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Nikola Mirotic

radiohegel said:
wtf are you talking about? The Jazz aren't going to ****ing die if they don't trade for Mirotic...

If you really want to start digging up analogies, a better one would be taking out a mortgage so you can invest in a promising company.

And no, you can't trade a pick just because the top ten records get clenched, because you then hypothetically owe the next year's pick. Furthermore, when have you ever seen the top ten records clenched by a tradedeadline?
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1. I'm talking about draft trades.
2. The analogy wasn't that they'd die. The analogy is that just because a possibility of something bad doesn't mean you don't do it.

i.e.

Parents speaking to physician after their 8 year old is diagnosed with Type I diabetes: But couldn't they die if they became hypoglycemic on insulin?
Doctor: Yes.
Parents: So maybe we shouldn't give insulin?

Fans: But couldn't it prevent us from making a trade with a future pick because of the protection?
League: Yes.
Fans: Then we shouldn't trade it.
 
infection said:
1. I'm talking about draft trades.
2. The analogy wasn't that they'd die. The analogy is that just because a possibility of something bad doesn't mean you don't do it.

i.e.

Parents speaking to physician after their 8 year old is diagnosed with Type I diabetes: But couldn't they die if they became hypoglycemic on insulin?
Doctor: Yes.
Parents: So maybe we shouldn't give insulin?

Fans: But couldn't it prevent us from making a trade with a future pick because of the protection?
League: Yes.
Fans: Then we shouldn't trade it.
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Wait. Do you really think that's a legitimate comparison? Like actually?
 
radiohegel said:
Wait. Do you really think that's a legitimate comparison? Like actually?
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Are you familiar with people using stories of accentuated reality to make a point, or do you think someone’s mortality hinges on a Mirotic trade?
 
radiohegel said:
What you're referring to is called hyperbole, and it's not really a legitimate form of argument.
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The point is just because there is a downside to something isn’t justification by itself for not doing it.
 
Better put:

Q: Couldn’t it hamper future flexibility?
A: Yes. And?
 
infection said:
The point is just because there is a downside to something isn’t justification by itself for not doing it.
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But you have to at least clearly and accurately identify the possible downsides if you want your decision to be an informed one.

infection said:
Better put:

Q: Couldn’t it hamper future flexibility?
A: Yes. And?
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Yes, and I'm not convinced Mirotic is a good enough player to be worth mortgaging our trade flexibility for, especially considering the high level of uncertainty about his length of stay with the Jazz.

Edit: to be clear, I think it would be great if the Jazz can snag Mirotic. But only if Chicago concedes and takes a couple seconds instead of a first, or if that first comes from a third party, like Cleveland.
 
I don't think any team that doesn't have an asset horde should be trading any first round pick for any player on a hot-streak whose contract expires in a year and whose own teammates were fine with him being beat to ****, all in order to put the team on a proper treadmill for the duration of his contract.
 
infection said:
1. I'm talking about draft trades.
2. The analogy wasn't that they'd die. The analogy is that just because a possibility of something bad doesn't mean you don't do it.

i.e.

Parents speaking to physician after their 8 year old is diagnosed with Type I diabetes: But couldn't they die if they became hypoglycemic on insulin?
Doctor: Yes.
Parents: So maybe we shouldn't give insulin?

Fans: But couldn't it prevent us from making a trade with a future pick because of the protection?
League: Yes.
Fans: Then we shouldn't trade it.
Click to expand...

Apples and oranges
 
infection said:
Neither do I, which I find unfortunate. GH deal I feel was a no brainer and worked out well even though he left. The Rubio deal was stupid in hindsight, foresight, and even no-sight. We need to appraise all deals independently. This is much more solid than the Rubio trade but can’t pass it up just because we **** the bed on that deal. It’s like betting on the outcome of a coin flip based on what happened the past 5 flips.
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Basically trading a first for a really good player that fits your team is a good idea (the hill trade) just sucks he didn’t want to stay.

Trading a first for a crappy player that doesn’t fit is a bad idea ( the Rubio trade)

Pretty simple really. And if that is true then: trading a first for a good player who fits and also wants to be in Utah from all accounts would be a really good idea (mirotic)
 
latin jazz said:
Lol. At the beginning I was excited for the move. Oh man, how wrong I was
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You were in the minority. I remember a poll prior to the Rubio trade asking which pg’s people would want and Rubio was one of he options (can’t remember the others but they were realistic non all star types). Almost no one wanted Rubio.

Then after the trade most of us talked ourselves into liking him and thinking he would be good here.
 
Dali said:
Ah I see that Fish has no TLC towards TLC.

Understandable though, he has been total poop.
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I was really high on him and wanted the jazz to draft him. Draft picks are a crap shoot. It’s like playing the lottery
 
fishonjazz said:
You were in the minority. I remember a poll prior to the Rubio trade asking which pg’s people would want and Rubio was one of he options (can’t remember the others but they were realistic non all star types). Almost no one wanted Rubio.

Then after the trade most of us talked ourselves into liking him and thinking he would be good here.
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I imagined more lobs to Rudy and fast-breaks. I wanted to believe we were getting post All Star Rubio who was awesome
 
I personally think that OUR draft picks are worth more than the average draft pick because of the record of finding great players in the draft by DL. Donovan Mitchell is clearly the best find, but he was also one of the lowest picks that Lindsey has had to work with and he was in a very talented class. I think that DL/Jazz have a knack for finding the best talent and Quin helps develop the youth well. It makes our picks worth more than the average draft pick.

Given that, I concur that right now a draft pick is VERY overrated in the league. No one thinks that they can compete with the Warriors/Cavs of the world. Philly and Boston's strategy of collecting assets appears to have worked. Most teams overspent and they can't bring in talent for low costs other than the draft. So, draft picks are going at a premium now.

Finally, the Jazz are around 3 out of their last 15 games. If we keep this up we will be a top 5 pick. With top picks getting a higher chance at the lottery balls this year... that's not a bad place to be. With Mirotic and Gobert and a second half of the season with Spida killing it, we could bounce back up to 14th overall and just miss the playoffs, but I would prefer to partner DM with the right guy and mold them with Quin than to get Mirotic and barely make the playoffs. I hope we try to make the playoffs, but that we lose every game by buzzer beaters and crap calls and the like. I am full tank mode myself. Not the intentional tank, but the tank while trying.
 
I doubt niko has a thread by another teams fan site that has gotten to 60 pages.

Bulls should just give him to us already. Cavs need to give up on getting Jordan and just give us the pick we need for Favs.

Someone call Lavar ball to speak this **** into existence.
 
So, count me OUT as far as a first for Mirotic. If we trade Favors to the Cavs for their 28th pick, then I would drop that for Mirotic myself. A high first just isn't the same as a 5 - 12 with a chance at a lottery ball that we deserve at this point. The karma gods have been against us in spite of the classiness of the org. Gordon leaving should mean that Karma gives us back Spida and a top 2 lottery ball!
 
fishonjazz said:
Basically trading a first for a really good player that fits your team is a good idea (the hill trade) just sucks he didn’t want to stay.

Trading a first for a crappy player that doesn’t fit is a bad idea ( the Rubio trade)

Pretty simple really. And if that is true then: trading a first for a good player who fits and also wants to be in Utah from all accounts would be a really good idea (mirotic)
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With Ricky I totally talked myself into it being okay.

Niko is different in that it’s clear he is a good fit for what we do. Not sure if he is as good as he’s shown this season but he’d still be really good in his role.

I don’t think any of us would have said Ricky was a good fit... some may have liked him but not sure people thought the fit was as ideal as Niko.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I doubt niko has a thread by another teams fan site that has gotten to 60 pages.

Bulls should just give him to us already. Cavs need to give up on getting Jordan and just give us the pick we need for Favs.

Someone call Lavar ball to speak this **** into existence.
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With Lavar all things are possible.

video-239158.jpg
 


Good sequence D-img up Durant and the. Getting a three at ~0:35.
 
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