What's new
By:
Filters

Dante Exum: The Future is Not Now

green said:
This. I think how Utah envisions Exum and how Exum incisions Exum are two different things.

Utah sees Exum as a three and D SG.

Exum sees Exum as a John Wall/Russell Westbrook type player.

If I'm in Exum's ear, I tell him that Utah has ****ed up your development so far, trying to turn him into something he's not (which for whatever reason Utah likes to do. Millsap is not a SF. AK was not a SF. Burks is not a PG). I tell him that when you are on the floor, play your game. Do what you do. Screw Utah.

If he does that and plays well, Utah will be forced to change or trade you.

It's shameful that Utah tanked three years for Exum and then he hardly ever sees the court.
Click to expand...

They are not trying to turn him into something he's not. He doesn't have the handle or the off-the-dribble shot to be a PG. How about Exum take some responsibility for his development and learn to deal with on-ball pressure. How about he tries to split a double team... like... once! I'm getting a bit sick of this narrative.

I didn't think Quin handled him great in the beginning and mid-season. I thought he was on a leash that nobody else on the team was on and he got into the doghouse when he screwed up and was actually trying to test his limits. That all sucks, but the main problem with Exum right now is NOT Quin Snyder and the Jazz not doing right by him. The main problem for Exum right now is that Exum doesn't have the point guard skills to be successful. Sure we could have forced him into PG spot and let him average 3 TO in 20 minutes of play. And we would have lost some more games in the process... Don't forget the importance of this season when it comes to the long-term future of the franchise.
 
stitches said:
They are not trying to turn him into something he's not. He doesn't have the handle or the off-the-dribble shot to be a PG. How about Exum take some responsibility for his development and learn to deal with on-ball pressure. How about he tries to split a double team... like... once! I'm getting a bit sick of this narrative.

I didn't think Quin handled him great in the beginning and mid-season. I thought he was on a leash that nobody else on the team was on and he got into the doghouse when he screwed up and was actually trying to test his limits. That all sucks, but the main problem with Exum right now is NOT Quin Snyder and the Jazz not doing right by him. The main problem for Exum right now is that Exum doesn't have the point guard skills to be successful. Sure we could have forced him into PG spot and let him average 3 TO in 20 minutes of play. And we would have lost some more games in the process... Don't forget the importance of this season when it comes to the long-term future of the franchise.
Click to expand...

He really hasn't had a chance to show what he can do. He hasn't even been given a 10 game stretch where he handled the ball and initiated the PnR regularly in his whole career.I think it's crazy to expect him to have gained any kind of mastery or comfort with this when realistically he would be lucky to get 3-5 chances per game to run some kind of PnR action.

His results in those situation are mixed, but he has shown plenty of ability to find Gobert for lobs, make baskets, find 3 point shooters etc. One of the things I find most annoying about the criticism of Dante is that we keep criticizing him for things that he is rarely allowed to try.

In an alternate reality where his development is a priority he is allowed to handle the ball much more, and gets the chance to experience lots of defensive coverages. That is how you grow as a young player. You will always be able to say that he can't do it until you actually let him try to do it consistently.
 
I said it somewhere else, but Utah isn't too high on Exum's mental abilities.

Don't be surprised if they move him this summer.
 
green said:
I said it somewhere else, but Utah isn't too high on Exum's mental abilities.

Don't be surprised if they move him this summer.
Click to expand...

They were when they drafted him. His issue is that he doesn't have the skills or confidence to do the things the Jazz want him to do. He's a project.
 
Ron Mexico said:
His handle looked good in the playoffs when he got a chance. He also got complimented on his handle a couple times by the national announcers. I think his poor handle is partially a myth.
Click to expand...

His handle needs some work, but I agree that it's not as bad as some make it out to be. His tendency for TOs under pressure has more to do with nerves than having a bad handle, and he's already made some good strides as to playing under pressure.

Before, when he's had to play against the Warriors, he looked shell shocked just to be on the same floor. In game 4, he wasn't scared at the least to take his game right at the best team in the league. He is developing, and expecting him to become a star overnight is unrealistic and delusional.

I mean, anyone who watched his play in that game and complains about the negative instead of enjoying the positive is a damn fool. That's right, a damn fool.
 
Last edited:
Ron Mexico said:
Did you watch the GS Jazz final game? Or are you just reading the box score? He has been consistently helping the Jazz win since the all-star break statistically and from the eye test. The reason people are excited over that game is he took over for a few minutes against the best team in the NBA. They probably had let up since they had a big lead but still. For a few minutes he was the best player on the court. If he can start to have more and more of those and less and less down moments you have the makings for a star.

If you dont watch many Jazz games and just look at the box score you probably are not high on Exum or you just hate him cant get past disliking him for whatever reason.
Click to expand...

Don't bother trying to have a reasonable discussion with this guy. He has an agenda in proving himself right since he was trashing Exum from the very beginning.

After game 4 he said meaningless stats, and if you've paid attention to his history, he's mostly just a stat watcher.

His entire opinion on Exum is based on his pre-draft opinion and watching stats. Worthless.
 
Cappy_Smurf said:
His handle needs some work, but I agree that it's not as bad as some make it out to be. His tendency for TOs under pressure has more to do with nerves than having a bad handle, and he's already made some good strides as to playing under pressure.

Before, when he's had to play against the Warriors, he looked shell shocked just to be on the same floor. In game 4, he wasn't scared at the least to take his game right at the best team in the league.

I mean, anyone who watched his play in that game and complains about the negative instead of enjoying the positive is a damn fool. That's right, a damn fool.
Click to expand...

Agree with this. Exum's attitude/demeanor in playoffs and especially last game was significantly different

Also, I think his injury dominates the whole equation. How much he played, how tentative he was this season. He didn't really "come back" from injury because he was never "there" in the first place. Too inexperienced. He (and coaches) couldn't gauge his progress very well because there was little to go on. His play in the pre injury summer league game looked like the last game of playoffs. So I think he is essentially back to the first game of his second season. I'm on the Dante bandwagon. Physically, he was in the same league as the warriors in game 4. No doubt he has a lot of skills work to do. Again, I'm on the Dante bandwagon.
 
stitches said:
They are not trying to turn him into something he's not. He doesn't have the handle or the off-the-dribble shot to be a PG. How about Exum take some responsibility for his development and learn to deal with on-ball pressure. How about he tries to split a double team... like... once! I'm getting a bit sick of this narrative.

I didn't think Quin handled him great in the beginning and mid-season. I thought he was on a leash that nobody else on the team was on and he got into the doghouse when he screwed up and was actually trying to test his limits. That all sucks, but the main problem with Exum right now is NOT Quin Snyder and the Jazz not doing right by him. The main problem for Exum right now is that Exum doesn't have the point guard skills to be successful. Sure we could have forced him into PG spot and let him average 3 TO in 20 minutes of play. And we would have lost some more games in the process... Don't forget the importance of this season when it comes to the long-term future of the franchise.
Click to expand...

you are such a nut.
Exum only averaged 1.4 turnover per game in his rookie as a point guard in 20 minutes per game. As a starting pg in his rookie year, he had a 70% winning percentage. This year he is averaging less than one turnover per game.

How is he going to average 3 turnovers per game with more experience under his belt?
So your evaluation of how had exum would be as a starting point guard is all wrong.
 
utahjazzz said:
you are such a nut.
Exum only averaged 1.4 turnover per game in his rookie as a point guard in 20 minutes per game. As a starting pg in his rookie year, he had a 70% winning percentage. This year he is averaging less than one turnover per game.

How is he going to average 3 turnovers per game with more experience under his belt?
So your evaluation of how had exum would be as a starting point guard is all wrong.
Click to expand...


Agree.

I think the "poor handle" narrative run on here is overblown. IMO most of what you see is Dante being tentative and not wanting to make mistakes (because he knows 1 mistake will have him dragged). The majority (I'd guess 80%) of his TO's is when he passes to our bigs in the paint, where either the big doesn't handle the ball or someone reads it well enough to get into the passing lane (happens to all PG's mind you) but its rare Dante gets the ball taken from him.

He's never going to have Kyrie like handles but nor does he need to, his speed is his weapon of choice. I think with more confidence you'll see a different Dante.

#kidFlash
 
elan_prodigy said:
Agree.

I think the "poor handle" narrative run on here is overblown. IMO most of what you see is Dante being tentative and not wanting to make mistakes (because he knows 1 mistake will have him dragged). The majority (I'd guess 80%) of his TO's is when he passes to our bigs in the paint, where either the big doesn't handle the ball or someone reads it well enough to get into the passing lane (happens to all PG's mind you) but its rare Dante gets the ball taken from him.

He's never going to have Kyrie like handles but nor does he need to, his speed is his weapon of choice. I think with more confidence you'll see a different Dante.

#kidFlash
Click to expand...

I would be really interested to get a better breakdown of his TO's. I did some searching on basketball reference and saw that it said he only had 10 bad pass TO's the entire season. That is an insanely small amount. So I wonder where the TO's are coming from exactly?

If I look on the NBA stats that use synergy I see that Exum turned it over on 8.3% of his drives, which is not great (Mack was worse) but isn't some unplayable amount. For guards it is about in the same range as James Harden, Ricky Rubio, Devin Booker, Rajon Rondo. If he isn't turning it over by bad passes (only 10 as I said) then it must be either getting stripped on drives, offensive fouls, or uncalled fouls. But again he is not at all a TO machine during drives. He can definitely improve. George Hill has an amazing 3.9% which is one of the best in the league.
 
Maybe Quin has been hard on Exum because he sucks air like a Hellcat. Hands on your knees and head bobbing after three trips down the court had to piss Quin off.
 
Quin's Murderface said:
I would be really interested to get a better breakdown of his TO's. I did some searching on basketball reference and saw that it said he only had 10 bad pass TO's the entire season. That is an insanely small amount. So I wonder where the TO's are coming from exactly?

If I look on the NBA stats that use synergy I see that Exum turned it over on 8.3% of his drives, which is not great (Mack was worse) but isn't some unplayable amount. For guards it is about in the same range as James Harden, Ricky Rubio, Devin Booker, Rajon Rondo. If he isn't turning it over by bad passes (only 10 as I said) then it must be either getting stripped on drives, offensive fouls, or uncalled fouls. But again he is not at all a TO machine during drives. He can definitely improve. George Hill has an amazing 3.9% which is one of the best in the league.
Click to expand...

GHill was incredible early-on in the season. He'd play 36 min and turn the ball over once.

Seems like Exum got the ball late in the shot clock every once in a while, which could account for some turnovers. He has great court vision and makes some beautiful passes but you can't expect him to be at GHill's level of TO's with so little court time and so little time healthy. We saw where he's headed though vs. Golden State and that should have us salivating.
 
utahjazzz said:
you are such a nut.
Exum only averaged 1.4 turnover per game in his rookie as a point guard in 20 minutes per game. As a starting pg in his rookie year, he had a 70% winning percentage. This year he is averaging less than one turnover per game.

How is he going to average 3 turnovers per game with more experience under his belt?
So your evaluation of how had exum would be as a starting point guard is all wrong.
Click to expand...

Except even then he didn't really play point guard... he wasn't primary or even secondary ball-handler. He was parked in the corner waiting for somebody else to create for him, which is evidenced by him taking over 60% of his shots as 3s(94% of them assisted, in case you try to claim that he was creating those). This is what players like Danny Green, Kyle Korver, Wes Matthews do.

About his turnovers - the less he has the ball in his hands as a ballhandler the fewer TO's he's going to have. That's only normal. The question is what is turnover rate when running the pnr for example. I don't have those numbers, but I can guarantee you Quin and the Jazz do and there is a reason why they avoid using him as a PG and primary ball-handler and why they put another PG along with him with pretty much every lineup he plays with.
 
He was parked in the corner waiting for somebody else to create for him, which is evidenced by him taking over 60% of his shots as 3s(94% of them assisted, in case you try to claim that he was creating those). This is what players like Danny Green, Kyle Korver, Wes Matthews do.
Click to expand...

WELL DUHHH,this is the whole complaint about how Exum was handled.Sending him to the corner and making him shoot the 3 pters or be yanked out of the game.Exum isn't a 3 pt shooter.And stupid to not be able to see Exum blow by people like Klay Thompson and say people have to create opportunities for him.
 
He was parked in the corner waiting for somebody else to create for him, which is evidenced by him taking over 60% of his shots as 3s(94% of them assisted, in case you try to claim that he was creating those). This is what players like Danny Green, Kyle Korver, Wes Matthews do.
Click to expand...

WELL DUHHH,this is the whole complaint about how Exum was handled.Sending him to the corner and making him shoot the 3 pters or be yanked out of the game.Exum isn't a 3 pt shooter.And stupid to not be able to see Exum blow by people like Klay Thompson and say people have to create opportunities for him.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top