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2012 Election

KOC BEGONE said:
I'm not saying that exactly but the last civil liberties that were intruded on in a large way were during the bush administration and the who patriot act getting passed. I just hate people crying about the constitution acting like God himself wrote it.
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Haha nice.
There's plenty of people in this country that love the Constitution, but aren't even religious or believe in a God.
It's the one document in history that guarentees freedom and civil rights. Without it, most of us wouldn't even be here because our ancestors would've had no reason to immigrate here.
 
KOC BEGONE said:
what is all this crying over the Constitution. The last party that trampled you civil liberties was the GOP.
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Bush eroded civil liberties more than Obama, but Obama is still eroding them further than Bush did, in many ways.
 
TheSilencer1313 said:
It's the one document in history that guarentees freedom and civil rights.
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Let's not go overboard. Most Western countries have document guaranteeing civil liberties of one sort or another, some of which inspired the wording of the Constitution.
 
TheSilencer1313 said:
Oh yeah for sure.... and I'll bet everything on the fact that Romney will push the envelope even futher.
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I agree with you. Bush was awful, Obama a nightmare, and Romney will probably be something between a disaster and apocalyptic, especially if he has Republican majorities in both houses.
 
Stoked said:
Personally I strongly dislike thinking like that. In my opinion you should always vote.
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Why? We're hostage to a system that works against us. A media that has worked tirelessly to obscure the actual issues and divide the populace over nonsensical "socialism v capitalism" garbage. The politicians and their backers have hijacked the system to make sure nobody who's interested in actual change can get elected. And they've done all of this while convincing everyone that dissent is tantamount to treason, while they continue to erode our liberties, destroy our institutions, and rob us of what we built with our sweat and blood.

No. I won't be voting.
 
SiroMar said:
Why? We're hostage to a system that works against us. A media that has worked tirelessly to obscure the actual issues and divide the populace over nonsensical "socialism v capitalism" garbage. The politicians and their backers have hijacked the system to make sure nobody who's interested in actual change can get elected. And they've done all of this while convincing everyone that dissent is tantamount to treason, while they continue to erode our liberties, destroy our institutions, and rob us of what we built with our sweat and blood.

No. I won't be voting.
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Since you clearly have a problem with everything here and don't seem to be willing to make an effort to fix it...maybe you should move to somewhere else.
 
SiroMar said:
Why? We're hostage to a system that works against us. A media that has worked tirelessly to obscure the actual issues and divide the populace over nonsensical "socialism v capitalism" garbage. The politicians and their backers have hijacked the system to make sure nobody who's interested in actual change can get elected. And they've done all of this while convincing everyone that dissent is tantamount to treason, while they continue to erode our liberties, destroy our institutions, and rob us of what we built with our sweat and blood.

No. I won't be voting.
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Washing your hands of it is not the answer. Start pushing for like minded people to take control of the politics in your school, city, county...
 
Hantlers said:
Since you clearly have a problem with everything here and don't seem to be willing to make an effort to fix it...maybe you should move to somewhere else.
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Fix it by voting for the ones who are keeping it broken? The only power I have is my ability to speak out against it, which I obviously do. I donate a respectable chunk of my income to charity every year (I try to at least keep up with the Mormons). If there was a candidate I actually felt ethically comfortable supporting, I would. I'm not sure what it is you think you're doing that keeps you feeling all patriotic and important.
 
Stoked said:
Washing your hands of it is not the answer. Start pushing for like minded people to take control of the politics in your school, city, county...
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Oh but I do. How many people on this forum argue more than me? That's how I am all the time. Online and off. :p

For example, I was one of the founders of the American Atheists chapter in Utah. I am plenty active.
 
I just checked the RCP average and Obama still has a 48.0-41.8 lead over Romney in Michigan.

One Brow said:
I agree with you. Bush was awful, Obama a nightmare, and Romney will probably be something between a disaster and apocalyptic, especially if he has Republican majorities in both houses.
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Don't be so dour. You can at least hold out hope that Republicans will quit trying to stifle economic advancement after they no longer have a need to blame bad headlines on Obama. Republicans will be the biggest FDR proponents when in control, they'll just spin it a different way (like the neo-Keynesian Senator Hatch is with HAFB). You know they won't hold up a highway bill like they are under Obama's watch.

They'll also fix the social security issue on one hand while enriching the top on the other. Then the populism will bring back democrats and we'll swing the bat at that end of the problem. A new dawn is only 8 years away...
 
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