Lauri + Tank

[KqWIN]

With Kessler it's going to be tough. If he looks great he's going to hurt the tank, but then I won't want to trade him. I'm already prepared to admit my hypocrisy there.

Right….personally I feel more of that with Sexton, but I get it with both players. If either of those two (or both) lead us to anti tank….I think we just have to live with that possibility. It’s not a terrible thing to happen. It’s the same if it were Key, Taylor, or any of the other youngins that produced those wins.

Going back to what I said about worrying about “how” those wins come, I don’t think it would be a failure if we kept them and they popped and that’s what lead to an unexpectedly good start. I would say it would be a failure to keep playing them through the entire season to pursue nothing. To me it’s a given that Hardy would pull the plug midway (and likely earlier this season) but maybe that’s not the case.

I think I’d be unhappiest if it was JCx2 leading the anti tank change, but being realistic they don’t have value so it would cost something to get rid of them. I don’t prefer that, so I can’t really blame the FO for keeping them at the moment.

I actually quite like the way the roster is set up. I feel like there’s a reason everyone is here even if is mayyyyybe better if we traded them (Sexton/Kessler). We don’t have a long list of vets that theoretically could be traded for value like the previous two years.

 

[Hedda Gambler]

We have one all star player in Lauri Markkanen, one decent starter in Collin Sexton and two proven rotation players in John Collins and Jordan Clarkson. Keyonte George, Taylor Hendricks, Walker Kessler, Brice Sensabaugh, Cody Williams and Isaiah Collier will most likely all see a lot of playing time while not being able to contribute to winning basketball.

I have a hard time seeing this team win many games and can`t frankly see a single team in the West that we are better than. San Antonio have Wemby, Vassell, Barnes and Chris Paul. Portland have surprisingly many decent players and players on rookie deals that should be at least as good as ours.

If two or three of our young players take huge leaps, my analysis will turn out to be dead wrong, which obviously be great. If they don`t, I have a hard time seeing how this team will be able to stay in games when we have to give major minutes to our young dudes. I know that Hardy has worked wonders before, but the difference now is that the FO has taken so many options off his hands by trading or not extending vets that he truly has to work miracles to make us competitive in most games.

 

[royzzz]

How strongly does the team value getting a possible top 7 2025 draft pick? Would they/you sacrifice cap space for a chance to get one?
Would you trade Collins, 2025 pick from CLE or MIN plus other draft picks for Blazer's Grant AND their 2025 draft pick? Or for Wizards Poole AND their 2025 draft pick?
Or some iteration of Collins, Sexton and/or JC plus picks for whomever Blazers' or Wizards' want to get rid of (due to high salary and more years than Collins) AND 2025 draft pick?
Will these players move the needle? Slim to none. But Jazz gets that very high chance for a top 7 draft pick.
Plus Jazz can now play to win without worrying not having a lottery pick.
If they win and convey their draft pick to OKC, there's still that Blazers or Wizards draft pick to use.
If they still lose, that's 2 lottery picks in what pundits call a very strong draft class.

 

[fishonjazz]

More Questions:

- What would you consider a successful Tank + Lauri - e.g. best lottery odds, 5th best lottery odds, etc.?
- What players are you willing to give up for lesser value to help the tank? How much less value?

1. Bottom 5 is my successful tank mark.

2. I would attach first round picks to Clarkson and Collins to get them out of here.

Sent from my CPH2451 using Tapatalk

 

[fishonjazz]

How strongly does the team value getting a possible top 7 2025 draft pick? Would they/you sacrifice cap space for a chance to get one?
Would you trade Collins, 2025 pick from CLE or MIN plus other draft picks for Blazer's Grant AND their 2025 draft pick? Or for Wizards Poole AND their 2025 draft pick?
Or some iteration of Collins, Sexton and/or JC plus picks for whomever Blazers' or Wizards' want to get rid of (due to high salary and more years than Collins) AND 2025 draft pick?
Will these players move the needle? Slim to none. But Jazz gets that very high chance for a top 7 draft pick.
Plus Jazz can now play to win without worrying not having a lottery pick.
If they win and convey their draft pick to OKC, there's still that Blazers or Wizards draft pick to use.
If they still lose, that's 2 lottery picks in what pundits call a very strong draft class.

I don't think blazers or wizards would be willing to trade their 2025 pick.

Sent from my CPH2451 using Tapatalk

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

More Questions:

- What would you consider a successful Tank + Lauri - e.g. best lottery odds, 5th best lottery odds, etc.?
- What players are you willing to give up for lesser value to help the tank? How much less value?

Bottom 3
Sexton, Collins, and Clarkson

I would be willing to just get a single first for Sexton as long as it's unprotected and far out. Id be willing to just dump Collins and Clarkson. If I could get Ingram back for Collins and Walker, Id do it, but I wouldn't deal Walker for picks.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Like if you can somehow make the team wheres it's just Ingram and Lauri surrounded by rookie contract players and end of career vet journeymen, go for that

 

[SoberasHotRod]

Like if you can somehow make the team wheres it's just Ingram and Lauri surrounded by rookie contract players and end of career vet journeymen, go for that

If we traded Collins and Kessler for Ingram, and that's it, do you think we win more or less games?

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

If we traded Collins and Kessler for Ingram, and that's it, do you think we win more or less games?

More

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I also kind of expect Williams to be a pretty good rookie, or at least not a negative rookie. Hes better than Hendricks right now. He seems to know how to blend in and play within a team. He might be our best wing defender from the jump and better than anyone we had last year.

*Not better than Dunn, but probably less negative on offense than Dunn*

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I also kind of expect Williams to be a pretty good rookie, or at least not a negative rookie. Hes better than Hendricks right now. He seems to know how to blend in and play within a team. He might be our best wing defender from the jump and better than anyone we had last year.

Both guys are the types of young players that don’t really kill you. Collier/Key/Brice though are the types that can.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Though if you take both Kessler and Collins out you are extremely thin at the big man position. Filipowski would get thrown in the fire at that point but I also think Filipowski is kind of ready for it.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Both guys are the types of young players that don’t really kill you. Collier/Key/Brice though are the types that can.

Key might be ready to kill opposing teams. Could have a huge leap. I know you are the main person who loves the Hardy/Key jokes, but Hardy isn't warm to rookies so I tend to believe there is something special there.

 

[whatthe]

A well rested Lauri at his peak and soft early schedule versus all the worn-out past their peak all stars doesn't mean more losses for the Jazz. The Jazz could start fast and then slowly fade back in the standings.

 

[Coach Ellis]

Like if you can somehow make the team wheres it's just Ingram and Lauri surrounded by rookie contract players and end of career vet journeymen, go for that

Not advocating for this, but. . . Sexton, Clarkson and Collins for Ingram and McCollum gets you very close to this. It breaks up logjams for both teams and give the Pelicans much-needed cap relief with some new vets all under contract for the next two years.

Keyonte - McCollum - Collier
Williams - Juzang -
Ingram - Sensabaugh -
Markkanen - Hendricks -
Kessler - Eubanks - Filipowski

Add three more end of the bench guys like Bazley, Lofton, Potter, etc.

What’s the high and low end win potential for a team like that?

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Spurs can easily salary match for a 2025 off-season trade for Markkanen. T

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Key might be ready to kill opposing teams. Could have a huge leap. I know you are the main person who loves the Hardy/Key jokes, but Hardy isn't warm to rookies so I tend to believe there is something special there.

He would have to take a huge leap just to be neutral. If he leaps all the way from where he was to "killing guys" then who gives a **** about the tank. The point of the tank is not to lose... the point of the tank is to find top tier young talent. If Key is that then we good. Progress is normally incremental.

 

[fishonjazz]

A well rested Lauri at his peak and soft early schedule versus all the worn-out past their peak all stars doesn't mean more losses for the Jazz. The Jazz could start fast and then slowly fade back in the standings.

Ya lots of things could happen

 

[rippimpc]

Not that it matters (i dont have mystical powers), but we should be hoping none of our young guys make a leap right?

 

[Coach Ellis]

Not that it matters (i dont have mystical powers), but we should be hoping none of our young guys make a leap right?

For the tank, that’s ideal. But for the long-term prospects of the Jazz it would be better if any of the young players show their long-term options to team with Lauri.