You have some insider info on the deals KOC turned down?
What college do you boost for?
It has begun
- Thread starter pickledXgrandma
- Start date
You have some insider info on the deals KOC turned down?
What college do you boost for?
Jazz needs a future quality PG.
1) It's widely known that GSW would tank (GSW traded for an injured Bogut at the dateline + Curry's ankle)
2) Jazz intends to make the playoffs (they must have decided this quite early on)
3) Meaning we weren't going to have a 1st round pick this year
4) KOC did nothing at the trade dateline to position himself for even a chance of a lottery pick this year
That's my point.
The End.
1) It's widely known that GSW would tank (GSW traded for an injured Bogut at the dateline + Curry's ankle)
2) Jazz intends to make the playoffs (they must have decided this quite early on)
3) Meaning we weren't going to have a 1st round pick this year
4) KOC did nothing at the trade dateline to position himself for even a chance of a lottery pick this year
That's my point.
The End.
My point is that you're usually a pretty bad poster and continue with this trend in this thread.
I forgive you. Rep'd.
margodydek
Well-Known Member
You seem pretty confident that this offer was on the table, as well as the theory that KOC turned it down. My guess is neither is true.
margodydek
Well-Known Member
Usually when teams are trying to make the playoffs they kind of accept the fact that if they do they won't be getting a lottery pick. Also, teams that are in the lottery (or poised to be in the lottery) aren't usually keen on giving up their pick (especially pre-lotto balls) unless Billy King is your GM.
I think these past 2 years where the Jazz have had lottery picks have spoiled Jazz fans. Maybe I'm wrong, but I hardly ever hear Spurs, Lakers, Celtics, Nuggets fans complaining that their GM didn't sell the farm to get a lottery pick.
Also, I hate when people complain that we didn't get a lottery pick when the draft hasn't even happened. My guess is that if KOC does have his eye on somebody (say Lillard for example) that he's not going to trade for the #12 pick in hopes that Lillard will be around at #12. I assume he'd most likely wait to see who picks him, or if he (Lillard) falls far enough that KOC would then pounce and make a deal to get him. So that's my guess; unless KOC gets a great offer beforehand, if we do get into the lottery it will either be during the draft to either pick the guy we want, or after the guy we want is picked - KOC will then make a trade to acquire him.
orangello
Well-Known Member
You mean like when the Spurs traded Hill to get Leonard? That is crazy talk. This never happens!
margodydek
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure if this is supposed to be sarcastic or not, but that is exactly the kind of trade I would see KOC making if he intends to go after someone in particular.
orangello
Well-Known Member
Sarcastic, yes. Truthful, yes. The thing that I really liked about that trade is it really helped both teams. The Pacers got further into the playoffs, and SA got to the conference finals for the first time in a while.
I honestly believe that KOC does have something up his sleeve and that all the chatter we are hearing about is due to having multiple options depending on if a certain player or two is available. I think that the draft could be very exciting as a Jazz fan.
It is a little depressing that there is nothing sure fire for the first round though.
mellow
Well-Known Member
I want to believe that too, but I am gaurding (or tempering) my hopes with memories of the 2010 draft. Boozer was leaving, Memo was hurt, we had traded Brewer, Mathews had emerged but was a FA, AK was expiring. And the Jazz had a lottery pick from NY. I figured the Jazz were going to make something happen.....and then Hayward happened, then Al, not the summer I thought KOC had up his sleeve.
orangello
Well-Known Member
You left out Bell.
orangello
Well-Known Member
On a more serious note, that year had very different expectations. They were trying to compete for a title. The team was motivated to get DWill help. They didn't want to bring in newly drafted players to try and get to a level that could contribute. It made total sense that they brought in Jefferson and Bell to fill the voids that were left by Boozer and Matthews.
This year they are not going to be contending for a title. They are looking to build for the future while still winning games. Last year was perfect for that. This year Favors and Hayward can start to emerge as the true leaders of the team going forward. Bringing in a couple more young pieces sounds like something that can happen while still fulfilling the goals that the team has. I do think that if KOC picks up any more pieces through the draft they will likely be Junior or Senior players that can come in an contribute immediately but still grow with the core that i already in place.
I can't tell if you meant that as a negative.
KOC drafting Hayward ended up being the best possible thing that could have happened. The draft pretty much stunk after that (besides Paul George). KOC did a great job grabbing a guy many thought was a pick in the 15-20's with the 9th pick.
The trade for Al was good example of what I call the "Last Hope Trade". The Magic did it by trading for Arenas and Turk, the Jazz did it by trading for Al. It's a GM's last hope for surrounding a super star with talent, even though that talent is unproven (and overpaid) in a winning culture, to try to capture some kind of success to convince the star to stay.
mellow
Well-Known Member
No, but at the time I certainly felt it was negative. Not at all the direction I thought the team was going, and I was quite disappointed that no other moves were made. KOC just wouldn't cooperate with my plans.
So this year I am tempering my expectations. It is very tempting to dream about all the moves KOC will strike, but if I get caught up in that I end up doing something stupid like booing the Hayward pick.
The Fresh Prince
Well-Known Member
Are you a female?
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
i understand the case for patience, i really do. but right now the jazz are in an asset position that they just won't have in a couple of years. i don't want them to make a deal just for the sake of making a deal, but it feels a lot like they're one bold move away from a pretty decent team, and that bold move is a going to be a lot easier to make with this set of assets:
al's $15M expiring contract (can be used between now and february)
devin's $8.5M expiring contract (can be used between now and february)
paul's $7.2M expiring contract (can be used between now and february) - although his cap hit is lower and i wouldn't advocate trading paul
memo's $11.5M TPE (can be used between now and december)
GSW pick (can be used between now and june)
2013 cap space (can be used between now and next summer)
if we win a title in the next 10 years, it's going to be because we did something special with those assets, and all of them have a limited shelf life.
al's $15M expiring contract (can be used between now and february)
devin's $8.5M expiring contract (can be used between now and february)
paul's $7.2M expiring contract (can be used between now and february) - although his cap hit is lower and i wouldn't advocate trading paul
memo's $11.5M TPE (can be used between now and december)
GSW pick (can be used between now and june)
2013 cap space (can be used between now and next summer)
if we win a title in the next 10 years, it's going to be because we did something special with those assets, and all of them have a limited shelf life.
The Shocker
Banned
How many of those first five "assets" are really that attractive though? Attractive enough, even when bundled, to bring us back something that puts a better team on the floor, a "pretty decent team"? In order to truly get better, to make a noticeable leap, I think we'd have to truly be bold and include someone like Burks, Hayward or Kanter in the deal. That or trade Millsap along with the GS pick AND either a future unprotected 1st OR Burks, Hayward, or Kanter. And I doubt that's a move KOC would be willing to make just yet given their youth and upside.
I'd also ask who is out there, either on the block or seemingly within reason to be traded, who is a big upgrade and would make us noticeably better? Can we come up with a short list of names? Iggy? Gay? These are reasonable. But who else?
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
well that's the million dollar question, right? but my point is, after next summer we're just going to be another team with young guys' extensions kicking in, and a draft pick and an MLE each year to better ourselves. the time to make an all-in, franchise defining move is in the next 12-14 months.
don't underestimate the importance of that TPE. some of the provisions of the new CBA were scaled in, meaning teams' numbers are going to get increasingly tight and a lot of teams would probably give back some real value in exchange for us taking some salary off their hands.... like we did by having OKC absorb harp's contract, or when we were on the receiving end in 2003-04 and got that nice stockpile of draft picks (which we turned into DW, which we turned into this young core).