What's new

Longest Thread Ever

"Well of course there should be a way you can find your answer to this question. If God exists as I believe He does, I believe He has a duty, an actual obligation to let you know as well as anyone else can possibly know such a thing.

All I ever did was make a choice to be open to knowing. Well, if you just choose to care about this, God will find a way to reach you. Who knows when, but when for whatever reason it could happen, you'll find the belief settled in your heart.

Yes.. however, this only works if you have an inquiring mind and is patient enough to wait for "God to reach you". What I'm after is something more.

See, most people go through life, mostly thinking about the "self". What should I eat? What should I wear? How do I look in front of others? What TV shows to watch tonight?

So I guess what I'm after is a question, or a statement that will "eat away at them" as they ponder the question deeper and deeper. Something that ultimately helps them to reach the conclusion that the most obvious answer, is that God exists and he loves us.
 
Interesting thought.

That line I wrote. . . . about being afraid that if God showed up, Freedom would be out the door. . . . has been bothering me.

OK. Let me try again.

God would not take away your "Freedom" like I imagine some might expect. What I meant was that you would not really be "free" to deny His existence on a claimed factual basis.. . .. .

hmmmmm. . .. well, people can apparently be infinitely "nutty". . . . . I shouldn't even say that. God could appear to some with proofs involving every sense, and every correlation to every know fact in their possession, and the human mind could still invent denials of His existence.

Yep, No way is God gonna destroy human freedom.
 
^^^Agree, some "scientists" would explain away any and all "miracles" as magic tricks or simply use of scientific principles. Others would claim "God" was an alien come to dominate Earth. No doubt weapons would be used in an attempt to destroy Him.
 
That line I wrote. . . . about being afraid that if God showed up, Freedom would be out the door. . . . has been bothering me.

OK. Let me try again.

God would not take away your "Freedom" like I imagine some might expect. What I meant was that you would not really be "free" to deny His existence on a claimed factual basis.. . .. .

hmmmmm. . .. well, people can apparently be infinitely "nutty". . . . . I shouldn't even say that. God could appear to some with proofs involving every sense, and every correlation to every know fact in their possession, and the human mind could still invent denials of His existence.

Yep, No way is God gonna destroy human freedom.

If you think of freedom in terms of "Will." When God showed up your will would align with His. Alignment, being one with God, doesn't mean loss of freedom.
 
If you think of freedom in terms of "Will." When God showed up your will would align with His. Alignment, being one with God, doesn't mean loss of freedom.

OK, then if what you're saying is correct - why doen't God show up more often? Why is it that only certain people were able to feel/experience the glory of God? Why does he make it ambiguous for the rest of us?
 
I don't believe Science and God are mutually exclusive. If God is omniscient, doesn't that mean he knows and understands all physical laws? When he exercises his power, would he do that by superseding natural laws or through physical processes and phenomenon, some of which we may understand and some which may be out of our grasp at this time? I guess the key for those who believe in God is discerning what is of God and what is merely a random act of nature or of our own doing.

"Science" is merely a description of how material or substance behave "within" this Universe. However, because God created the Universe itself, he is operating outside of those "natural laws" or "Physical constraints". He can roam both realms so to speak.



Going on a tangent...

When someone like One Brow says he's neither a believer, nor an atheist, but he is simply a "Free Thinker", it does make me wonder. Can we really "think through" everything and every situation? Is it not possible that there are things that are beyond human mind's comprehension?

How can we be so confident to think that there is no limits to what our mind can understand/visualize/theorize? I think the fact we can realize that our minds have limits is one of the greatest "gift" we have from our "Creator".
 
If you think of freedom in terms of "Will." When God showed up your will would align with His. Alignment, being one with God, doesn't mean loss of freedom.

of course not, because God is a little different for each person who believes and those who believe shape their God to fit their beliefs
 
in other news, I wonder what television provider #Carolinajazz uses. I'm hoping it's DISH so we can give him some #Hopper grief.
 
of course not, because God is a little different for each person who believes and those who believe shape their God to fit their beliefs
And when we finally meet God, we'll probably want to realign our beliefs to fit His. For some of us, that may require getting pretty bent out of our current shape.
 
I think it's amusing that we try to quantify God, and argue about what He is or whether He is. We haven't even figured out how to get along with each other, yet we think we can understand the logic and processes of an omniscient being?

Aight.

I'm not saying there is no merit in discussing it, or wanting to know. Or even believing one way or the other. I'm just saying it seems ridiculous to accept, with as little as we truly know, that we have the insight and information to make credible declarations.
 
As I am typing, my iTunes is playing (at random) Touch Me, by The Doors.

A quick sampling of the lyrics: C'mon, c'mon, c'mon, c'mon now touch me babe...

An interesting coincidence, considering the thread.
 
I think it's amusing that we try to quantify God, and argue about what He is or whether He is. We haven't even figured out how to get along with each other, yet we think we can understand the logic and processes of an omniscient being?

Aight.

I'm not saying there is no merit in discussing it, or wanting to know. Or even believing one way or the other. I'm just saying it seems ridiculous to accept, with as little as we truly know, that we have the insight and information to make credible declarations.

Hey - welcome to the thread & discussion at hand.

I can see it from your angle why you would think that. However, from my own experience, coming to know God had enabled me to fully understand and "get along" with other people.

Before becoming a Christian, all I knew was "me". How can I make myself happy? I tried to study as hard as I could, to get the best job that I could, to make as much money as I could. All I wanted was a comfortable life, for my self (and my family as well, but it hardly went beyond that). I never saw the point of "helping others". Don't get me wrong, I am a nice guy, nice enough to not cause conflict with others, but it never did go beyond that. I never did see the point of helping a homeless person, for example - as there is nothing for me to gain. I just don't have the "heart" for it. I'd flick past those "Extreme Makeover" shows and say to myself "What's the point?".

Fast forward a few years - I went to church for the first time with one of my friends out of interest. Somebody was speaking on stage and he said "You know, it's weird, but while most people wanted get rid of "suffering" in their lives, Christians have a habit of "running" towards those that are suffering and helping them. This made me think of all the charitable things Christian Organizations do in remote parts of the worlds and thinking "What compelled them to do those things"? That moment was the beginning of my walk to faith in Christ.

Fast forward again 1.5 year, which is where I am now. I've done the "Alpha Course" and researched into what Christ had done for us and the historical evidence supporting that. I've accepted Christ in my heart and have started praying. After some time, I've come to realize that God loved us enough to have created us, he is here with us each and everyday. Once we love God with all our hearts it has enabled me to understand the pain of others who are also living, breathing, trying to survive on this earth. And because God is our God, their pain is inherently "my pain". I do feel this deeply in my heart.

Now, I cannot walk past someone needing help on the street without helping them. If an old lady needed someone to talk to, my natural expression is to comfort her, help her, be her friend. Not out of pity, or politeness, or any selfish gains, but out of the realization that we are one, we are together, bounded by the love of God who had created us.

Some may question the existence of God. But one cannot deny the "Love" we feel when we truly connect with another human being. The Love of a mother is so tangible to me that it's ultimately what "Truth" is. When you experience that, you can't help but realize that - amongst all the chaos in the world and the suffering that exists, there is 1 Truth that is Love.

And I think that's what God had intended for us - to love one another as you love yourself.
 
Hey - welcome to the thread & discussion at hand.

I can see it from your angle why you would think that. However, from my own experience, coming to know God had enabled me to fully understand and "get along" with other people.

Before becoming a Christian, all I knew was "me". How can I make myself happy? I tried to study as hard as I could, to get the best job that I could, to make as much money as I could. All I wanted was a comfortable life, for my self (and my family as well, but it hardly went beyond that). I never saw the point of "helping others". Don't get me wrong, I am a nice guy, nice enough to not cause conflict with others, but it never did go beyond that. I never did see the point of helping a homeless person, for example - as there is nothing for me to gain. I just don't have the "heart" for it. I'd flick past those "Extreme Makeover" shows and say to myself "What's the point?".

Fast forward a few years - I went to church for the first time with one of my friends out of interest. Somebody was speaking on stage and he said "You know, it's weird, but while most people wanted get rid of "suffering" in their lives, Christians have a habit of "running" towards those that are suffering and helping them. This made me think of all the charitable things Christian Organizations do in remote parts of the worlds and thinking "What compelled them to do those things"? That moment was the beginning of my walk to faith in Christ.

Fast forward again 1.5 year, which is where I am now. I've done the "Alpha Course" and researched into what Christ had done for us and the historical evidence supporting that. I've accepted Christ in my heart and have started praying. After some time, I've come to realize that God loved us enough to have created us, he is here with us each and everyday. Once we love God with all our hearts it has enabled me to understand the pain of others who are also living, breathing, trying to survive on this earth. And because God is our God, their pain is inherently "my pain". I do feel this deeply in my heart.

Now, I cannot walk past someone needing help on the street without helping them. If an old lady needed someone to talk to, my natural expression is to comfort her, help her, be her friend. Not out of pity, or politeness, or any selfish gains, but out of the realization that we are one, we are together, bounded by the love of God who had created us.

Some may question the existence of God. But one cannot deny the "Love" we feel when we truly connect with another human being. The Love of a mother is so tangible to me that it's ultimately what "Truth" is. When you experience that, you can't help but realize that - amongst all the chaos in the world and the suffering that exists, there is 1 Truth that is Love.

And I think that's what God had intended for us - to love one another as you love yourself.

I follow ya...

I believe in God. I have my own set of reasons, and I feel like I "know" whether or not He exists.

I think my statement had more to do with the futility of arguing about the ability to prove the existence of God. It has not been proven, one way or the other. Knowing and being able to prove are completely different things.

In the few thousand years that we have been acquiring knowledge, we have discovered some pretty incredible things. But what we know is just a drop in the bucket. We understand the basic principles of science, but there is so much that is merely theory at this point. We have a very narrow perspective, and so trying to prove God within the parameters that we have is impossible. It makes me think of Monty Python and the Holy Grail, when they are trying to decide whether or not the woman is a witch. Eventually they decide that if she weighs the same as a duck, she's a witch. The logic is comical, but illustrates how mankind's ability to reason has increased as their knowledge has increased. We're still comparing woman and ducks, figuratively speaking. One day maybe we'll get there.

This is why faith is such an important aspect of the God question.
 
If you think of freedom in terms of "Will." When God showed up your will would align with His. Alignment, being one with God, doesn't mean loss of freedom.

The scriptures (Bible) say that a lot of people would rather be hidden under a mountain of rocks rather than have to face God. . . ..

And, come to think carefully about it, I don't think it's God's choice to align your will to His. Maybe your choice, if that can happen at all. Presumes our being able to comprehend and reproduce the "will" of God. . . . .
 
I see a lot of substantial posts above that I want to reply to, I just have to get some sleep tonight so I can drive all day tomorrow. . . .
 
I follow ya...

I believe in God. I have my own set of reasons, and I feel like I "know" whether or not He exists.

I think my statement had more to do with the futility of arguing about the ability to prove the existence of God. It has not been proven, one way or the other. Knowing and being able to prove are completely different things.

In the few thousand years that we have been acquiring knowledge, we have discovered some pretty incredible things. But what we know is just a drop in the bucket. We understand the basic principles of science, but there is so much that is merely theory at this point. We have a very narrow perspective, and so trying to prove God within the parameters that we have is impossible. It makes me think of Monty Python and the Holy Grail, when they are trying to decide whether or not the woman is a witch. Eventually they decide that if she weighs the same as a duck, she's a witch. The logic is comical, but illustrates how mankind's ability to reason has increased as their knowledge has increased. We're still comparing woman and ducks, figuratively speaking. One day maybe we'll get there.

This is why faith is such an important aspect of the God question.

well said

faith is important, including faith in mankind and faith in the future
as I see it, whether or not that has to include faith in God the creator, God the supreme being, and/or or some other view of God is more of a matter of personal choice
 
well said

faith is important, including faith in mankind and faith in the future
as I see it, whether or not that has to include faith in God the creator, God the supreme being, and/or or some other view of God is more of a matter of personal choice

I agree. I act on faith when I roll outta bed in the morning. Gotta be something worth doing.

Or at the very least I can run up the count on the LTE.
 
Top