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Game Thread Nov 03, 2025 05:30PM MT: Utah Jazz @ Boston Celtics

Added to Calendar: 11-03-25

Tanktastic said:
Reading this thread, one might think that no-one under 23 played at all.

Reality:
Keyonte 38
Flip 19
Ace 18
Clayton 16
Hendricks 14

Clayton got 8 of his minutes in the 4th Q and played the last 2 minutes.
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People see what they want to see. It's already an established narrative that Hardy doesn't want to tank "the right way" and is holding back the youngins from doing maximum damage. It's hard to change that perception when the vets are taking most of the shots. The minutes don't even matter that much.
 
Tremendous Upside said:
People see what they want to see. It's already an established narrative that Hardy doesn't want to tank "the right way" and is holding back the youngins from doing maximum damage. It's hard to change that perception when the vets are taking most of the shots. The minutes don't even matter that much.
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Yeah and people also quickly dismissed Austin Ainge's mic drop moment by saying "he is lying"... but they dont really realize that if a politician has a choice between "saving face and making the right decision", they always tend to choose "save face".
 
Tremendous Upside said:
People see what they want to see. It's already an established narrative that Hardy doesn't want to tank "the right way" and is holding back the youngins from doing maximum damage. It's hard to change that perception when the vets are taking most of the shots. The minutes don't even matter that much.
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Ehh, I think this is a combination of

1. Will Hardy has very little credibility with a lot of fans due to how terrible he is at coaching defense. Him finishing last in defense two years ago with Kris Dunn and Walker Kessler is frankly unbelievable.
2. The team has a relentless propaganda apparatus that is constantly hyping up guys way beyond what they should. The Jazz PR team OK'd Taylor Hendricks saying he wanted to be the best defender in the NBA so Hendricks being unable to defend at all this year is obviously going to be disappointing to people.
3. The idea that the Jazz traded away a 26 year old Hall of Famer with three years left on his contract to tank for three straight years and they ended up with a non-NBA player (Cody Williams), a guy who has some shot of sticking in the league but it doesn't look good (Taylor Hendricks), and a guy who has a 50/50 shot of being a good 4th option on offense and a very positive defender in 4 years (Ace Bailey) is not very pleasant and it's much nicer to blame the coach.
4. Ace is an absolutely terrible fit with Lauri (being an off-ball PF as well), and there was a lot of rationalization/propaganda that he could actually play SG/SF as well and this didn't mean the end of Lauri in Utah. But like...
 
GVC said:
Which is why reinforcing bad habits and play in general is a terrible idea. Unless the goal is to tank forever.
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You guys act if punishment is the only way to develop players. What about reps? And if you’re going to bench a player for bad habits, why must he be benched for a vet? If it was about accountability it wouldn’t not have taken this long to play Harkless. If you wanted to bench Brice, for example, why must Svi play? Why can that not be another young player?

Hardy has never had accountability for vets. I’m sorry, but I find this whole idea that he’s trying to punish the young players into playing better hilarious given his track record.

I’ve said this many times and I’ll say it again. Even with no pick involved, the right move is prioritize the young player development. Our guys need reps, they do not need a shock collar. There is no amount of benching Ace that will help him develop more than reps.
 
KqWIN said:
You guys act if punishment is the only way to develop players. What about reps? And if you’re going to bench a player for bad habits, why must he be benched for a vet? If it was about accountability it wouldn’t not have taken this long to play Harkless. If you wanted to bench Brice, for example, why must Svi play? Why can that not be another young player?

Hardy has never had accountability for vets. I’m sorry, but I find this whole idea that he’s trying to punish the young players into playing better hilarious given his track record.

I’ve said this many times and I’ll say it again. Even with no pick involved, the right move is prioritize the young player development. Our guys need reps, they do not need a shock collar. There is no amount of benching Ace that will help him develop more than reps.
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Being in a 20 point hole every night by mid-way through the 2nd quarter makes it hard to develop anyone.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Being in a 20 point hole every night by mid-way through the 2nd quarter makes it hard to develop anyone.
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It's also hard to develop without minutes. If you value minutes alongside good players in a more competitive situation, then this is an even greater argument to bench Svi because he plays the majority of his minutes with the best players on the team.

I prefer to give guys reps/opportunity. This is especially the case for guys like Ace and TH who really just need to learn how to play basketball. If opportunity isn't it and "accountability" is the way, then lets just send Ace to the GLeague and play Anderson instead.
 
KqWIN said:
It's also hard to develop without minutes. If you value minutes alongside good players in a more competitive situation, then this is an even greater argument to bench Svi because he plays the majority of his minutes with the best players on the team.

I prefer to give guys reps/opportunity. This is especially the case for guys like Ace and TH who really just need to learn how to play basketball. If opportunity isn't it and "accountability" is the way, then lets just send Ace to the GLeague and play Anderson instead.
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It's very tough because I just don't think Hendricks or Ace can play SG at all so I'm not sure they're developing there either. And I don't think Ace or Hendricks would benefit at all from the G-League either as the majority of their potential is on defense and no one defends in the G-League. Our roster is just very strange.

(Cody absolutely needs to go to the G-League to try to develop his offense)
 
You gotta win a few of these just to keep the guys from going full existential. Lose on purpose too long and it gets in your DNA.

I get the frustration seeing Nurkic out there closing. he’s not part of the long game and yeah, it hurts the tank. But I’m fine with Hardy sitting young guys when they screw up as long as there’s film, coaching, and they’re back out there next game. That’s how you learn. Leaving them in no matter what doesn’t teach anything, and sending them to the G-League right now just teaches them how to pack.
 
HadAnEffectHere said:
It's very tough because I just don't think Hendricks or Ace can play SG at all so I'm not sure they're developing there either. And I don't think Ace or Hendricks would benefit at all from the G-League either as the majority of their potential is on defense and no one defends in the G-League. Our roster is just very strange.

(Cody absolutely needs to go to the G-League to try to develop his offense)
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Meh...I couldn't care less about traditional position labels and that becomes more and more true every season.
 
KqWIN said:
You guys act if punishment is the only way to develop players. What about reps? And if you’re going to bench a player for bad habits, why must he be benched for a vet? If it was about accountability it wouldn’t not have taken this long to play Harkless. If you wanted to bench Brice, for example, why must Svi play? Why can that not be another young player?

Hardy has never had accountability for vets. I’m sorry, but I find this whole idea that he’s trying to punish the young players into playing better hilarious given his track record.

I’ve said this many times and I’ll say it again. Even with no pick involved, the right move is prioritize the young player development. Our guys need reps, they do not need a shock collar. There is no amount of benching Ace that will help him develop more than reps.
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JC had a hilarious leash. I agree there needs to be a mix of accountability and development/encouragement. Can't get lost on maximizing the team performance in any given night vs. the future of the team.

Also as a coach there are no perfect young players. All will have some flaws you live with if its a net positive or they bring other important things. The Svi thing is truly hilarious at this point.
 
KqWIN said:
It's also hard to develop without minutes. If you value minutes alongside good players in a more competitive situation, then this is an even greater argument to bench Svi because he plays the majority of his minutes with the best players on the team.

I prefer to give guys reps/opportunity. This is especially the case for guys like Ace and TH who really just need to learn how to play basketball. If opportunity isn't it and "accountability" is the way, then lets just send Ace to the GLeague and play Anderson instead.
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Ace is getting more minutes than he currently deserves. The fact that they want to ease him into NBA action is their way of approaching his development. Svi isnt there long term and I doubt thats unclear to anyone, himself included.

Some kids probably benefit from being thrown into the deep end but if that was somehow universally the best way to develop prospects then the NBA is full of idiots since this approach Hardy is taking isnt really all that rare. Fans love to "just add minutes to increase development", but I dont think thats how it goes.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
JC had a hilarious leash. I agree there needs to be a mix of accountability and development/encouragement. Can't get lost on maximizing the team performance in any given night vs. the future of the team.

Also as a coach there are no perfect young players. All will have some flaws you live with if its a net positive or they bring other important things. The Svi thing is truly hilarious at this point.
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Yeah, I can't take these "accountability" arguments seriously based on Hardy's past. We don't have to rehash those conversations. Reality is, Hardy is trying to win the game. He's playing the players he think will help him win the game. My problem with that is....why do we care about winning the game? If anyone truly believes that playing Svi benefits the young guys more than playing time would I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. But where was everyone crying about Svi not playing 82 games last season if that was the key to development? I seriously doubt this is some development masterplan and not Hardy just playing the guys he wants with a priority on winning first, developing second.
 
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HermanG said:
Ace is getting more minutes than he currently deserves. The fact that they want to ease him into NBA action is their way of approaching his development. Svi isnt there long term and I doubt thats unclear to anyone, himself included.

Some kids probably benefit from being thrown into the deep end but if that was somehow universally the best way to develop prospects then the NBA is full of idiots since this approach Hardy is taking isnt really all that rare. Fans love to "just add minutes to increase development", but I dont think thats how it goes.
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Exactly. Makes absolutely zero sense to use Ace as an example. Hardy hasn't even shown him the doghouse yet. He makes rookie mistakes, but as long as the effort’s there, he’ll keep getting reps.
 
Zombie said:
I dunno, I heard this exact thing after every win last season, and it didn’t turn out to be true.

We’ve played a pretty damn soft opening schedule to be honest- I don’t think we need to be worried yet.
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Umm. We had the worst record on account of a Washington buzzer-beater to close the season. By the skin of our collective teeth were the Jazz able to maintain their position. The Jazz were able to lose a lot of close games by sheer willpower to tank.

These stupid close wins against bad teams are absolutely a problem.
 
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