El Paso Shooting

[Red]

but it wasn’t a Muslim ban. And I don’t find arguments saying it was to be compelling.

I had originally felt Trump wanted a broader ban on Muslims, but, since that was a few years ago(and time flies when I'm having a good time, lol), I considered that I might have been mistaken. But I thought @silesian offered the evidence to demonstrate my memory was actually accurate since Trump stated, speaking of himself in the third person, as he was reading from a statement his administration was releasing:

"Donald Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States, until our country's representatives can figure out what the hell is going on. We have no choice."

I believe that supports how I thought I remembered Trump's desire. The ban turned out to be limited to specific countries. But, it's hard to interpret "total and complete shutdown of Muslims enterng the United States" in any way other then just what it says. A ban on Muslims. And it's possible he was being influenced at the time by Steve Bannon, who had delivered a talk at the Vatican predicting that there would be a great war of Christian civilization vs. Islam. And that there must be such a war. I'm speculating, but Trump often fondly referred to "my two Steve's" at that time, referring to Bannon, and Steve Miller. Miller, of course, is the driving ideological force behind the administration's response to the situation on our southern border.

I know I was arguing what Trump wanted, not what Trump had to settle for....

 

[Stoked]

People said we couldn't get to social security, or gay marriage.

We did.

Hahaha

 

[Red]

I just heard Trump say to the cameras "I think my rhetoric is bringing people together" The cognitive disonance may yet burn out my synapses....

Holding court....

 

[Stoked]

I just heard Trump say to the cameras "I think my rhetoric is bringing people together" The cognitive disonance may yet burn out my synapses....

Jesus, he can’t believe this can he? Like even he has to know how full of **** he is. Right?

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

Jesus, he can’t believe this can he? Like even he has to know how full of **** he is. Right?

He probably does. Just like when he looks in the mirror and believes young women find him attractive and sexy. Just like he actually believes he knows more about health care, climate science, economics, etc. than those who actually study and do them for a living. He's a malignant narcissist and his delusions are his reality.

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

There is no bigger megaphone then the one wielded by a president. And, in Trump's case, that megaphone has been in the form of tweets, more then any president before him. I remember suggesting, that if he were elected, he would govern mostly via Twitter and rallies. Hasn't quite turned out that way, executive orders have been prevalent, but Twitter and rallies have seen to it that the focus of the media has been on Trump, and to a saturated degree. But that suits him fine. (I'd love to see a week go by where the media ignores every tweet, and refuses to cover his rallies. Too bad, he snares them every time).

But do his hateful tweets and divisive rally speeches equate to an increase in hate crimes? I believe a president's words matter. If a president is scapegoating minorities with his words, then the very reach of his words, via social media, via live rallies attended by thousands, and sound bites of those rallies and tweets provided by the media, is huge. Far greater then any private citizen. Filling those tweets and rallies with hate, scapegoating, and "otherizing" Hispanics, at the very least, renders approval to those who feel the same way. It's wrong. Stop it. Don't need a direct link between Trump and El Paso. Just stop it.

But, FWIW, and both these studies must have flaws.

Do Trump tweets spur hate crimes?:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/do-trump-tweets-spur-hate-crimes1/

The actual study, PDF file at link:

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3149103

And this study has come up on cable networks in recent days: hate crimes up 226% in counties that held Trump rallies during 2016 campaign:

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brie...s-rose-by-226-percent-in-counties-where-trump

I do think we ought to pump the brakes a bit claiming straight line causality from Trump's rhetoric to actions. Yeah, there may be 'stochastic terrorism' happening, but this is an empirical question, and the truth is likely not as simple as all that.

 

[Spaniard]

Then he said "I hope everyone has a nice day" signaling to all the racists out there to mobilize, taking the cue from the word "everyone", which a former white supremacist turned spiritual guru and msnbc contributor said means specifically to use shaving cream and silly string and/or toilet paper on the lawns of any poc, to show them that the are not welcome. **** dog whistles! Where's congress? When are they going to take up the bill on dog whistle control?

 

[Gameface]

Then he said "I hope everyone has a nice day" signaling to all the racists out there to mobilize, taking the cue from the word "everyone", which a former white supremacist turned spiritual guru and msnbc contributor said means specifically to use shaving cream and silly string and/or toilet paper on the lawns of any poc, to show them that the are not welcome. **** dog whistles! Where's congress? When are they going to take up the bill on dog whistle control?

eh?

 

[Red]

"It feels like being hunted". Latinos across the United States in fear after El Paso massacre:

https://news.google.com/articles/CA...AowjuuKAzCWrzwwloEY?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US:en

But Tucker Carlson would have us believe otherwise I guess....

 

[Red]

I do think we ought to pump the brakes a bit claiming straight line causality from Trump's rhetoric to actions. Yeah, there may be 'stochastic terrorism' happening, but this is an empirical question, and the truth is likely not as simple as all that.

Yes, this is why I phrased it "Filling those tweets and rallies with hate, scapegoating, and "otherizing" Hispanics, at the very least, renders approval to those who feel the same way", and did not draw a straight line causality. i.e., it lets those Americans who already felt that way feel that their president feels that way too. At the same time, the El Paso shooter would not have said "the fake news" will blame Trump, unless he knew how similar his phrasing was to that of the president. I mean, I can picture him saying "I sound like Trump, I better clarify I felt this way long before Trump arrived on the scene".

 

[Stoked]

"It feels like being hunted". Latinos across the United States in fear after El Paso massacre:

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEGGOsmwl7x9VoayH8sPekdkqFwgEKg8IACoHCAowjuuKAzCWrzwwloEY?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US:en

But Tucker Carlson would have us believe otherwise I guess....

Has there been any other specific mass shooting targeting Latinos specifically?

Also, this isn’t limited to just Latinos. See the cnn article I posted. Everyone is scared and feeling targeted.

 

[Stoked]

Does it feel like something has shifted to anyone else?

That critical mass has been reached for a larger portion of America suddenly?

Also these “domestic” terrorists are doing something the “Islamic” terrorists were unable to. Making average Americans fearful in daily life. Wary of sending kids to school, of shopping, going to work, to a concert...