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Game Thread Jul 09, 2024 07:00pm: Thunder Vs Jazz (Summer League)

Added to Calendar: 07-09-24

Handlogten's Heros said:
I think he displayed bad enough defense to get pulled from a summer league game. If you actually watched the game and came away with "wow look at Flip's passing" I am not sure what you were watching. He missed everything, he was horrific on defense, and he tried to do stuff with the ball a couple times and traveled. Its okay... it doesn't mean he's hopeless or a bad player but he was absolutely bad last night... its okay to say it.
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Yeah…If your thought was he showed passing and the defense wasn’t bad in the Gholke clip…I just have a time believing we both watched the same game. You’re leaving out some important details that must mean you didn’t watch the game.

Let me put it this way, if what you saw last night for Flip was encouraging you must have gone into the game think he completely sucked.
 
KqWIN said:
Yeah…If your thought was he showed passing and the defense wasn’t bad in the Gholke clip…I just have a time believing we both watched the same game. You’re leaving out some important details that must mean you didn’t watch the game.

Let me put it this way, if what you saw last night for Flip was encouraging you must have gone into the game think he completely sucked.
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I'm not really encouraged or discouraged by what has happened the last two games. He's who I thought he was, which is a good player with dynamic skills. 0/7 and some bad D moments in a SL doesn't really sway me either way.
 
for me in particular, especially as it relates to cody williams, i had him ranked the late 20s on my big board - i was on an island on jazzfanz and in terms of basically every draft expert in that opinion. so i'm watching these games hoping for signs that i completely missed on him, and instead i'm going all Dennis Green - he is who i thought he was - maybe even a little more negative now - i knew he wasn't explosive, but he's looked even slower and more grounded than i thought. so it's not about two games in summer league, it's a continuation of what i saw at CU. still hoping at some point this summer he shows some of the skills others saw that i didn't see.
 
seattlejazzfan said:
for me in particular, especially as it relates to cody williams, i had him ranked the late 20s on my big board - i was on an island on jazzfanz and in terms of basically every draft expert in that opinion. so i'm watching these games hoping for signs that i completely missed on him, and instead i'm going all Dennis Green - he is who i thought he was - maybe even a little more negative now - i knew he wasn't explosive, but he's looked even slower and more grounded than i thought. so it's not about two games in summer league, it's a continuation of what i saw at CU. still hoping at some point this summer he shows some of the skills others saw that i didn't see.
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I had him a bit higher, but I’m kind of in the same boat. I think he’s ok when he does stuff, particularly driving to the basket. And I think he’s shown those flashes but you can tell that physically he’s not ready.

OTOH, I was very concerned about his low motor and ability to impact the game with the length. “Comatose” was a word I used to describe him throughout the draft process, and we’ve gotten a lot of that. It’s not just the lack of scoring aggression, but the complete inability to use his length in other ways.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Williams has shown special ability on his finishes. Just has to get stronger and improve his body. Highly encouraged by what I've seen. The shot off the dribble looks more comfortable than I remember at Colorado.
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I like what I have seen. I think we always hope to have a Donny moment with the rookies but he has just played within himself and done fine. I think he needs a year or two to fill out but think he can do enough to get on the floor for 15 minutes a night and be playable. So I'm good.

Flip has had some nice passes but the rest has been really bad. The shot will fall (I hope). The defense last night would not only get him benched by Hardy but likely sent to the G for a month. He better at least figure out where to be if he is going to be slow.

He did have a couple deflections but that was stuff I knew he already had.
 
I wasn't a Cody guy basically at all, but I see why the Jazz went with him. I think he is gonna have a tough rookie year and I'm hoping his unusual maturity will help him weather through it and learn and that we'll start seeing returns in year 2.
 
I was not on the Cody bus after the NCAAs. CU barely beat a bad Boise State team in their first game despite having two first round picks. I think he spends a lot of the season with Coach Woj. The Jazz scouts saw something they liked.
 
KqWIN said:
1) Overreacting to SL is fun, we’re all going to do it. Most people who dismiss it (not you btw) are happy to overreact when it fits their narrative. I think we all know it’s not super meaningful.

2) There are some things to look for beyond make/miss, statistical production. You can look at how a guy stacks up physically and deals with bigger/better athletes, for example. And you can check in on certain things that you had your eye on in the draft process. We’re not going to be able to determine if Cody is a good shooter or not, but his low motor is something I was keeping an eye on and it was disappointing to see him ghost away in all aspects of the game.
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Like Lauri was early in his career, fall asleep in the corner. Cody needs the ball in his hands on the move, too much standing for someone that graceful, and get a man body like your bro.
 
jumpin bean said:
Like Lauri was early in his career, fall asleep in the corner. Cody needs the ball in his hands on the move, too much standing for someone that graceful, and get a man body like your bro.
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And he is not his brother but I like that Jalen and him seem really close and he can mentor him and help him understand what is required. I think they are different body types. Cody seems calm which is good but hopefully they force him into some actions.

Here is the other thing in this summer league. I think the coach might be bad… like several teams are just more organized and maybe it’s a point guard thing. Like 4 muffed inbounds plays and the turnovers in the backcourt may be the players or the prep may not be there.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
Just a friendly reminder that Summer League performance is not predictive of even a player's rookie season. It's good for rookies to get a taste of the speed, length, and physicality of the NBA, but for fans it should just be for fun. The highest leading scorer for last year's summer league was Orlando Robinson, who coincidentally was just cut by Miami. Brandon Miller shot 35% from the field and 26% from 3. I remember one of the guys who struggled the most was Lively. I was really high on him pre-draft, but he looked awful in summer league. Cason Wallace, GG Jackson, and Podz all averaged less than 10pts/game on horrible shooting splits.

2023 Summer League | Vegas | Player Stats | NBA.com

2023 Summer League | Vegas | Player Stats
www.nba.com www.nba.com

In General the Rookies:
- Have not played competitive basketball in months
- Are practicing AND playing on same days AND on back to back days
- Are playing with players and in systems they are unfamiliar with
- Are playing against players who are fighting for their NBA careers and that have 10 fouls to give.

The Summer League is good to see how a rookie moves, what skills look like they will translate in the NBA, and what general weaknesses they need to work on. In particular, if a rookie doesn't shoot well, I don't think it means much.
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friendly reminder last year hendricks was clueless we even had a thread that hes a bust. Look at him now. Rooks need time and they need real nba minutes.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
And he is not his brother but I like that Jalen and him seem really close and he can mentor him and help him understand what is required. I think they are different body types. Cody seems calm which is good but hopefully they force him into some actions.

Here is the other thing in this summer league. I think the coach might be bad… like several teams are just more organized and maybe it’s a point guard thing. Like 4 muffed inbounds plays and the turnovers in the backcourt may be the players or the prep may not be there
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He called a timeout on a game winning fastbreak vs memphis lol
 
BTW... whoever the coach of this SL team is(I don't even care to look for his name... cuz if they don't care, why should I?)... he should get some of the blame for what the team is showing too. This is two games in a row now with little to no organization in the game, little to no effort, little to no defensive intensity. We had such high hopes for this SL team because of the talent on the roster and the play has been atrocious in both games.
 
Agent#00 said:
friendly reminder last year hendricks was clueless we even had a thread that hes a bust. Look at him now. Rooks need time and they need real nba minutes.
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hendricks had 8 pts on 9 shots and only 5 rebs in 28 minutes in the first game. not sure he's the best example to use, but in principle you are right - these guys are young and need time.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
And he is not his brother but I like that Jalen and him seem really close and he can mentor him and help him understand what is required. I think they are different body types. Cody seems calm which is good but hopefully they force him into some actions.

Here is the other thing in this summer league. I think the coach might be bad… like several teams are just more organized and maybe it’s a point guard thing. Like 4 muffed inbounds plays and the turnovers in the backcourt may be the players or the prep may not be there.
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It seemed obvious in both games (and very obvious in the Thunder game) that we were way less prepared than the other team. My worry is that the players might have just been really slow to learn, but considering how widespread it was I'm kind of thinking it was just the coaching.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Williams has shown special ability on his finishes. Just has to get stronger and improve his body. Highly encouraged by what I've seen. The shot off the dribble looks more comfortable than I remember at Colorado.
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I’m looking for flashes. Summer league is a terrible setting to be making snap judgements on players ability levels. I’m happy enough with all 7 of the guys I was hoping to see something from (plus Lofton and Bazley).

I’m sure it’s subjective, but the guys that I feel like needed to flash something positive have done so - even when struggling.
 
For having such a "low motor," Williams seems pretty aware defensively, makes his rotations, and generally stays in front of his man. Defense is generally the best judge of effort.
 
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