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Collin Sexton SZN

Fosto said:
People think Keyonte's value is really high? I'd be surprised if he's valued at an unprotected 1st round pick to other GMs.
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For sure.

Like who is the rookie out there who is tasked to do anything even close to as complex as George is when he runs our complex motion based offense? Is there even a rookie out there who actually runs any offense, instead of being just another clog in the wheel?

Scoot was supposed to be playing actual lead guard PG as well but have you watched him? Dude plays like a SG with some nice passes here and there but when they let him run the half court its just next level cloggy and ends up in bad shots at the dying clock way too often.
 
HermanG said:
Like who is the rookie out there who is tasked to do anything even close to as complex as George is when he runs our complex motion based offense?
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Complex?

To me it looked like he wasn't running much of anything against the Wiz. He's not dictating the tempo, directing guys on the floor, managing the clock. Those are basic things for an NBA point guard. I mean you don't have to be a full-on "floor general" in today's league, but then you also don't get to receive extra props for making the first pass of a play when there's not even any ball pressure on you.

Keyonte has been god awful lately and shouldn't be receiving any minutes.
 
Tremendous Upside said:
Complex?

To me it looked like he wasn't running much of anything against the Wiz. He's not dictating the tempo, directing guys on the floor, managing the clock. Those are basic things for an NBA point guard. I mean you don't have to be a full-on "floor general" in today's league, but then you also don't get to receive extra props for making the first pass of a play when there's not even any ball pressure on you.

Keyonte has been god awful lately and shouldn't be receiving any minutes. God I hate the double standard that keeps saving his ***
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Which one isnt complex? Our offense, or Keyonte's assigment which you pretend to know but have absolutely no idea what it is?

He has played worse lately for sure, but Hardy has told us multiple times that he has been given a tall task list. You can pretend all you want that your eyeball test is superior, but my comment is based on what Hardy has said. And he is the one who knows who is actually doing what they are supposed to do.

Also its super easy to see that he does pace the offense and I dont really know how you can miss that. He ALWAYS puts his head up as soon as he gets the ball in the backcourt and scans ahead, makes occasional forward passes and slows down/speeds up his dribble based on what he sees. He is constantly reading the court when he has the ball even during his drives. His biggest flaw in operating the offense is probably the fact that he runs into situations where he picks up his dribble too easily without knowing what he is going to do next. That is what leads to most of his telegraphed passes as well as traveling turnovers which he has also had.

I have no doubt he could play for his own points a WHOLE lot more with his ability to get around the court, but he is actually trying to run the offense and only attacks clear advantages he sees.
 
HermanG said:
Which one isnt complex? Our offense, or Keyonte's assigment which you pretend to know but have absolutely no idea what it is?

He has played worse lately for sure, but Hardy has told us multiple times that he has been given a tall task list. You can pretend all you want that your eyeball test is superior, but my comment is based on what Hardy has said. And he is the one who knows who is actually doing what they are supposed to do.

Also its super easy to see that he does pace the offense and I dont really know how you can miss that. He ALWAYS puts his head up as soon as he gets the ball in the backcourt and scans ahead, makes occasional forward passes and slows down/speeds up his dribble based on what he sees. He is constantly reading the court when he has the ball even during his drives. His biggest flaw in operating the offense is probably the fact that he runs into situations where he picks up his dribble too easily without knowing what he is going to do next. That is what leads to most of his telegraphed passes as well as traveling turnovers which he has also had.

I have no doubt he could play for his own points a WHOLE lot more with his ability to get around the court, but he is actually trying to run the offense and only attacks clear advantages he sees.
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Any reasonably experienced vet min PG picked up from the trash heap can get a team into a set and get out of the way. But the Jazz obviously isn't expecting Keyonte to become a Tyus Jones like ball-mover. He's getting minutes because they want him to function on a higher level eventually.

The biggest problem on offense is that he seems to be a really bad shooter, and having the defense respect him at the arc is the only way for him to gain an advantage since he's not very quick for a 6'3'' guard. If he can't magically become a 36% shooter from the perimeter, that may change his whole career trajectory.

I've said many times that Keyonte has an eye for cutters and a good sense for how players are moving around the floor. Unfortunately, he can't just stand in place and keep whipping the ball at guys diving to the hoop.

I'm ready to accept that his offense has time to develop, hopefully after he does a TON of work next offseason. But he has no excuses for his defense. Key simply doesn't compete hard enough and often looks like an entitled high school star with the way he gives up on plays.

IMO it wouldn't hurt him to spend some time in the G-League. We don't need him at the moment.
 
Tremendous Upside said:
Any reasonably experienced vet min PG picked up from the trash heap can get a team into a set and get out of the way. But the Jazz obviously isn't expecting Keyonte to become a Tyus Jones like ball-mover. He's getting minutes because they want him to function on a higher level eventually.

The biggest problem on offense is that he seems to be a really bad shooter, and having the defense respect him at the arc is the only way for him to gain an advantage since he's not very quick for a 6'3'' guard. If he can't magically become a 36% shooter from the perimeter, that may change his whole career trajectory.

I've said many times that Keyonte has an eye for cutters and a good sense for how players are moving around the floor. Unfortunately, he can't just stand in place and keep whipping the ball at guys diving to the hoop.

I'm ready to accept that his offense has time to develop, hopefully after he does a TON of work next offseason. But he has no excuses for his defense. Key simply doesn't compete hard enough and often looks like an entitled high school star with the way he gives up on plays.

IMO it wouldn't hurt him to spend some time in the G-League. We don't need him at the moment.
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I do agree with the main point that he is a net negative atm. Its not hard to see with eyeball test or by numbers. The shooting is the biggest reason why, and I'm hoping his issues are related to transitioning to longer distances, as he was reportedly a 41% shooter from deep in HS in his Senior year. With the College arc being further out and being one and done there, and then moving even further out in the NBA he just hasnt figured it out. Maybe needs some more strenght to shoot comfortably from these distances. Form is great though.
 
HermanG said:
I do agree with the main point that he is a net negative atm. Its not hard to see with eyeball test or by numbers. The shooting is the biggest reason why, and I'm hoping his issues are related to transitioning to longer distances, as he was reportedly a 41% shooter from deep in HS in his Senior year. With the College arc being further out and being one and done there, and then moving even further out in the NBA he just hasnt figured it out. Maybe needs some more strenght to shoot comfortably from these distances. Form is great though.
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Wanna add to this point that even though he is a net negative, I think playing THT in his place would not necessarily be an upgrade (even though THT is a better player), since Keyonte actually plays very differently to THT who is more in the vein of Sexton and Clarkson.
 
Keyonte needs strength and reps. Staff has said his shooting struggle is a strength thing. Same with finishing at the rim. You don't add strength during the season and he's very young. He'll make a jump the next two off seasons when you can start to deal with that.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Anyone who liked Keyonte pre draft only likes him more now
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If we don't make a move for a PG this deadline i think it means the FO thinks he is the future. Personally I think he likely is, but not going to be a big difference maker until year 3.

Agbaji and him could start at the guard spots if they both can shoot well. Oddly I think they have the opposite problems this year. Agbaji put on a lot of muscle mass and it likely is affecting his shooting stroke a bit. I think he'll be okay though.
 
I will be extremely pissed if we trade him.

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Wouldn’t surprise me if we trade him. He has been incredible even before he got the start (how he earned it), but i think last night was only the second time he went well beyond 30 minutes.

He is on a short leash and seems to be yanked the second he isn’t playing at all star form, or is kept off the court the second the George shows any sign of life.

If anyone on the Jazz has ever had justification to ask for a trade it’s Sexton.
 
fishonjazz said:
I will be extremely pissed if we trade him.

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Same but as long as this is a .500 team and Danny Ainge is the GM we have to expect any player on the roster could be dealt for the right price.

The Jazz have been proving the past 1.5 years that guys who hit 24-25 are not always finished developing. It's been really cool to watch the development of Markky into an all star last year and now Sexton blossoming this season. When he was included in the Don deal most thought of Sexton as a pure scorer in the Cam Thomas/Jordan Poole mold but he's now showing there is much more to his game. Looking at the stat stuffing in the boxscore from last night even against a G league level opponent..nice. I was pro-Sex and willing to give him a chance but damn never thought I'd see 13 assists next to his name.
 
Sexton last 5 games:
7 assists
6 assists
13 assists
7 assists
7 assists
He averaged 25 minutes per game for those 5 games. Thats 8 assists per game in 25 minutes. So if he were getting like 35 minutes per game he would be averaging over 10 assists per game during this stretch. Sadly we have lost more than we have won during this stretch.
 
fishonjazz said:
Sexton last 5 games:
7 assists
6 assists
13 assists
7 assists
7 assists
He averaged 25 minutes per game for those 5 games. Thats 8 assists per game in 25 minutes. So if he were getting like 35 minutes per game he would be averaging over 10 assists per game during this stretch. Sadly we have lost more than we have won during this stretch.
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His decision making has been very mediocre the last few games.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
His decision making has been very mediocre the last few games.
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Yep, the stretch lately needs eye test. Lot of these assists have become from Collins "bailing out" him. As someone pointed out, he has become really good on sniffing when Collins drives himself into a pickle, and runs for rescue. Either getting short pass in the paint or picking the board and finishing.

Sexton is a decent play maker, but still work in progress. He wants to be better, JC again, mostly just doesn't. Even that he can.
 
Any player besides Sexton averaging over 10 assists per game for the jazz would cause posters to jump for joy about their court vision, selflessness and ability to run the offense.
Sexton assists dont count though.
 
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