Hayward has agreed to an offer with Hornets

[GVC]

The Jazz could. without Hayward they could afford to sign 3 marquee players next year and then match Burks and Kanter to go over the cap to fill out a solid rotation of 9 or 10 players

Without Hayward, they'll likely have $25-30mm in cap space next summer. Who are these 3 marquee players that can be had for <$30mm combined?

 

[fishonjazz]

Being a MAX player in today's market doesn't mean some is a MAX PLAYER, it simply means someone is willing to pay him a maximum salary.

It has always been this way in every nba market.

Remember gilbert arenas? Bargnani? Hibbert?

The dumb teams will always overpay players.


Imo we shouldnt be one of the dumb teams

 

[Stifle Tower]

You don't let your best player walk because of several million dollars a year.

Again, who do we get to replace Hayward that we don't have to overpay for? I have no idea why some of you, mainly Core4, are taking this so personally, but it's stupid as hell.

No, I'm not taking it personally. Again, if/when Hayward opts out in 3 years, are you willing to give him a 5/30% contract (i.e. $20M+). And by doing so, what young players are you willing to let go? Is Hayward a superstar that you can pay like a superstar? Bad franchises lock themselves into contracts with overvalued players, whether it be a role player or a good, but not great player. Bad franchises also set these terrible precedents for their future FA's. Hey, I'm not a max player, but Jazz just gave Hayward a huge deal. I played as well as he did, so I want $15M!

I HATE letting an asset go - a lottery pick at that - without getting anything in return. But don't sign an Bargnani or Stoudemire for way over his value. KOC didn't panic after he couldn't obtain Maggette or Terry. He waited one season and got Boozer and Okur. Can't get Parsons? Ok, wait until the deadline. We'll be the one team with a **** load of cap space to acquire a good SF from a team looking to rebuild. Can't make deadline deal? Then look for FA's or trades next summer.

Edit: yes, fishonjazz. I forgot Indiana matching the offer for Hibbert. At least they made a mistake on a BIG. Dominant centers are hard to find. WE're talking about a passive SF. A SF...the most plentiful position in the league. No, we're not going to find a 16/5/5 player in the next 3 days. We might draft one. we could trade for one. Hell, I'd rather have a guy like Deng than Hayward.

 

[fishonjazz]

Interesting point from Locke

Good post

Thats good info

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

No, I'm not taking it personally. Again, if/when Hayward opts out in 3 years, are you willing to give him a 5/30% contract (i.e. $20M+). And by doing so, what young players are you willing to let go? Is Hayward a superstar that you can pay like a superstar? Bad franchises lock themselves into contracts with overvalued players, whether it be a role player or a good, but not great player. Bad franchises also set these terrible precedents for their future FA's. Hey, I'm not a max player, but Jazz just gave Hayward a huge deal. I played as well as he did, so I want $15M!

I HATE letting an asset go - a lottery pick at that - without getting anything in return. But don't sign an Bargnani or Stoudemire for way over his value. KOC didn't panic after he couldn't obtain Maggette or Terry. He waited one season and got Boozer and Okur. Can't get Parsons? Ok, wait until the deadline. We'll be the one team with a **** load of cap space to acquire a good SF from a team looking to rebuild. Can't make deadline deal? Then look for FA's or trades next summer.

If he has played his way into 20 M at that point aren't you doing cartwheels about the current deal... worrying about that 4th year option is a little silly if he is overpaid right.

 

[fishonjazz]

You don't let your best player walk because of several million dollars a year.

Said washington (gilbert arenas) toronto (bargnani) indiana (hibbert) and many other teams who made the mistake of giving foolish contracts to undeserving players.

Atlanta was all like "we cant let our best player go" when they paid joe johnson.

 

[Coach Ellis]

Now imagine you work for a company that is okay, but not great. Your in a fairly crappy area of the country and are offered that 500k by another similar company in a comparable area of the country. Only that this company has had more recent success. You'd be a frickin moron to pass on that if your company doesn't match.

Players don't take salary cuts to stay on lottery teams. They take salary cuts on perennial contenders. And no one turns down 16 M over 4 years that is in Hayward's place. These guys aren't fans of the Jazz they are employees... they should not be asked to take a pay cut for the greater good... especially when we can just trade them when something better comes along.

Great post. It's just the nature of the business. Hayward has gone about it as a professional, and hasn't burned any bridges. I remember when both Eric Gordon and Roy Hibbert begged their teams not to match the contracts. Hayward hasn't done anything like that. It's a transaction. He wanted more than $12 million last year, so he bet on himself and won. He got a $4 million dollar bump to that contract per year even in a down year. There's been a number of people who have felt like the basketball professionals have a lot more interest and respect for Gordon Hayward than the fans do. If the Jazz hadn't been coached by Ty Corbin into the dumpster fire that they were last year, I think this would be an easy decision. He's gotten better every year, even though he's digressed in specific areas recently.

I'm expecting the Jazz to match the contract and I hope that Quin Snyder's tutelage and system are a really good fit for him. You don't match this contract looking to trade him (although that's not out of the realm of possibilities). . . you match this contract expecting that four years from now, Exum is a legit #1 option and looking for a 5 year max. If Hayward outplays the contract, you win because you had the foresight to match it. If he underplays the contract, you get what you can out of him for 3 or 4 years and then use the cap space to replace him.

 

[Stifle Tower]

They'll likely have $25-30mm in cap space next summer. Who are these 3 marquee players that can be had for <$30mm combined?

Is Hayward a marquee player? That should be the #1 consideration.
Does having Gordon at 25% of the cap and then likely 30% (if he even AGREES to re-sign in 3 years) make it impossible to build a contender?

 

[b_line]

One question I have is can the Jazz make their own contract with a guaranteed fourth year, or do they only have the option of the exact offer charlotte gives him once the offer is signed?

 

[fishonjazz]

I get that you like Burks, and you are my bro. But there is no way in hell Burks is better than Hayward.

I like me some Burks too, but Hayward is so much better all around than Burks. Hayward has playmaking abilities that Burks will never have, Hayward's defense is better, and Hayward has better size.

Sorry bro but at the end of last year there were quite a few posters who believed burks to be better than hayward...... despite being younger, less experienced and more screwed over by corbin.

I know naos, and billy shelby think burks is better and they were never burks homers.

I think bawse dawg does too.
Gvc is a maybe.

Doublea does
Ellis might

Then there are about 5 burks homers that believe he is better.

Spycam and revolution might think burks is better.

Thats just off the top of my head.


Point is, burks is my favorite player in the nba and i would say hell no to the jazz offering him a contract like this

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Said washington (gilbert arenas) toronto (bargnani) indiana (hibbert) and many other teams who made the mistake of giving foolish contracts to undeserving players.

Atlanta was all like "we cant let our best player go" when they paid joe johnson.

All of those guys were tradeable too... in most case they got assets back for those guys. If Indiana wanted to trade Hibbert they could absolutely get more than just expirings.

 

[fishonjazz]

Who? Favors is the only one who is as good or better than Hayward at this point.

Well you just answered your own ? Didnt ya