jazz depth= secret weapon

jumpin bean

Well-Known Member
It seems that the silver lining to this season may be the depth of this team.Guys like Ginobli Dwill and Dwade and many others on teams are hurt and like last game with the shorthanded bucks gave us a huge advantage.Iknow we had a lil bite of the injury bug last night but not anything to derail the ship,so with this secret weapon of alot of good players that can fill in and keep us competitive while injuries can derail alot of teams this year ,how far can this strength take us? to the playoffs,or just good enough to take us to a worse pick?
 

Gyp Rosetti

Banned
It seems that the silver lining to this season may be the depth of this team.Guys like Ginobli Dwill and Dwade and many others on teams are hurt and like last game with the shorthanded bucks gave us a huge advantage.Iknow we had a lil bite of the injury bug last night but not anything to derail the ship,so with this secret weapon of alot of good players that can fill in and keep us competitive while injuries can derail alot of teams this year ,how far can this strength take us? to the playoffs,or just good enough to take us to a worse pick?
Secret weapon? I, and many others on the board, said this could be a big advantage prior to the season starting. Go jump back into seclusion beanclown.
 

Jazz Spazz

Inconceivable
Staff member
The Jazz's chief weapon is surprise... and fear.

Our two weapons are surprise, fear.. and ruthless efficiency.

Our three weapons are surprise, fear, ruthless efficiency... and an almost fanatical devotion to spelling and grammar.

Amongst our weaponry are surprise, fear, ruthless efficiency, an almost fanatical devotion to spelling and grammar... and a night out at a Jazz game.

Aaaaarghhhhh!

Cardinal Biggles, you will have to say it.
 

jumpin bean

Well-Known Member
loosetooth your so funny.I think we may make the playoffs just because of this factor ,and I didnt see you thought of that and thats why I asked the question.
 

LjJazzman

Well-Known Member
The Jazz's chief weapon is surprise... and fear.

Our two weapons are surprise, fear.. and ruthless efficiency.

Our three weapons are surprise, fear, ruthless efficiency... and an almost fanatical devotion to spelling and grammar.

Amongst our weaponry are surprise, fear, ruthless efficiency, an almost fanatical devotion to spelling and grammar... and a night out at a Jazz game.

Aaaaarghhhhh!

Cardinal Biggles, you will have to say it.
After the first line I was hoping thats the direction you were going. Rep'd, thats how I plea.
 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
Our best secret weapon apparently, is that when we don't play good teams we don't get blown out....

As usual, Jazz fans go crazy when we win... Even if it was against a crappy Bucks team playing without Bogut in SLC....

I don't buy the depth issue at all. We have some size inside. But I wouldn't exactly call us deep... Having a 4 guard rotation of Hayward, CJ, Raja, and Burks doesn't scare anyone. You combine all 4 and you might have a half decent wing. Harris, Earl, and Tinsley is ok... It's not great. But it's okay.
 

Jazz Spazz

Inconceivable
Staff member
I don't buy the depth issue at all. We have some size inside. But I wouldn't exactly call us deep...
How many players do we have that can spend time at the PG spot?
4 - Harris, Watson, Tinsley, Burks

How many players do we have that can hold down the 5 spot?
3- Jefferson, Favors, Kanter

How many players do we have that can play the 4?
5- Jefferson, Favors, Kanter, Milsap, Evans

How many players do we have that can play the 3?
4- Howard, Hayward, CJ, Evans

How many players do we have that can play the 2?
3- Hayward, Burks, CJ ... Bell can be a body, but he sucks too much to put on the list.

That would be called depth. If Jefferson got hurt, we wouldn't really be hurting for somebody to play his spot. If CJ got hurt we wouldn't cry because of the "drop off" in productivity... ok, bad example. If Harris got hurt, we wouldn't really cry that Watson got more minutes. We have guys that can play and fill in pretty much any spot at or close to the same level as the other guys. In my world, that would be considered depth.

/argument
 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
How many players do we have that can spend time at the PG spot?
4 - Harris, Watson, Tinsley, Burks

How many players do we have that can hold down the 5 spot?
3- Jefferson, Favors, Kanter

How many players do we have that can play the 4?
5- Jefferson, Favors, Kanter, Milsap, Evans

How many players do we have that can play the 3?
4- Howard, Hayward, CJ, Evans

How many players do we have that can play the 2?
3- Hayward, Burks, CJ ... Bell can be a body, but he sucks too much to put on the list.

That would be called depth. If Jefferson got hurt, we wouldn't really be hurting for somebody to play his spot. If CJ got hurt we wouldn't cry because of the "drop off" in productivity... ok, bad example. If Harris got hurt, we wouldn't really cry that Watson got more minutes. We have guys that can play and fill in pretty much any spot at or close to the same level as the other guys. In my world, that would be considered depth.

/argument
Having a bunch of average or below average players doesn't make a team deep.

Unfortunately, the Jazz have 1-3 have a host of average to below average players. I'm sorry folks, but Hayward isn't Larry Bird and CJ isn't Ray Allen. And Raja... Yikes... Can we really even call him an NBA player still?

The mere fact that for the most part our 1-3s have been unimpressive has actually forced Corbin to look for new lineups. Think Burks would be getting any burn if Raja could just do what most had hoped he could do when he signed his contract?

The Jazz are not a deep team yet.
 

Stoked

Well-Known Member
Contributor
2018 Award Winner
Having a bunch of average or below average players doesn't make a team deep.

Unfortunately, the Jazz have 1-3 have a host of average to below average players. I'm sorry folks, but Hayward isn't Larry Bird and CJ isn't Ray Allen. And Raja... Yikes... Can we really even call him an NBA player still?

The mere fact that for the most part our 1-3s have been unimpressive has actually forced Corbin to look for new lineups. Think Burks would be getting any burn if Raja could just do what most had hoped he could do when he signed his contract?

The Jazz are not a deep team yet.
Hayward will bever be a Ray Allen level shooter. However I think he will do alot of the little things and hopefully be a piece that makes this chaos we call the Jazz work.
 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
Hayward will bever be a Ray Allen level shooter. However I think he will do alot of the little things and hopefully be a piece that makes this chaos we call the Jazz work.
This is key.

Right now we have a lot of players that COULD or WILL be good.

Unfortunately, they're not very good right now. Hayward, our best wing, is averaging 8 points on 42 % shooting and 27 % 3 pt shooting. Yikes.

We're not a very deep or good team right now. And it shows with our record. We're decent against crappy teams at home. We're pathetic against good teams on the road. We have yet to beat a team with a winning record. Those teams we've played with winning records, have destroyed us by double digits. Sometimes, you just can't argue with results even if your emotions are just soooo soooo soooo tied up with this team.

We are still a few trades/drafts away and a good 2-3 years away from being considered a "deep" team. That's the truth. Doesn't mean it has to be horrible to watch this team grow up. But it does mean that folks need to be a tad more realistic. This team isn't deep or very good right now.
 

Stoked

Well-Known Member
Contributor
2018 Award Winner
This is key.

Right now we have a lot of players that COULD or WILL be good.

Unfortunately, they're not very good right now. Hayward, our best wing, is averaging 8 points on 42 % shooting and 27 % 3 pt shooting. Yikes.

We're not a very deep or good team right now. And it shows with our record. We're decent against crappy teams at home. We're pathetic against good teams on the road. We have yet to beat a team with a winning record. Those teams we've played with winning records, have destroyed us by double digits. Sometimes, you just can't argue with results even if your emotions are just soooo soooo soooo tied up with this team.

We are still a few trades/drafts away and a good 2-3 years away from being considered a "deep" team. That's the truth. Doesn't mean it has to be horrible to watch this team grow up. But it does mean that folks need to be a tad more realistic. This team isn't deep or very good right now.
Oh I agree. None of them are there yet and chances are that not all of them will develop as we want. I am hoping for 3 out of 4 though. I am not expecting playoffs or anything really huge this year. This year should be used to see if the pieces we have are the proper pieces to "move forward" with. Then make the necessary changes and draft picks based on that.
 

Guitaro

Well-Known Member
Our best secret weapon apparently, is that when we don't play good teams we don't get blown out....

As usual, Jazz fans go crazy when we win... Even if it was against a crappy Bucks team playing without Bogut in SLC....

I don't buy the depth issue at all. We have some size inside. But I wouldn't exactly call us deep... Having a 4 guard rotation of Hayward, CJ, Raja, and Burks doesn't scare anyone. You combine all 4 and you might have a half decent wing. Harris, Earl, and Tinsley is ok... It's not great. But it's okay.
Well, isn't that his point? They don't scare people so we surprise them. I do think that some teams do still fear playing in the ESA building. As for efficiency, we're pretty far from that. Although, we are getting better as a team. Even as fans, we're getting better as being realistic. However, we still have a ways to go. Go Team Awesome! ;) lol
 

InGameStrategy

Well-Known Member
The Jazz's depth, the team's youth, and the compressed season are why the "conventional" wisdom of tightening up the lineup (practiced by Nissalke, Sloan, etc.) is especially not appropriate for this season.
 

Guitaro

Well-Known Member
This is key.

Right now we have a lot of players that COULD or WILL be good.

Unfortunately, they're not very good right now. Hayward, our best wing, is averaging 8 points on 42 % shooting and 27 % 3 pt shooting. Yikes.

We're not a very deep or good team right now. And it shows with our record. We're decent against crappy teams at home. We're pathetic against good teams on the road. We have yet to beat a team with a winning record. Those teams we've played with winning records, have destroyed us by double digits. Sometimes, you just can't argue with results even if your emotions are just soooo soooo soooo tied up with this team.

We are still a few trades/drafts away and a good 2-3 years away from being considered a "deep" team. That's the truth. Doesn't mean it has to be horrible to watch this team grow up. But it does mean that folks need to be a tad more realistic. This team isn't deep or very good right now.
I agree to a point. We have been terrible at times and pretty good at times. Although, even at home, we're pretty sloppy. The positive is that we have really stepped up our defense. Seems that will be the Jazz's strength going forward. Guys just have to be a lot more patient on our passing and setting up the offense.

Another positive is that every game it seems someone makes a major step forward in their progress. Even though Burks could score before, I thought his decisions were much improved. I also think Favors is getting smarter on staying out of foul trouble early.

Finally, it seems that Corbin has had to learn what kind of players he has and when to use them. I thought his substitutions were much better than they've been. He still needs to tweak it a bit more so that teams don't go on such big runs (calling more timeouts is a start). Still, our team is made up of smarter than average players. Smarter players usually make faster progress than average. These last few games have shown this.

Of course, like Thriller is saying, don't get overexcited too early. They will improve but they'll also take steps backwards. It's part of being a young team. To succeed, they'll just need to learn from their mistakes and not keep making them over and over.

Finally, don't be too hard on them. This season's rough schedule will make it harder to tell if they're making good progress or not. It's mainly because most teams will make more mistakes than usual because of fatigue (mental and physical).
 

Cope

Well-Known Member
Depth? Is it because we can now have 13 on the bench?

Depth is more defined of having good players starting and good players off the bench. The jazz have good depth per say because we are average all the way around. When our TOP player to some is a black hole who averages less than one point per possession that's not a good start. Let alone our wing play. Watson is a great backup PG, probably the best we have had since Eisley. The problem is we don't have a Stockton or DWill ahead of him either. I guess you could classify that as depth but unfortunately that's not going to cut it in the NBA.

Team ball where you don't have stars works in high school and on Hoosiers the movie but rarely in the NBA (Pistons runs but that's it)

I'll trade 4 pieces of this so called depth for a Star tomorrow. If we knew we could keep Dwight for years would you give up Millsap, Jefferson, Hayward, and let's say Watson? I mean that's a lot of depth we would be giving up but most probably would.
 

gomretat

Well-Known Member
I am as excited an anyone about the young players and their development. But lets be honest. The only reason why it appears that we have depth is because we don't have stars who make the gap between the starters and the bench. We are OK but still not a playoff team unless the injuries keep mounting up for other WC teams.
 

Brown Notes

Well-Known Member
Favors is already a very good bench player and when he takes Sap's spot Paul will be one of the best. Howard has brought a lot of energy and has had an impact off the bench. Burks looks like he will be special. Watson is a very good backup point. Kanter has already displayed a high level NBA skill.

The back court doesn't look good because they have been playing preseason ball. When we see the guards setting screens and cutting like they are supposed to we will see better production. Funny that some people are either surprised or wringing their hands with glee watching this ugly lockout ball. It should be obvious that established vet teams like the Spurs will be taking advantage of a young team with a lot of new pieces/coach.

But as raw as the team looks we have a lot of bodies with a lot of athleticism. So long as Corbin can keep them hustling they will be able to play decent D and score even when they struggle in the half court. We should be able to steal some games just due to attrition and fatigue. That defines depth pretty well.
 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
Well, isn't that his point? They don't scare people so we surprise them. I do think that some teams do still fear playing in the ESA building. As for efficiency, we're pretty far from that. Although, we are getting better as a team. Even as fans, we're getting better as being realistic. However, we still have a ways to go. Go Team Awesome! ;) lol
No.

No one fears ESA because everyone knows that this team isn't very good.

Again, look at what the good teams have done to us. They've all destroyed us by double digits and the we have been completely and utterly dominated. Until this team starts beating teams good teams a lot more consistently, this team and ESA will not be feared. The building itself doesn't do anything. The team however, determines whether we win or lose. We all hope for more Ws but realistically, we're going to see a hell of a lot of Ls.

This team is still pretty damn poor. The offense still struggled against one completely suck Bucks team.

This team has a long ways to go. They would be blown out by 20+ by the Deron, Boozer, and Memo led Jazz team a few years back. And even that team, was never really a serious contender.
 

Saint Cy of JFC

Well-Known Member
No.

No one fears ESA because everyone knows that this team isn't very good.

Again, look at what the good teams have done to us. They've all destroyed us by double digits and the we have been completely and utterly dominated. Until this team starts beating teams good teams a lot more consistently, this team and ESA will not be feared. The building itself doesn't do anything. The team however, determines whether we win or lose. We all hope for more Ws but realistically, we're going to see a hell of a lot of Ls.

This team is still pretty damn poor. The offense still struggled against one completely suck Bucks team.

This team has a long ways to go. They would be blown out by 20+ by the Deron, Boozer, and Memo led Jazz team a few years back. And even that team, was never really a serious contender.
We beat the Sixers. They are definitely a playoff team in the East this year.
 
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