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BYU to the Big 12 discussion???

I'd love BYU in the Big12. But given their demands and their profile they are not going to be near the top. That's just how it is.
 
CONAN said:
I'd love BYU in the Big12. But given their demands and their profile they are not going to be near the top. That's just how it is.
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Also, I'm sure the situation with Utah hasn't helped them. I mean Utah has been really, really bad since joining the big boys, and yet they brutally abused BYU and made them cry on their own field. I don't see how the big 12, or anyone for that matter, can really take them seriously anymore after being completely embarrassed and humiliated on their homefield by a team like Utah. Let's face it, BYU is stuck in independent hell.
 
If Sunday play was the one thing keeping BYU from joining the Big 12, then I applaud BYU for sticking to their guns. However, I seriously doubt that was the deal breaker. Back when the Big 12 was originally forming, there were reports that BYU was to be included. In fact, some reports stated that BYU was basically in until Baylor was added as a last minute addition in favor of the Cougs. It doesn't seem like Sunday play was an issue then, and when the Big 12 began considering BYU this time around, they obviously had to know that nothing had changed in that regard.

I think this is more about BYU being heavy-handed in regards to BYU tv and demanding a certain amount of nationally televised games be guaranteed to them. If that's the case, BYU simply overestimated their value and the Big 12 laughed at them. Some will try and spin it as BYU being too "different" to join a major conference but I think that's just an attempt to save face. The Big 12 and it's TV partners doesn't need BYU to the point where they were willing to make all sorts of concessions just to get them. Look how easily they added TCU and apparently West Virginia once they turned their attention away from the Y. 2 schools with better football programs that don't have agendas in regards to their own networks or demands on how many nationally televised they're going to get.

Not to hard to see why it fell apart for the Y.
 
jazzman12 said:
If Sunday play was the one thing keeping BYU from joining the Big 12, then I applaud BYU for sticking to their guns. However, I seriously doubt that was the deal breaker. Back when the Big 12 was originally forming, there were reports that BYU was to be included. In fact, some reports stated that BYU was basically in until Baylor was added as a last minute addition in favor of the Cougs. It doesn't seem like Sunday play was an issue then, and when the Big 12 began considering BYU this time around, they obviously had to know that nothing had changed in that regard.

I think this is more about BYU being heavy-handed in regards to BYU tv and demanding a certain amount of nationally televised games be guaranteed to them. If that's the case, BYU simply overestimated their value and the Big 12 laughed at them. Some will try and spin it as BYU being too "different" to join a major conference but I think that's just an attempt to save face. The Big 12 and it's TV partners doesn't need BYU to the point where they were willing to make all sorts of concessions just to get them. Look how easily they added TCU and apparently West Virginia once they turned their attention away from the Y. 2 schools with better football programs that don't have agendas in regards to their own networks or demands on how many nationally televised they're going to get.

Not to hard to see why it fell apart for the Y.
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I agree with these points. It still wouldn't surprise me to see the Big 12 go back to 12 schools in a couple years. It wouldn't surprise to see BYU get in then.
 
jazzman12 said:
If Sunday play was the one thing keeping BYU from joining the Big 12, then I applaud BYU for sticking to their guns. However, I seriously doubt that was the deal breaker. Back when the Big 12 was originally forming, there were reports that BYU was to be included. In fact, some reports stated that BYU was basically in until Baylor was added as a last minute addition in favor of the Cougs. It doesn't seem like Sunday play was an issue then, and when the Big 12 began considering BYU this time around, they obviously had to know that nothing had changed in that regard.

I think this is more about BYU being heavy-handed in regards to BYU tv and demanding a certain amount of nationally televised games be guaranteed to them. If that's the case, BYU simply overestimated their value and the Big 12 laughed at them. Some will try and spin it as BYU being too "different" to join a major conference but I think that's just an attempt to save face. The Big 12 and it's TV partners doesn't need BYU to the point where they were willing to make all sorts of concessions just to get them. Look how easily they added TCU and apparently West Virginia once they turned their attention away from the Y. 2 schools with better football programs that don't have agendas in regards to their own networks or demands on how many nationally televised they're going to get.

Not to hard to see why it fell apart for the Y.
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I don't think Sunday play was an issue.

All indications that I've heard/read have to do with

$$$ and power.

BYU demanded waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyy too much.
 
The Thriller said:
All indications that I've heard/read have to do with

$$$ and power.

BYU demanded waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyy too much.
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This has been the case for decades and BYU going to a bigger conference. And Sunday play has been an issue. It was brought with the Pac10 decades ago and the Big12 specifically mentioned it (actually it was the TV folks in charge of Big12 and not the schools themselves). It is a factor no question but probably not as big as the other factors.
 
The Thriller said:
I don't think Sunday play was an issue.

All indications that I've heard/read have to do with

$$$ and power.

BYU demanded waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyy too much.
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This is why I think Chris Hill did a great job at positioning Utah to at least have a chance at the Pac 12. Utah is not a national program and they are not under the illusion that they are. Hill was well aware of that and realized that Utah needed the PAC much more than the PAC needed Utah, so he acted accordingly. Once Texas and the Pac couldn't reach a deal, the dust settled and Utah was in perfect position.

BYU on the other hand is totally dillusional in regards to their value as a big time program. Yes, there are LDS members scattered across the country but it's certainly not enough to give BYU the brand that they think they have. Unless you're in Utah, or an LDS member living in another state, you don't give a rat's *** about BYU. Before anybody gets hurt feelings over that, the exact same thing can also be said of Utah. At least Utah is now in a position where they may be able to change that perception in the coming years.

I feel bad for the avid BYU fans. They want nothing more than to see their team compete at the highest level possible but because their school is holding on to a false sense of superiority and power, they are getting the shaft. I agree with Catratcho when he says that the Big 12 may eventually get back to 12 teams and that BYU may eventually find their way into the conference, but not unless they come down off their high horse and take a page out of Chris Hill's book.
 
CONAN said:
freakazoid said:
Utah brutally abused BYU and made them cry on their own field.
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Agreed.
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It's nice to see we can agree on something.

CONAN said:
Freakazoid needs to be talked off that cliff.
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I appreciate your concern. I have to admit, this year hasn't been easy. Then again, as bad as things have been, all I have to do is remind myself how much worse it could be. After all, Utah DID become a BCS team this year, and we also unleashed the blood bath of all blood baths on our former rival, in their own house no less. I'd hate to be on the other side of that coin.

Yeah, I guess it all just depends on your perspective. Life as a Ute fan is pretty damn good, and it can only get better.:cool:
 
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freakazoid said:
Life as a Ute fan ... can only get better.:cool:
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True. When the Utes get a QB, things will get better. When they win their first Pac 12 game it will get better. When they turning the ball over constantly things will be better. (-insert karma comment here) When they start getting money for being in the Pac 12 things will be better.
I could go on and on.
 
What the hell are all the Ute fans doing in a BYU to the Big 12 discussion? I thought you folks didn't care about BYU now that you're in a BCS conference?

Instead of running your mouths in this thread, why don't you jackasses concentrate on, you know, getting a first down, or completing a damn pass. That would be nice. Watch an offense that is more enjoyable than receiving an *****.

Or better yet, winning one single ****ing Pac-12 game. It's pretty embarrassing that we're midway through the season and an Independent school has more wins in your conference than you do. You can talk all the smack that you want, but you're 0-4, and embarrassing yourselves. You're proving exactly what Craig James and all your critics have been saying for years. YOU DON'T BELONG WITH THE BIG BOYS. Little brother is proving that, again, as usual. Just like they did against TCU last year, Notre Dame last year, and so many other times.
 
The Thriller said:
What the hell are all the Ute fans doing in a BYU to the Big 12 discussion? I thought you folks didn't care about BYU now that you're in a BCS conference?

Instead of running your mouths in this thread, why don't you jackasses concentrate on, you know, getting a first down, or completing a damn pass. That would be nice. Watch an offense that is more enjoyable than receiving an *****.

Or better yet, winning one single ****ing Pac-12 game. It's pretty embarrassing that we're midway through the season and an Independent school has more wins in your conference than you do. You can talk all the smack that you want, but you're 0-4, and embarrassing yourselves. You're proving exactly what Craig James and all your critics have been saying for years. YOU DON'T BELONG WITH THE BIG BOYS. Little brother is proving that, again, as usual. Just like they did against TCU last year, Notre Dame last year, and so many other times.
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Said from a guy who's team can't take a BCS run past the first few weeks of a season. I didn't know Ute fans weren't allowed to talk about BYU's chances of landing in the Big 12. Obviously you're super sensitive about it. Try some mydol and a heating pad. It might help.
 
jazzman12 said:
Said from a guy who's team can't take a BCS run past the first few weeks of a season. I didn't know Ute fans weren't allowed to talk about BYU's chances of landing in the Big 12. Obviously you're super sensitive about it. Try some mydol and a heating pad. It might help.
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Oh please, your fans are challenging Conan to fights. conan of all people. Come now.

If anyone makes any comment about your boys, you folks are all over them. You talk about the Fiesta Bowl and post pictures of Brian Johnson all over the place. If there's anyone who needs the baby powder right now, it's Ute fans. I can't blame you. You have no QB, you're winless, and your defense is giving up 33 points in your last 3 conference games.
 
jazzman12 said:
This is why I think Chris Hill did a great job at positioning Utah to at least have a chance at the Pac 12. Utah is not a national program and they are not under the illusion that they are. Hill was well aware of that and realized that Utah needed the PAC much more than the PAC needed Utah, so he acted accordingly. Once Texas and the Pac couldn't reach a deal, the dust settled and Utah was in perfect position.

BYU on the other hand is totally dillusional in regards to their value as a big time program. Yes, there are LDS members scattered across the country but it's certainly not enough to give BYU the brand that they think they have. Unless you're in Utah, or an LDS member living in another state, you don't give a rat's *** about BYU. Before anybody gets hurt feelings over that, the exact same thing can also be said of Utah. At least Utah is now in a position where they may be able to change that perception in the coming years.

I feel bad for the avid BYU fans. They want nothing more than to see their team compete at the highest level possible but because their school is holding on to a false sense of superiority and power, they are getting the shaft. I agree with Catratcho when he says that the Big 12 may eventually get back to 12 teams and that BYU may eventually find their way into the conference, but not unless they come down off their high horse and take a page out of Chris Hill's book.
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Completely agree. Truer words have never been spoken.
 
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