Donald Fires FBI Director who's investigating Russian Election Hacking

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by The Thriller, May 9, 2017.

  1. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    Also there's nothing more tiring to me then people playing the 'well we're not very nice to Russia either' card. If Syria was somehow able to launch drone strikes in the US, would you throw up your hands and say there's nothing we can do because we pull that **** too? Of course not.
    America certainly isn't perfect but defending our democracy should be something every American can get behind whatever they think of our foreign policy.
     
  2. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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    Well, I think he could just veto it or send it back with some suggestions for improving it. But sitting on it might be less offensive to his R supporters, even if it gives his D opponents some ammo. It's a judgment call.... apparently based on politics not principle.

    why are you this anxious about it? As I suggested above, it seems childish to sanction Russia when we have the CIA meddling all over the world, toppling leaders who don't do what we want.
     
  3. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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    Well, I think he could just veto it or send it back with some suggestions for improving it. But sitting on it might be less offensive to his R supporters, even if it gives his D opponents some ammo. It's a judgment call.... apparently based on politics not principle.

    why are you this anxious about it? As I suggested above, it seems childish to sanction Russia when we have the CIA meddling all over the world, toppling leaders who don't do what we want.
    OK, for a sec thought you must be in Turkey or some remote corner of Syria still free from Assad..... in range of Syrian drones.... but if you sincerely think Russia has somehow been successful in subverting our democracy, you would find a few like-minded folks at a nearby John Birch Society meeting.... but then this new Russia fearmongering Press is the bapf Press.

    Some people say be careful when pointing your finger in accusation.... three fingers pointing at yourself.... sorta saying projection is a tactic of deceit..... offense the best defense.... if you're afraid of being found out for a crime, accuse someone else first.

    I think it is clear that Putin had substantial political dealmaking with Hillary. She got tons of money from him. Bill got tons of money "speaking" to select groups in Russia. Hillary really did compromise our democracy in doing these things, even from the seat of Sec of State and not the Pres. But of course, Hillary was a globalist and a big UN governance supporter, and a lot of our sophisticated leadership is on board with all that.

    Under globalism, elected officials will pretty much be figureheads while all our laws are made by select UN committees for rubber-stamp implementation across the world. The committee seats will be brokered by corporate interests..... I call that fascism, and a serious threat to US democracy.
     
  4. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    You don't seem to understand. He signed the law when it was passed a year ago (due to it passing with a veto proof majority) his state dept is not putting it into action.
     
  5. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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    OK, Z. I think you're right about Trump signing it. But it shows a little smarts not to actually implement it, as I suggested above. It was a childish act, and under the real circumstances it was just a political gesture. The sanctions won't stop anything. If Russia were interfering we just need to fix the ballot boxes so we can verify voter eligibility and have a paper trail all the way to the tally officials who report the results.

    If Russia were to say drop leaflets all over the country advocating Vote for Trump... or surrender.... I don't think that would do the job. If Russia gave Trump help.... oh wait... Russia did give Hillary help. Russia made up the dossier the Dems used to get the FISA court to wiretap Trump. But that didn't succeed either. I think we can move on without the sanctions, but secure our ballot process anyway.
     
  6. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    Kind of defeats the purpose of an independent legislative body if the executive can just ignore the laws they pass. Regardless of how you feel about this particular bill I would think you'd have higher regard for the constitution than this.
     
  7. Joe Bagadonuts

    Joe Bagadonuts Well-Known Member

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    I was aware of them going crazy over the scandals before the scandals even happened.
     
  8. sirkickyass

    sirkickyass Moderator Emeritus Staff Member

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    Dropped in on a whim. I think I've mentioned on this site at least one other time that my personal response to this entire Russian quagmire has been to spend significant amounts of time teaching myself Russian (although I ended up caving and hiring a private tutor, because that **** is hard) and reading Russian literature and history to get a sense of who it is that we are at a renewed cold war with.

    There is very little doubt in my mind that the decision yesterday not to implement sanctions, and further to scuttle the process of actually compiling a useable list of sanctionable individuals, was a direct personal favor from the President to Putin. To understand Russia's political system, you need to wrap your head around the concept that they have a managed Democracy that features features of a Western Democratic process but serves entirely different political ends. Russia's leaders maintain power by consolidating support among a designated economic elite, who in turn allow the state to retain fundamental control over who has the right to exploit the country's resources. In a way, the Russian "oligarchs" are sort of like feudal lords that have the capacity, collectively, to overturn the power of a king. Putin is functionally an absolute leader, but does rely heavily on the consent of the oligarchy to retain control.

    I read some Russian-published news sources with regularity, and the publication of the "Putin list" that was supposed to accompany these sanctions was a really hot button topic in Russia. This was going to the heart of the support structure that Putin needs to retain control, and could have placed several of these oligarchs in the position of needing regime change in order to unlock their wealth abroad. It would have really messed with the true power structure in Russian society in a way that merely naming all the people in the Duma does not.

    News stories in Russian were being published about individuals and industrialists bringing cash back into Russia because they were terrified of ending up on this Putin list and being severed from their money overseas. The US ambassador to Russia, Jon Huntsman Jr., did an interview with a leading security publication that focuses on Russia and Eastern European issues and caters to a largely Russian audience. Most of the questions were about sanctions. Half of the interview were specifically about these sanctions.

    http://www.interfax.com/interview.asp?id=806172

    It is impossible to overstate how much Russia, and specifically Putin, wanted this to just go away. It's a much bigger favor to Putin, and the oligarchs he relies on to maintain power, than even most Trump critics realize.

    До скоро!
     
    JazzGal, colton, babe and 1 other person like this.
  9. Joe Bagadonuts

    Joe Bagadonuts Well-Known Member

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    I could not agree more with this post, and I have also been the target of Bullet/Game's tactics. It's laughable to read him claiming that he ran Dutch off for bad manners, as if he is some sort of last bastion for decency. Bullet has gone off on me in a crude fashion on multiple occasions. As far as I know, the only thing that has provoked these name-calling sessions is that we disagree on various subjects. As a result of those differences he thinks it is fair game to make up lies about me and my family and to say disgusting things about us. I am definitely not a member of the Game fan club.
     
  10. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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    somewhere far away and long ago.... I got the notion that you were related to Huntsman, like maybe a nephew. Like Huntsman, you are plenty smart. I had a very difficult time learning Russian and I don't even know how to find the Cyrillic alphabet on my computer to try to use it. Maybe I'll check back later if I figure that out. But I read Russian with a good dictionary and can understand some.

    I've said nice things about Putin sometimes, because I realize he is quite westernized philosophically and only refers to Marxist ideology for convenience. Doesn't believe it all. He is truly an oligarch, much like I figured Hillary would prove to be.... well, and the whole kit and caboodle of politicians for the past hundred years plus, with very few exceptions. A virtual ruling class supported and kept in office by the right connections and for doing the expected stuff.

    But your analysis seems to me to likely be very much the truth.
     
  11. Gameface

    Gameface I actually REALLY like Gobert! Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    If I had to guess I'd assume my popularity here is at an all-time low.

    But I've explained in detail what you do specifically that gets under my skin. This post is a perfect example. We seem to completely talk past each other. I've given up.
     
  12. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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  13. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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    well, don't throw in the towel just now. We might win tonight.
     
  14. Joe Bagadonuts

    Joe Bagadonuts Well-Known Member

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    Whatever. You claim to be some sort of protector of good manners, but you occasionally come unglued and exhibit terrible manners.
     
  15. Gameface

    Gameface I actually REALLY like Gobert! Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    True...
     
  16. Gameface

    Gameface I actually REALLY like Gobert! Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    I've given up on Joe ever understanding anything I say.
     
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  17. babe

    babe Well-Known Member

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    but, more importantly, the Jazz could win tonight, right?
     
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  18. Gameface

    Gameface I actually REALLY like Gobert! Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    Yes
     
  19. The Thriller

    The Thriller Well-Known Member

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    https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/31/politics/donald-trump-rod-rosenstein-december-meeting/index.html
     
  20. The Thriller

    The Thriller Well-Known Member

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    Along those same lines comes this:

    http://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blog...dent-trump-gets-revenge-for-russian-sanctions

    Can it be any more obvious that this presidency along with its foul party has been corrupted by Russian oligarchs’ money???
     

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