Its Time to Tank
- Thread starter Handlogten's Heros
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Pacers hang-up the phone on you.
Yeah, possibly. Utah can give him time away from the court and away from the media. We tank, get Victor, then Ben starts feeling better and we dangerous AF.
I'd do the same kind of deal for Lonzo Ball too.
Talent and size wins rings buddy. Sometimes you got to take risk.
Handlogten's Heros
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The mental stuff on Ben scares me more than the physical stuff. I think guys can get healthy but I struggle when a guy has both mental and physical issues.
I'd rather bet on Lonzo, Porter Jr (not that he is available...), even Hayward... though he's old. Ben is a no-go for me.
Jazz 134-123 76ers (Feb 15, 2021) Box Score - ESPN
Box score for the Utah Jazz vs. Philadelphia 76ers NBA game from February 15, 2021 on ESPN. Includes all points, rebounds and steals stats.
Simmons still the dude who once did this to the Jazz. I'd say that's worth the risk of giving up Beasley and Sexton.
SoberasHotRod
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I just looked up his contract. He's owed $40M in 24/25. That's too much of a risk.
lmao
I do think it's pretty clear the Jazz as currently constructed are probably a .500 team give or take a few wins.
I dont think it's an awful place to be because of the amount of picks we have, but I do think the best move is probably getting worse. It will just be a bit depressing going from being the feel good story of the year to just another ****** team.
I dont think it's an awful place to be because of the amount of picks we have, but I do think the best move is probably getting worse. It will just be a bit depressing going from being the feel good story of the year to just another ****** team.
Handlogten's Heros
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The money is the biggest thing... and no... he is not that player mentally or physically. I don't think he loves basketball and has made his money now... no motivation to fake it.Jazz 134-123 76ers (Feb 15, 2021) Box Score - ESPN
Box score for the Utah Jazz vs. Philadelphia 76ers NBA game from February 15, 2021 on ESPN. Includes all points, rebounds and steals stats.www.espn.com
Simmons still the dude who once did this to the Jazz. I'd say that's worth the risk of giving up Beasley and Sexton.
Handlogten's Heros
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Nah... but a few weeks from now it might be. 6-8 range is doable and the increased odds are still worth it imo. Lakers, Bulls, Minny, Nets really have no motivation to tank as their picks are owned by others.
David Stern
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I hate how sensitive our fan base is to the “he’ll get sick of Utah and leave” narrative, but if there was ever a guy who would rehab his value and then demand a trade to a bigger market, it would be Simmons. There’s basically all risk with almost no upside here
HermanG
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I dont think its the same dude... he used to fight like hell but then he got his money and revealed his lack of love for basketball.Jazz 134-123 76ers (Feb 15, 2021) Box Score - ESPN
Box score for the Utah Jazz vs. Philadelphia 76ers NBA game from February 15, 2021 on ESPN. Includes all points, rebounds and steals stats.
Simmons still the dude who once did this to the Jazz. I'd say that's worth the risk of giving up Beasley and Sexton.
I mean, in that game I posted he had his fat contract already.
6-8 range is typically around 30 wins.
We're not gonna finish 20-46. Even if we sell off Conley and Clarkson for nothing, like, today, with the sheer volume of tanking teams on our schedule, there's just no way.
Handlogten's Heros
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Our main competition in that tank range is OKC and SA... almost all of our games against them come in the final 20 games. If we are in range we might have a key injury or give Ochai, Dok, 48 minutes a night to develop.
We can absolutely go 20-46 if we offload Mike, JC, or a couple other vets and elevate the play of developing players (which is what drives teams down). OKC's guys are finally mostly good... SA likely doesn't completely pull the plug, Indiana doesn't have a history of tanking and may be cool with the young core they have built. We are only a few games away from those teams. Over 66 games we can perform 3-4 games worse than those teams.
If we roll with Ochai, Simone, Sexton, THT in the place of Mike, JC, and a couple other vets... and they happen to play well enough that we end up 9th or 10th... then that is okay because it means those guys are likely keepers.
Handlogten's Heros
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The tank trade du jour... Kyrie has one basketball option... LA. Lebron already backed Ky sort of. Brooklyn likely takes any useable players they can get as I think they are out on Irving (unless NBPA comes in and forces them to reinstate him).
So we send JC or Mike to Brooklyn with KO... They send Kyrie to LA and we send Malik to the Lakers too (I can flip flop KO and Beasley depending on who the Nets and Lakers want). We get 1 unprotected pick from the Lakers... either 25 or 26. Brooklyn also gives us second choice in the complicated pick scheme we are already involved in. Likely not any difference there for them but gives that pick a smidge more upside. We also take and waive Westbrook.
Talent wise the Lakers have no chance to do better with their draft assets and it leaves the door open to do another deal or have cap space. They can also keep Ky and Beasley. Brooklyn needs a guy that can handle the ball and good NBA rotation players... also get to move on from Kyrie.
We lose 3 rotation players firmly throwing us in the 6-8 range.
So we send JC or Mike to Brooklyn with KO... They send Kyrie to LA and we send Malik to the Lakers too (I can flip flop KO and Beasley depending on who the Nets and Lakers want). We get 1 unprotected pick from the Lakers... either 25 or 26. Brooklyn also gives us second choice in the complicated pick scheme we are already involved in. Likely not any difference there for them but gives that pick a smidge more upside. We also take and waive Westbrook.
Talent wise the Lakers have no chance to do better with their draft assets and it leaves the door open to do another deal or have cap space. They can also keep Ky and Beasley. Brooklyn needs a guy that can handle the ball and good NBA rotation players... also get to move on from Kyrie.
We lose 3 rotation players firmly throwing us in the 6-8 range.
That was Clarkson's 40 pt game with 8 3's as well. Damn that was a crazy game. Simmons laid it all out there and we still won.Jazz 134-123 76ers (Feb 15, 2021) Box Score - ESPN
Box score for the Utah Jazz vs. Philadelphia 76ers NBA game from February 15, 2021 on ESPN. Includes all points, rebounds and steals stats.
Simmons still the dude who once did this to the Jazz. I'd say that's worth the risk of giving up Beasley and Sexton.
But as others have said, he is not the same person at all. I would pass. The only way would be if he were coming on a barely the minimum deal for 1 year to check things out. Otherwise, just say no.
So we're also just going to be benching our best remaining players?
This is the type of thing you do to have a great chance at a top 2-3 pick. Not something in the 6-8 range.