Hmmmm you don’t say?

[KqWIN]

I Don't think people are upset, I'm certainly not, it's just wacky to hear this from a head coach, and in combination with the other quotes from Quin.

You would think he would be talking about consistent effort, continual improvement and refinement, about the learning process, and how we are preparing for the post season.

I'm guessing it's not what he meant, but he gives the impression that he doesn't care if his players give good effort during the regular season, and that they can just slack off until the post season.

Even if that's exactly what he meant, I don't see a problem with it. There are many teams that are open about not caring about the RS....and those teams are all title contenders. Consistent effort in the RS means nothing when you're in a playoff series. At best you get HCA which can be taken back in one game. But the contenders are more focused on saving their legs. Not caring about RS is the correct path to go so I'm not alarmed when coaches are open about it.

To be clear, it's not a good thing that we have this animosity going in the locker room. It's better when there's a collective "we're coasting"....if that team is actually good enough to do so at least. But the Jazz do have some work to do and sometimes adversity is the only way things get better. Let's say Rudy never had covid. We probably win 3 of the 4 of the games and are 19-4 in the last 23 games. Pretty damn good....but if that's what happened, we probably wouldn't talking about the defense right now. It would have been ignored because they Jazz would have kept winning the same way they have been. So while it's not good that our defense is ****, it's good that our defense being **** has become the biggest story around this team and has taken a life on it's own.

After the DEN series we all knew our defense was terrible. It was obvious, easily identifiable, and frustrating for a lot of us that it didn't get addressed during that off season. We were clinging our hopes onto freaking Miye Oni to save the day. But it didn't get talked about because the Jazz were the best team by a mile for most of the year. It didn't come up until it was too late and we were already eliminated. There's not way to hide from this problem right now. Maybe this is the thing that elevates the collective defensive effort , forces Quin to make adjustments, or gives stronger motivation for a trade. It could also blow up and lead to an earlier deconstruction of this team. All I know is that if things stayed the same way and we were winning with our bad habits we probably would be ignoring the very real issues that are being brought up right now.

 

[Hekate]

I Don't think people are upset, I'm certainly not, it's just wacky to hear this from a head coach, and in combination with the other quotes from Quin.

You would think he would be talking about consistent effort, continual improvement and refinement, about the learning process, and how we are preparing for the post season.

I'm guessing it's not what he meant, but he gives the impression that he doesn't care if his players give good effort during the regular season, and that they can just slack off until the post season.

He did say that his focus was getting this team play the right way at the right time

 

[KqWIN]

I think the media response has been good for us. I think most casual fans will still say "lol Rudy exposed in the playoffs", but it's gotten to a point where most Senior NBA Writers and media members understand what the real issues are with the Jazz defense. Maybe I'm just in my own bubble, but my twitter feed was all basically in agreement and laughing at the indirect shot at Mitchell.

One of the things that happened in Booker's career is that people hounded on him for not being a winning player for so long. These players care about their reputations and there's nothing wrong with that. Impossible to avoid. If Mitchell's reputation is at stake because of his defensive effort, that is a great thing for the Jazz. He's never faced the heat for his defense from the larger media cycle. I think he's still hanging onto some reputation from the draft and being an athletic player. But now that his defense is being put into the spotlight there's no hiding.

 

[SoberasHotRod]

Even if that's exactly what he meant, I don't see a problem with it. There are many teams that are open about not caring about the RS....and those teams are all title contenders. Consistent effort in the RS means nothing when you're in a playoff series. At best you get HCA which can be taken back in one game. But the contenders are more focused on saving their legs. Not caring about RS is the correct path to go so I'm not alarmed when coaches are open about it.

To be clear, it's not a good thing that we have this animosity going in the locker room. It's better when there's a collective "we're coasting"....if that team is actually good enough to do so at least. But the Jazz do have some work to do and sometimes adversity is the only way things get better. Let's say Rudy never had covid. We probably win 3 of the 4 of the games and are 19-4 in the last 23 games. Pretty damn good....but if that's what happened, we probably wouldn't talking about the defense right now. It would have been ignored because they Jazz would have kept winning the same way they have been. So while it's not good that our defense is ****, it's good that our defense being **** has become the biggest story around this team and has taken a life on it's own.

After the DEN series we all knew our defense was terrible. It was obvious, easily identifiable, and frustrating for a lot of us that it didn't get addressed during that off season. We were clinging our hopes onto freaking Miye Oni to save the day. But it didn't get talked about because the Jazz were the best team by a mile for most of the year. It didn't come up until it was too late and we were already eliminated. There's not way to hide from this problem right now. Maybe this is the thing that elevates the collective defensive effort , forces Quin to make adjustments, or gives stronger motivation for a trade. It could also blow up and lead to an earlier deconstruction of this team. All I know is that if things stayed the same way and we were winning with our bad habits we probably would be ignoring the very real issues that are being brought up right now.

I'm fine about not caring about the regular season, but that should look like expanded rotations, exploring different schemes, and resting players more frequently. We certainly haven't earned the right to be lazy. Our defensive habits are already bad enough, I'm not sure how a coach that is OK with coasting is going to improve those habits.

 

[KqWIN]

I'm fine about not caring about the regular season, but that should look like expanded rotations, exploring different schemes, and resting players more frequently. We certainly haven't earned the right to be lazy. Our defensive habits are already bad enough, I'm not sure how a coach that is OK with coasting is going to improve those habits.

Sure...I just think some people are acting like the world is burning down and they want Quin to agree with them. Truth is it doesn't really matter how they are playing right now. We are the same team whether for better or worse any differently despite dropping 4 straight. I would say the same after we ripped off 9-10 wins in a row or whatever it was. It just doesn't matter how our record is doing. Quin's hand may have been forced, but we did see different lineups and strategies and it's not always pretty. Ultimately it doesn't matter that much and it's good that we had this experience which Quin touched on as well. Maybe he'll be more willing to do this if saw the value of it.

Quite honestly, I think that quote is one of the most run of the mill things that almost every coach with championship aspirations has said one way or another....and that's because it's completely true. "Peaking at the right time" is one of the oldest tropes there is, heard it one million times. Experimenting/resting ect is a separate issue and this recent tension might be the thing that finally forces that. I think it's good that the issues are being brought up. It probably wouldn't have happened if Gobert didn't catch covid because we'd be winning with the same bad habits.

 

[oneye]

I think the media response has been good for us. I think most casual fans will still say "lol Rudy exposed in the playoffs", but it's gotten to a point where most Senior NBA Writers and media members understand what the real issues are with the Jazz defense. Maybe I'm just in my own bubble, but my twitter feed was all basically in agreement and laughing at the indirect shot at Mitchell.

One of the things that happened in Booker's career is that people hounded on him for not being a winning player for so long. These players care about their reputations and there's nothing wrong with that. Impossible to avoid. If Mitchell's reputation is at stake because of his defensive effort, that is a great thing for the Jazz. He's never faced the heat for his defense from the larger media cycle. I think he's still hanging onto some reputation from the draft and being an athletic player. But now that his defense is being put into the spotlight there's no hiding.

Some very “dunking on Gobert” accounts have had a far different tone over this stretch, basically finally giving Rudy credit and making fun of the Jazz perimeter defense. The truth is so blatantly obvious over this stretch even Rudy’s haters can’t ignore it.

 

[Jingled]

 

[Release the Kraken]

From the game summary on NBA.com (doesn’t appear that Mitchell had taken offense):

Gobert made his presence known when he returned to practice on Friday, and not just on the court. Gobert called out his team's play after watching five games, in particular what he saw as a lack of communication in games, habits that are more noticeable in the two top teams in the Western Conference.

"When I watch some of these other teams -- the (Phoenix) Suns, the (Golden State) Warriors -- those guys are a step ahead of us in terms of winning habits," he said. "I feel like they take every game personally. Devin Booker is playing his *** off defensively."

His comments drew a reaction from some teammates, and they weren't necessarily disagreeing with him.

"I think we all, as a group, find ways to hold each other accountable. That's just his way about it, I guess," Donovan Mitchell said. "I'm not really concerned about it. At the end of the day, we all find ways to get better. That's really it. We all have individual ways of doing it, and he just happens to be this way. So, cool."

 

[LogGrad98]

If he is also telling them this stuff to their faces, both good and bad, I can completely respect that. Even if he isn't talking to them openly about it, at least this kind of public reversal goes a long way to helping the cohesion of the team.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Imagine getting worked up that an NBA player is a diva, has a big head, or is trying to further his brand through PR that might not be reality.

A celebrity who became super rich young playing a game is full of himself and isn't always what he portrays in public?!!! What???

Trade everyone who isn't going to be with the Jazz forever! You can't leave us! You owe us everything since I occasionally go to games and sometimes buy subscriptions for entertainment that includes you.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I will say... the body language and interaction between the 2 is very promising. It was noticeable imo... I'm hoping both guys are pulling together now and they give us nothing to speculate on.

Maybe the absence of Rudy made Don realize he needs him. Rudy was super engaged on both ends... Jokic still does whatever he wants but Rudy frustrated him a couple times.

 

[fallenchicken]

I think this team does miss having a natural leader. It's not Ingles or Conley--they're vets, but too nice. Probably true for Mitchell as well. Rudy isn't nice, but the way he went about making his comments shows he doesn't have great instinct for it. Why couldn't he just say it straight that the perimeter defense needs to improve? Better if Rudy dropped the passive aggressiveness and just called guys out--in a not-personal, constructive way of course. Think the team would respond better. "The perimeter defense needs to improve. We need more effort." I don't think anyone would get offended by that. praising one of Mitchell's biggest rivals in the league is obvious and, if I was Mitchell, that would peeve me. I wouldn't want my teammate to play games like that in the media.

That being said, doesn't seem like it was a big deal.

 

[Hekate]

I think this team does miss having a natural leader. It's not Ingles or Conley--they're vets, but too nice. Probably true for Mitchell as well. Rudy isn't nice, but the way he went about making his comments shows he doesn't have great instinct for it. Why couldn't he just say it straight that the perimeter defense needs to improve? Better if Rudy dropped the passive aggressiveness and just called guys out--in a not-personal, constructive way of course. Think the team would respond better. "The perimeter defense needs to improve. We need more effort." I don't think anyone would get offended by that. praising one of Mitchell's biggest rivals in the league is obvious and, if I was Mitchell, that would peeve me. I wouldn't want my teammate to play games like that in the media.

That being said, doesn't seem like it was a big deal.

What makes you think he didn't say it in practice?

It wasn't like nobody knew what the problem was. It has been a focus for sometime and even the main culprits were admitting they need to play some defense. Going vanilla with stuff like "we need more effort" which has been told since the beginning of the season wasn't very effective anyways. Sometimes truths need to hit hard and what Gobert said wasn't even that hard.

 

[oneye]

I will say... the body language and interaction between the 2 is very promising. It was noticeable imo... I'm hoping both guys are pulling together now and they give us nothing to speculate on.

Maybe the absence of Rudy made Don realize he needs him. Rudy was super engaged on both ends... Jokic still does whatever he wants but Rudy frustrated him a couple times.

Lol, how many times are you going to hope the public showing is true lol? Yeah Donovan’s gonna pretend it’s all cool and fine in front of a camera, and give Rudy a Pat on the back….in front of the camera, because he has his image to protect. He can’t look like the problem or like he’s feeding into any of it. They both have their issues, I just tend to like Rudy more personally because he doesn’t wear the PR mask Donovan constantly does.

TLDR: Donovan and Rudy are good players that can play together and be good, but will never be great and win a title because they both have their shortcomings both on the court and off.

 

[oneye]

Imagine getting worked up that an NBA player is a diva, has a big head, or is trying to further his brand through PR that might not be reality.

A celebrity who became super rich young playing a game is full of himself and isn't always what he portrays in public?!!! What???

Trade everyone who isn't going to be with the Jazz forever! You can't leave us! You owe us everything since I occasionally go to games and sometimes buy subscriptions for entertainment that includes you.

Nice and good, but I’m not required to like a dude who’s actually a douche hiding being a PR screen.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Nice and good, but I’m not required to like a dude who’s actually a douche hiding being a PR screen.

No ****. You're not required to like any players. Its very amusing to read your posts though. This version of you is slightly more amusing than you two years ago posting a million love threads to Mitchell. Did you remember to wish him happy birthday?

FYI, pretty much every NBA player is a douche and all of them are hiding behind some level of PR screen. I would hate to see you get your heart broken again.

 

[oneye]

No ****. You're not required to like any players. Its very amusing to read your posts though. This version of you is slightly more amusing than you two years ago posting a million love threads to Mitchell. Did you remember to wish him happy birthday?

FYI, pretty much every NBA player is a douche and all of them are hiding behind some level of PR screen. I would hate to see you get your heart broken again.

There’s levels to douchiness. If someone just a douche that’s fine. And you’re right most are, but there are levels to how far you go to prove you’re something you’re not. Good discussion sweety.

 

[Ron Mexico]

There’s levels to douchiness. If someone just a douche that’s fine. And you’re right most are, but there are levels to how far you go to prove you’re something you’re not. Good discussion sweety.

Just looking out for ya, little buddy. Its hard to see someone get their heart broken like you, when it doesnt need to happen. Its okay, you got attached right away to him. It was kinda cute in a, he should have got a restraining order right away, kind of way. Its even harder to watch someone turn into a bitter, angry, jealous person who got dumped and thinks they are owed something. At least you have a new shtick as a troll who endlessly hates on him instead of loves him. Maybe try to find some reasonable middle ground? It doesnt have to be one of the extremes.

No one wants to watch this again with you.

At least you will always have the record for most threads created about Mitchell for the rest of his life.

 

[oneye]

Just looking out for ya, little buddy. Its hard to see someone get their heart broken like you, when it doesnt need to happen. Its okay, you got attached right away to him. It was kinda cute in a, he should have got a restraining order right away, kind of way. Its even harder to watch someone turn into a bitter, angry, jealous person who got dumped and thinks they are owed something. At least you have a new shtick as a troll who endlessly hates on him instead of loves him. Maybe try to find some reasonable middle ground? It doesnt have to be one of the extremes.

No one wants to watch this again with you.

At least you will always have the record for most threads created about Mitchell for the rest of his life.

I just want the dude off the team bud, for plenty of reasons, and his value ain’t getting higher than it is currently.

 

[LogGrad98]

It cracks me up how much traction a "rumor" like Mitchell wanting a bigger market can get. Nothing was ever even confirmed, it was nearly pure conjecture and smacked of a guy asking somebody that knows DM "hey your guy wants to play in NY some day right? Maybe Miami?" and the guys says "yeah sure, I guess" then turning around and reporting it like a scoop. But I have read so so many "rumors" and trade ideas lately that start with some version of "Mitchell wants out of Utah, so here is how he can come to [team X]", followed by ridiculously one-sided "trades" to get him here. One of them has him going to Philly for Simmons and Harris, but of course also with the Jazz giving up Bojan, Ingles, O'Neale and/or JC and picks. Yeah we are gutting our team and destroying our team identity to get Harris and Simmons. Saw another one that had us sending Mitchell, Bogey, Ingles and JC to Miami for a combination of no-names and Herro as the big draw. Absolutely hilarious how these guys approach this kind of ****. So stupid.