ideas and comments in this thread. But what are YOU going to do to change things? Has anyone here protested? Have you donated? How are you going to use your privilege for good, instead of just telling other what you think needs to happen?

All these ideas are great, but what are gonna do to affect change?


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It's a very quick sequence in the middle. The camera follows him briefly.

It casts a rather different light on "For all the white people saying to just shut up and listen, and for failing to distinguish between protest and riot, or to even suggest its offensive and silencing to even make such a distinction, how many of these individuals is it appropriate to sacrifice to make that voice heard?"

Does it? The violence and riot that people are seeing as being insensitive and tone-deaf to vocalize concern for aren't certain who's actually causing said violence, and their unspoken assumption is that it's the black communities themselves, hence we need to "listen" to them. So no, it doesn't matter if the individual(s) who killed this man is/are black or white because it's being painted with the same broad brush of "let's just listen."

There was no voice struggling to be heard hear, just some opportunistic ***
I'd argue that framing this guy's murderer as "just some opportunistic ***" would be very generous, if not insensitive, dismissive, and insulting.

It's an error to conflate rioting with looting, or even lump all the rioting together as the same thing. Much of the rioting is a response to the aggressive police tactics used during the protests. Such rioting is legitimate.
And what of what's being perceived as being condemned in these threads has condemned that?

I agree it's proper to condemn the unprovoked vandalism and the looting. However, when you make the category error of confusing a response to police tactics with unprovoked violence, then you naturally leave yourself open to being criticized about your opines on the former using language appropriate to the latter.
Again see above. What's actually being condemned? If someone's conflating those, who's doing it? Either people have condemned the things you're suggesting they shouldn't (or at least that you propose there may be more nuance available for) or people are interpreting certain condemnations as blanket condemnation on different actions.

BabyPeterzz had offered similar thoughts, stating that he was seeing too much finger pointing and judgment. I tried to ask for clarification if he saw finger pointing and judgment of protest. He would answer that question, and that's his prerogative, but if people are seeing others speaking against unprovoked violence and destruction and assume that they're condemning protestors, then the conflation of senseless violence with protest belongs to them, and it may be something worth self-examination for what it may highlight about their beliefs regarding these black communities.
 
Does it? The violence and riot that people are seeing as being insensitive and tone-deaf to vocalize concern for aren't certain who's actually causing said violence, and their unspoken assumption is that it's the black communities themselves, hence we need to "listen" to them. So no, it doesn't matter if the individual(s) who killed this man is/are black or white because it's being painted with the same broad brush of "let's just listen."


I'd argue that framing this guy's murderer as "just some opportunistic ***" would be very generous, if not insensitive, dismissive, and insulting.


And what of what's being perceived as being condemned in these threads has condemned that?


Again see above. What's actually being condemned? If someone's conflating those, who's doing it? Either people have condemned the things you're suggesting they shouldn't (or at least that you propose their may be more nuance available for) or people are interpreting certain condemnations as blanket condemnation on different actions.

BabyPeterzz had offered similar thoughts, stating that he was seeing too much finger pointing and judgment. I tried to ask for clarification if he saw finger pointing and judgment of protest. He would answer that question, and that's his prerogative, but if people are seeing others speaking against unprovoked violence and destruction and assume that they're condemning protestors, then the conflation of senseless violence with protest belongs to them, and it may be something worth self-examination for what it may highlight about their beliefs regarding these black communities.

I think getting caught up in the details and trying to pick things apart so it can be better understood results in missing the point of this event.

It’s like a virus. Are you gonna get better by analyzing each symptom and taking meds for each one, not going to the hospital to get diagnosed and properly treated? No. You go to the doctor and do what’s needed to get better.

When I get specific questions about who’s condemning what, quite frankly it’s a waste of my time right now. It’s not where my head is at, and definitely not where the heads who are fighting for justice are at right now either.

I would answer all the questions you asked me, but honestly it’s not a conversation worth taking time from the real issues we’re facing.


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Great ideas and comments in this thread. But what are YOU going to do to change things? Has anyone here protested? Have you donated? How are you going to use your privilege for good, instead of just telling other what you think needs to happen?

All these ideas are great, but what are gonna do to affect change?


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What have you personally done?
 
I think getting caught up in the details and trying to pick things apart so it can be better understood results in missing the point of this event.

L oh ****ing L dude. I know you mean well but if you want actual realistic and measurable change you cant base your decisions off your feelings and gut instinct. You need measurable data and facts to help correct the real issues which you get from breaking down the details.
 
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I think getting caught up in the details and trying to pick things apart so it can be better understood results in missing the point of this event.

It’s like a virus. Are you gonna get better by analyzing each symptom and taking meds for each one, not going to the hospital to get diagnosed and properly treated? No. You go to the doctor and do what’s needed to get better.

When I get specific questions about who’s condemning what, quite frankly it’s a waste of my time right now. It’s not where my head is at, and definitely not where the heads who are fighting for justice are at right now either.

I would answer all the questions you asked me, but honestly it’s not a conversation worth taking time from the real issues we’re facing.


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And that's fine. But when your premise is that people are condemning protestors, it may be worth wondering if anyone has condemned or been judgmental of protestors (they haven't -- you're literally witnessing something that everyone supports) and if conflating condemnation of senseless violence and destruction (against the black communities) are one-in-the-same. This may not be something that you feel is on your mind, but it's on your mind enough to be distressed about seeing what you perceive as judgment and condemnation.

But if you're not wanting to engage that idea with other things on your mind, I'm fine with no further engagement.
 
What have you personally done?

Protested, again tonight. I chose my job specifically to help address these issues. It’s my life’s passion. My work will be immersed in this now. I’ve donated, talked to my black friends and colleagues. Talking to my white friends and encouraging exactly what I’ve been posting on this site for years now.

Always listening, trying to understand my place in all this and standing ready to speak out and act appropriately.


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Protested, again tonight. I chose my job specifically to help address these issues. It’s my life’s passion. My work will be immersed in this now. I’ve donated, talked to my black friends and colleagues. Talking to my white friends and encouraging exactly what I’ve been posting on this site for years now.

Always listening, trying to understand my place in all this and standing ready to speak out and act appropriately.


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Personally, I want to go to a protest on Saturday in the town in which I teach but I’m very hesitant because of corona. The town has the most Covid cases and deaths of any city in the county and I’ve had a bunch of students who’ve had family members die. It’s a city where everything is close together like NYC and the notion of contracting it there scares me.
 
And that's fine. But when your premise is that people are condemning protestors, it may be worth wondering if anyone has condemned or been judgmental of protestors (they haven't -- you're literally witnessing something that everyone supports) and if conflating condemnation of senseless violence and destruction (against the black communities) are one-in-the-same. This may not be something that you feel is on your mind, but it's on your mind enough to be distressed about seeing what you perceive as judgment and condemnation.

But if you're not wanting to engage that idea with other things on your mind, I'm fine with no further engagement.

Again, it doesn’t really matter man. If you want to spend your brain power trying to split hairs and condemning whoever doesn’t protest the way you like is your thing. I will continue to encourage you increase your altitude and start looking at this as a whole. Your condemnation of anyone right now is kinda disingenuous and frankly, self-centered.

I know I’m coming off like a dick right now, but I’m tired of pulling punches to make white dudes feel better about they’re biased, white-washed opinions.


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Personally, I want to go to a protest on Saturday in the town in which I teach but I’m very hesitant because of corona. The town has the most Covid cases and deaths of any city in the county and I’ve had a bunch of students who’ve had family members die. It’s a city where everything is close together like NYC and the notion of contracting it there scares me.

The COVID stuff scares me while I’m out there. I’m definitely marching with space. You can do it though, but it will take courage. I hope you go!


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