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Its Time to Tank

Eddie Zero said:
We could easily draft Miller at 9th imo if he slides like I am expecting. Keyonte is a top 6 lock barring being at a murder scene and squeeling tot he prosection to save himself. imo and we are not drafting Keonte either if we jump to 1-4.
The only reason the prosecution has a case is with Millers testimony, so he was not charged.
f that college star soon to be NBA bum -snitches get stiches
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Brandon Miller got a higher chance of going #2 than dropping below 3
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Brandon Miller got a higher chance of going #2 than dropping below 3
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Change it to #4 and I'd agree. If his school and the police don't care about the incident he had I think most NBA teams aren't gonna be all that worried.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Brandon Miller got a higher chance of going #2 than dropping below 3
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right now sure, but its a long ways out ,and more info could surface. It is also not a bad thing if he falls to us lol.
The odds are better right now that one of those desperate tankers like Detroit or Houston just picks him and takes their chances, but not if someone with the same potential is there with no baggage coming into his rookie season.
I think he falls out of the top 4 easily, and free-falls to the late first , if one single bit of evidence surfaces against him
 
idiot said:
Apparently because they think it's the best/only viable rebuilding strategy, thus essentially equating tanking with rebuilding (ie you're not rebuilding unless you're tanking). That's where I think the difference of opinion lies.

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Nah, I think tankers think that the best way to increase the odds of having a better draft pick is to lose. And they think having a better draft pick is more likely to help the team get more talented than having a worse draft pick. I dont think anyone thinks losing is the only possible strategy. I think you are being silly.
 
fishonjazz said:
Nah, I think tankers think that the best way to increase the odds of having a better draft pick is to lose. And they think having a better draft pick is more likely to help the team get more talented than having a worse draft pick. I dont think anyone thinks losing is the only possible strategy. I think you are being silly.
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I'll stand by my statement. Tankers are convinced that a high pick is the path to the best possible rebuild -- among many tanking advocates so much so that any other strategy pales by comparison.

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idiot said:
I think the best evidence that tanking is primarily about losing
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It's literally the definition. Losing is an essential part of the tanking strategy in US sports that base draft picks off the records of teams. Even in the NBA where there's a lottery system involved.

I'm stunned anyone is arguing the opposite, and the only place I've ever heard it being argued differently is here on this forum this season. That's it.
 
This is turning very semantic, but I still think my definition is the simplest. If turning the product bad is the top priority of the rebuilding strategy and the team commits to building through the draft, they are tanking.

Whether you sit your best players, create a dysfunctional team or build a bad roster.. it doesnt matter.. its tanking if the team you put on the court is bad by design.

Rebuilding move is any move that gives away current performance for future benefit. So tanking is always rebuilding but not every rebuild prioritizes tanking.

We are definitely prioritizing evaluation (players and coach), maximizing player development and developing system/culture over tanking and have done that since early season at least. FO not sabotaging might have been promised to Hardy before he even took the job.

I personally think the best way to develop players is to make sure the situation around them is good. Even if a team tanks initially, they need to shift to creating a functional team around the prospects at some point to develop them the right way.
 
idiot said:
I'll stand by my statement. Tankers are convinced that a high pick is the path to the best possible rebuild -- among many tanking advocates so much so that any other strategy pales by comparison.

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You can think that but that just isnt what we have been posting or saying. HH, myself, and jingled are 3 examples of tankers who often post of other ways this rebuild can work and who often are happy when the jazz win.


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idiot said:
I'll stand by my statement. Tankers are convinced that a high pick is the path to the best possible rebuild -- among many tanking advocates so much so that any other strategy pales by comparison.

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It clearly is.

The issue to clearly tank you have to get rid of a lot of good players for less than great value. So it's hard to get the best of both worlds.
 
fishonjazz said:
Nah, I think tankers think that the best way to increase the odds of having a better draft pick is to lose. And they think having a better draft pick is more likely to help the team get more talented than having a worse draft pick. I dont think anyone thinks losing is the only possible strategy. I think you are being silly.
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The rebuild is a soup… tanking (or getting very high draft picks) is a key ingredient to most rebuilds…can you have a good soup without the ingredient… sure. If all the ode is equal though… let’s go ahead and add the best ingredients possible.
 
fishonjazz said:
You can think that but that just isnt what we have been posting or saying. HH, myself, and jingled are 3 examples of tankers who often post of other ways this rebuild can work and who often are happy when the jazz win.


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The anti tankers always throw in absolutes and dumb assumptions that aren’t really true. At this point the best thing for the long term health of the franchise is giving ourselves a better shot at landing a high level young player… having a better pick or better odds at an amazing pick provides that. The doe is cast as far as the current roster goes so we kinda have to play it as it lays. Maybe we end up with a better player at 12 than 8? It’s plausible… it’s not a reason to prefer a couple additional wins imo. It’s pretty simple. If we giving ourselves a 7-8% chance at Wemby and a 25% chance at top 4 it could be a franchise changer. It’s so obviously the preferred path.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
The anti tankers always throw in absolutes and dumb assumptions that aren’t really true. At this point the best thing for the long term health of the franchise is giving ourselves a better shot at landing a high level young player… having a better pick or better odds at an amazing pick provides that. The doe is cast as far as the current roster goes so we kinda have to play it as it lays. Maybe we end up with a better player at 12 than 8? It’s plausible… it’s not a reason to prefer a couple additional wins imo. It’s pretty simple. If we giving ourselves a 7-8% chance at Wemby and a 25% chance at top 4 it could be a franchise changer. It’s so obviously the preferred path.
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The problem for us is getting to those odds. And even if we somehow managed to do it, they are still not good odds. We just have to let this thing play out and give our young guys a lot of minutes. Also, we shouldn't forget the value of play-in experience for our young group if we get to go there.

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