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Hayward & Jazz - not close to agreement (Hayward leaving 4/40 on the table)

Stoked said:
Got to love how fast some are turning on Hayward.
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I am not turning on him. I have always believed that 4/40 was more than fair. We need to do what is best for the organization rather than keeping a guy who might be a fan favorite at any cost. If he doesn't want to accept 4/40, we should explore trades.
 
Sneakers said:
When it came out that he was hardballing us for more than what Favors made... man... wasn't I arguing with you literally earlier that night saying we should pay Hayward and be done with it? We don't like having the screwz put to us
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This. Would rep but I ran out.
 
Stoked said:
Got to love how fast some are turning on Hayward.
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My position regarding GH is consistent. Im not sold on him. I don't think he has that killer instinct. TOnight showed what I fear about him. Those shots that he missed and how he missed them are complete ****ing garbage.
 
guys most of you put his avg ppg between 16-18

Do you not understand how averages work?

We all know he will have big games when he will score 20 something pts so it stands to reason there will be games when he scores less than average. Also he didn't even play 30 minutes sure he got into some foul trouble but he was trying to slow down Durant for christs sake.
 
I've said it 100 times. I'll say it again. Anything over 10 mill is a no go with Hayward. He is over-rated here.

I posted a bunch over the summer about how if I were Utah and Favors was averaging 15 pts a night and 12 rebs but shooting 46%, I'd trade him.

Same goes for Hayward. I love him at 8 per. I trade him at 11 per. He isn't good enough to carry a team. Tonight showed that. All preseason showed that. Last season showed that. He just isn't good enough. He can't handle the ball well enough to take a team and carry them offensively. Heck, I'd take Korver at 4 million than Hayward at 11.

Anyhow, Hayward showed us again, who he is. A nice player that can't carry a team. Favors, on the other hand, he looked a lot better than I could have hoped for. His passing was shockingly impressive.
 
VINYLONE said:
My position regarding GH is consistent. Im not sold on him. I don't think he has that killer instinct. TOnight showed what I fear about him. Those shots that he missed and how he missed them are complete ****ing garbage.
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I know it's a long season, but this is his fourth, and you have to be just a little concerned that in an exceptionally rare CONTRACT GAME that Hayward was not very good. He was what, the 4th best player on his own team tonight?

I guess my concern in this situation is that he thinks he's worth $50/4.
 
heyhey said:
guys most of you put his avg ppg between 16-18

Do you not understand how averages work?

We all know he will have big games when he will score 20 something pts so it stands to reason there will be games when he scores less than average. Also he didn't even play 30 minutes sure he got into some foul trouble but he was trying to slow down Durant for christs sake.
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Do you understand how percentages work? Go check out Hayward's shooting percentage for the entire preseason and also the first game of the season...then come back and report your findings. Thanks.
 
Okay, I don't post her very much. But can someone answer this for me: It happens in every sport. Why is that little extra money SO important to people? Like in baseball, you will win the World Series with a team, become best friends with teammates, become part of the local community etc. But then some team offers you an extra dollar and it's:

"Okay i'm outta here! You guys obviously didn't want me very much."

I mean WTF? Hayward will not be loved in any other city close to how he is loved here. He knows that the more money he makes the less we can give to other players. To make the TEAM better. After saying he wants to stay here forever, he's going to leave $10 million on the table for what? $11 million? Is there a huge difference in the two? This always bugged me in sports.

I like to think I wouldn't be that way. If I'm able to get millions of dollars for playing with a ball, I'm not going to try to squeeze every single million out of it. I'd rather win championships, and stay in one place. You won't exactly be strapped for cash.
 
Agree with most of what you are saying except "Hayward will not be loved in any other city close to how he is loved here".

In Indiana he is loved and would be loved every bit as much. but I agree with the rest.
 
Here is why you don't pay Hayward on potential:

You can only keep Hayward or Burks. Not both. Burks had 24, 6, and 6 last night. What if you extend Hayward now and Burks blows up? Offer Hayward 8 per. It's fair. If he says no, that's ok. By the end of the year, we will have a great idea of who we want to start at the 2 for this team. Don't rush it if you don't have to. Jazz hold all the leverage here.
 
green said:
Here is why you don't pay Hayward on potential:

You can only keep Hayward or Burks. Not both. Burks had 24, 6, and 6 last night. What if you extend Hayward now and Burks blows up? Offer Hayward 8 per. It's fair. If he says no, that's ok. By the end of the year, we will have a great idea of who we want to start at the 2 for this team. Don't rush it if you don't have to. Jazz hold all the leverage here.
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Not necessarily. It depends on how Burke and Kanter pan out. If they all pan out you can only keep 2-3 of those 4. If only 1-2 really explode you could keep all 4.
 
Stoked said:
Not necessarily. It depends on how Burke and Kanter pan out. If they all pan out you can only keep 2-3 of those 4. If only 1-2 really explode you could keep all 4.
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Keeping all 4 of them is not going to be terribly hard if we don't have any more young guys that deserve contracts. It gets tough when Burke blows up, then Wiggins or Jabari blow up, and then in 2017, when we get some kid with the warriors pick after they net us the top overall pick.

Just sign Hayward, Burks and Kanter to market value contracts, then they are all still tradable.
 
Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 21m
Gordon Hayward and Jazz have until midnight EST to agree on extension, but sides still have a long way to go for a deal, sources tell Yahoo.

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 17m
Nevertheless, there's often major movement near deal deadlines. The Jazz-Hayward talks will likely go down to the final hours tonight.
 
Seems like he now is leaving Derrick Favors money on the table. I think they should let him become a restricted free agent and let the market decide. He shouldn't be paid like an all star (since he isn't one yet). I would not exceed 4 years/ $46m
 
Favors was maybe overpaid...slightly. Maybe. At the time.

Hayward wanting Favors money is DRASTICALLY overpaying him, in hopes he grows into the contract. Huge difference.

If Hayward wants more than 8, let him play it out. His numbers aren't going to get better because of one of two reasons:

1 - His numbers stay the same, but he is less efficient. This is if he/the Jazz decide he is the number 1 option.

2 - His numbers stay the same, because he is used correctly (3rd option).

Either way, he isn't going to get much better, and if he pans out as an 8 per guy, then no one will toss money at him because they know they will have to overpay a nice role player to have the Jazz not match.

Like I said, I'd take Korver at 4 million before I'd take Hayward at 11.
 
This whole Hayward situation reminds me of Millsap. A very nice player who can do good things. That being said, I'd rather have Landry at 4 million than Millsap at 8.
 
It really is a shame how this is panning out. I wonder if this is Hayward's call, or his Dad's call, or the Agent's call (to hold out for extra money).
 
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