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Roster Building From Here - FA and Summer of 2023

infection said:
That'd be great. That pick becomes quite valuable. I don't want Poole as a piece on a contending team, but next year we're trying to compete and he's a perfectly fine guy to field a competitive roster that's in the playoffs. People looking at him that way will change the taste from seeing him on a team that's supposedly defending the title. You'll have a year shaved off his deal and with 3 years left, he becomes the salary matching you use to "trade for a star." Hell, maybe the following year when you trader him for a star, it's that GSW pick that's a big part of the asset package.

Especially if you consolidate with sending Sexton out.
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I'm not in love with it and a few things I thought about since posting. If the Warriors stay in the second apron territory then the pick could be end of the first round, but not sure when that little wrinkle starts. So that would suck. Would have to look at what the penalty is for super repeaters.

For them I am not sure they'd love getting Sexton... only peels like 10M off of their current issue... but for us it would have to happen. They'd likely prefer just KO. If we found another home for Sexton or they were willing to do it just for Sexton then I'd still kick the tires here.

Poole is young and does better as a starter. Long term I think the issue is he can't be worth his deal next to Klay and Steph. In another setting maybe he gets a little more serious as more is required of him or maybe it goes the other way and he sucks.

Because of the pick uncertainty I'd try to add some swaps in 2027 and 2029... and one way or another if Poole came in Sexton would have to be moved out. Its one that is interesting to me but then I start thinking through the follow up and have some reservations.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I'm not in love with it and a few things I thought about since posting. If the Warriors stay in the second apron territory then the pick could be end of the first round, but not sure when that little wrinkle starts. So that would suck. Would have to look at what the penalty is for super repeaters.

For them I am not sure they'd love getting Sexton... only peels like 10M off of their current issue... but for us it would have to happen. They'd likely prefer just KO. If we found another home for Sexton or they were willing to do it just for Sexton then I'd still kick the tires here.

Poole is young and does better as a starter. Long term I think the issue is he can't be worth his deal next to Klay and Steph. In another setting maybe he gets a little more serious as more is required of him or maybe it goes the other way and he sucks.

Because of the pick uncertainty I'd try to add some swaps in 2027 and 2029... and one way or another if Poole came in Sexton would have to be moved out. Its one that is interesting to me but then I start thinking through the follow up and have some reservations.
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May have to be a 2028 pick to avoid the draft second apron issue. Or you do reverse protections on a pick that starts in 2026 and runs to unprotected in 2028.

Here is what I think happens in GS. Either Dray opts out and leaves or opts out and takes like 3-4M less next year but adds 3 years to his deal. They will then offload Payton Jr. for no returning salary but may have to give a little something to do it. Also, Donte will walk. They will try to trade Poole very hard either way but if the returns are really bad they won't overpay to dump him and try to recoup value in season and then move him.

A smaller deal to consider is 28th pick this year for 19th pick and we absorb payton.
 
NUMBERICA said:
I think this upcoming season is going to be a(n) (other) transition season where the Jazz could/should be trying to win but still be looking for opportunities to stock up on future picks specifically. Young players would be fine, too, I’m just thinking that the Jazz should be banking proverbial cash for future moves. The later the picks are owed, the longer the “cash” is liquid. 2nd rounders count, too (which is where it would be easiest to store value since teams would understandably be reluctant to trade 1sts farther out). Protected (fake-ish, even) 1sts also count.

The ways that the Jazz might be positioned to dig out more assets is to cash in on (trade out) players that won’t likely be here in 3+ years (Clarkson S&T or sign and trade mid season, Sexton if you’re not a believer, Olynyk, maybe THT, Dunn could be useful filler in a trade) take on dead (one year) salary, flipping players, otherwise taking a calculated risk in rehabbing a player, or some combination of the above.

This is a long way of saying that acquiring Jordan Poole should be considered. I think he would be relatively easy to rehab value on during the regular season.
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Another thought I had this morning is “what is to be learned from the Jalen Brunson signing?” In other words, who are the pending free agents that conventional wisdom says that their recent flashes are not legit? And which of those MIGHT be legit?
 
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NUMBERICA said:
Another thought I had this morning is “what is to be learned from the Jaylen Brunson signing?” In other words, who are the pending free agents that conventional wisdom says that their recent flashes are not legit? And which of those MIGHT be legit?
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That’s the million $ question. You just never know
 
NUMBERICA said:
Another thought I had this morning is “what is to be learned from the Jalen Brunson signing?” In other words, who are the pending free agents that conventional wisdom says that their recent flashes are not legit? And which of those MIGHT be legit?
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I would just throw out that question to all potential second draft guys. Some times they show it, like Brunson, some times they don't like Lauri. Just off the top of my head without thinking, these are some guys who have some second draft potential and be a star or much improved on their next team:

Quickley - No explanation needed, tough to get
John Collins - If he has 10 working fingers, he is gettable
Reeves - Been amazing as of late, is it real?, FA could be interesting
Rui - Playing super well in the playoffs
Lonzo - If he can walk/play basketball, seems gettable
Simmons - If he wants to play basketball, very gettable
Brooks - already a thread on him
Coby White - Decent player in a toxic situation (Lauri v2?), RFA this summer who is gettable
PJ Washington - See Coby White
Gary Trent Jr - Can he get better?, will hit the FA this summer
Fultz - Actually had a decent season and has improved a lot, ORL might not have room for him
Tyus Jones - He's way better than people know, maybe gettable
Levert - Always overrated IMO but some like him, FA this summer

Anyone else worth mentioning?
 
KqWIN said:
I would just throw out that question to all potential second draft guys. Some times they show it, like Brunson, some times they don't like Lauri. Just off the top of my head without thinking, these are some guys who have some second draft potential and be a star or much improved on their next team:

Quickley - No explanation needed, tough to get
John Collins - If he has 10 working fingers, he is gettable
Reeves - Been amazing as of late, is it real?, FA could be interesting
Rui - Playing super well in the playoffs
Lonzo - If he can walk/play basketball, seems gettable
Simmons - If he wants to play basketball, very gettable
Brooks - already a thread on him
Coby White - Decent player in a toxic situation (Lauri v2?), RFA this summer who is gettable
PJ Washington - See Coby White
Gary Trent Jr - Can he get better?, will hit the FA this summer
Fultz - Actually had a decent season and has improved a lot, ORL might not have room for him
Tyus Jones - He's way better than people know, maybe gettable
Levert - Always overrated IMO but some like him, FA this summer

Anyone else worth mentioning?
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Decent list. I just wanna again state that I think the rewards on rolling dice on Lonzo (provided the price going out is negligible) could be huge. I will again state that he seems to be the largest single factor separating the Bulls from dark-horse contender and almost woeful dreck.
 
KqWIN said:
I would just throw out that question to all potential second draft guys. Some times they show it, like Brunson, some times they don't like Lauri. Just off the top of my head without thinking, these are some guys who have some second draft potential and be a star or much improved on their next team:

Quickley - No explanation needed, tough to get
John Collins - If he has 10 working fingers, he is gettable
Reeves - Been amazing as of late, is it real?, FA could be interesting
Rui - Playing super well in the playoffs
Lonzo - If he can walk/play basketball, seems gettable
Simmons - If he wants to play basketball, very gettable
Brooks - already a thread on him
Coby White - Decent player in a toxic situation (Lauri v2?), RFA this summer who is gettable
PJ Washington - See Coby White
Gary Trent Jr - Can he get better?, will hit the FA this summer
Fultz - Actually had a decent season and has improved a lot, ORL might not have room for him
Tyus Jones - He's way better than people know, maybe gettable
Levert - Always overrated IMO but some like him, FA this summer

Anyone else worth mentioning?
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I like a few... I hate a few... I'll add a few

Bruce Brown discussed earlier
Grant Williams - Not playing at all might be more useful as a specialist but I think his price has gone down a bit and might do better in a bigger role. Hardy also very familiar with him.
Derrick Jones Jr. - Youve mentioned him... he is one of my on/off splits guys... does the one block one steal per game thing. Shot seems better... low cost guy to play off the bench. Some how he is 25 years old still.
FVV might fit the description in that he's a guy you give 4/100M or more to and people freak out... then he actually looks better in a more normal basketball situation and you look super smart.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Decent list. I just wanna again state that I think the rewards on rolling dice on Lonzo (provided the price going out is negligible) could be huge. I will again state that he seems to be the largest single factor separating the Bulls from dark-horse contender and almost woeful dreck.
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If the cost is "they give us a bunch of ****" then I'd be okay. I just think he's cooked and his contract isn't ideal for creating an upside situation since it has a player option.
 
JB and Tatum both being supermax eligible gonna hammer the Celtics. Paying JB $50M a year staring in 24-25 means Williams gonna be let go... likely means another cut or trade of some salary by then. Going forward they will be paying like $110M for two guys... if they roll it forward. I think one is moved after they are both signed... at least at some point.
 
I'd feel rough giving Brown 50M+.

How do people feel about taking a gamble on Poole (I'm sure it's been discussed, but I'm lazy). I don't think they'd be willing to pay to get off him. I'm talking closer to straight into cap.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
JB and Tatum both being supermax eligible gonna hammer the Celtics. Paying JB $50M a year staring in 24-25 means Williams gonna be let go... likely means another cut or trade of some salary by then. Going forward they will be paying like $110M for two guys... if they roll it forward. I think one is moved after they are both signed... at least at some point.
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If the Celtics lose on the road today, maybe they would be more open to listening to offers for Brown.
 
Eminence said:
I'd feel rough giving Brown 50M+.

How do people feel about taking a gamble on Poole (I'm sure it's been discussed, but I'm lazy). I don't think they'd be willing to pay to get off him. I'm talking closer to straight into cap.
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They need to give something significant or its a not for me. I brought it up but there wasn't a ton of discussion on it.

I would feel wonderful paying Brown 50M... zero issue with that.
 
infection said:
How do you get him?
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Ko and #28? He is a FA at the end of the year. They can't extend him... he likely walks and they get nothing. They traded Melton last year so maybe they learned their lesson and won't move him... but guys only want to be the "best backup pg in the league" for so long. So if they don't think they are winning a title this year they may move him now to get some value.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Tyus Jones was straight dookie in teh PO this year. I like him, but I dont think I would give up assets for him.
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6 game sample and he just wasn't shooting well... was fine the year before last. I ain't saying give up the farm for him but **** ain't free man. Conley was dookie in the Dallas series last year and was good this year... it happens.
 
The pg position depends on what we do in the draft. If we draft Black or Wallace or get lucky and get Scoot or Amen... roll with Dunn as a starter and don't allocate much else to it unless something comes dirt cheap (like Wiz just salary dump Monte Morris or something). If not then I think you need to hunt for a pg in FA and trade. Would be nice if it was at least a medium term solution. I go back and forth on FVV but I guess if 4/110M works for him then I'd go that route. Even a guy like Tyus Jones likely cost about $20M on his next deal.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
6 game sample and he just wasn't shooting well... was fine the year before last. I ain't saying give up the farm for him but **** ain't free man. Conley was dookie in the Dallas series last year and was good this year... it happens.
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Conley is Conley.

Tyus Jones is a backup PG. He's a really good backup PG, but I'm not really excited about making him a starting PG.

I'd rather just roll with THT/Dunn/Sexton and see if any of them emerge.
 
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