Game Thread Oct 26, 2021 08:00PM MT: Jazz vs. Nuggets

[Handlogten's Heros]

We gotta think about trade scenarios for him at this point. We are paying nearly 19mil for his shooting and he's 31% from deep so far this season, bricking two wide open looks in crunch time last night. He had the excuse for recovering from a wrist surgery last year but shouldn't he have fully recovered by now? Bojan is a good player but simply a luxury we cannot afford. He's due 20mil next season and we should spend that money on areas that we need to improve.

I only trade him in season if something super awesome comes along. If Paschall shows he is solid and Gay ends up being good for us then you can move him in the offseason for something different. His shooting will come around... the offense is fine from him. Just needs to be better on defense (he can do it... he picked it up for the playoffs at times).

The problem with trading him is the thing we need is a different version of Bogey. Don't need guards... don't need bigs... need a good two way wing that can shoot. Rarely do you trade wing for better wing. I just think we will have some options once Gay is back and if Bojan can't/won't focus on both sides of the ball then he can sit a few extra minutes a game including crunch time. We can manage minutes well so everyone should be going balls to the walls.

 

[fishonjazz]

The thing is Gobert has shown he can be a streaky free throw shooter, so this isn't really a great strategy.

I remember a team doing hack a rudy a few years back and he made them pay big time. Made like 8 in row and they stopped that strategy.


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[framer]

People that want to trade Bojan are forgetting what things look like when Donovan is injured. Think of Bojan as a really good player who is also Mitchell insurance. If we run into bad matchups for Bojan, we have Rudy Gay in the near future to even that out.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

People that want to trade Bojan are forgetting what things look like when Donovan is injured. Think of Bojan as a really good player who is also Mitchell insurance. If we run into bad matchups for Bojan, we have Rudy Gay in the near future to even that out.

Once his shooting comes around he's great. His two point stuff has been great this year. Low turnover too. The defense last night was rough but Gordon was kind of giving it to everyone... it was weird. The dumb defensive rotation that got him pulled is the stuff he needs to eliminate. We have options... I doubt we find anything in a trade that would give us more than Bogey this year and next. If Joe was going to stick around next year at a somewhat reduced price I would look harder at a Bogey trade. Bogey isn't untouchable but it would be difficult to find something better.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I do think the defense is looking better from our small guards... JC, Don and Mike (who was always solid when healthy). I also see us going for steals more which is a big improvement. The bench defenders in Whiteside and Paschall are much improved over Niang and Favs... although Niang is under-rated as a regular season defender. If he had Whiteside behind him maybe it would have been better.

 

[KqWIN]

I said we should have been looking to move Bogey all summer. He's a good player, but still overrated IMO and we have much greater needs than another scorer. His reputation and trade value exceeds his actual production and on court value more than any of the tradeable guys. Almost all of his value comes from scoring, and that is what is most overrated by the general consensus. It's also what we have an extreme surplus of on this team. The advanced numbers have never been kind to Bogey and I have to agree with them.

I think a lot of the Ingles rumors stem from the fact that his contract is up and the Jazz might not want to bite the bullet and pay the tax. IMO, Ingles is a better player than Bogey and I don't want to lose him because we chose Bogey instead. If we can't get that two for one trade for a better player I would still like to trade Bogey for a different kind of player.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I said we should have been looking to move Bogey all summer. He's a good player, but still overrated IMO and we have much greater needs than another scorer. His reputation and trade value exceeds his actual production and on court value more than any of the tradeable guys. Almost all of his value comes from scoring, and that is what is most overrated by the general consensus. It's also what we have an extreme surplus of on this team. The advanced numbers have never been kind to Bogey and I have to agree with them.

I think a lot of the Ingles rumors stem from the fact that his contract is up and the Jazz might not want to bite the bullet and pay the tax. IMO, Ingles is a better player than Bogey and I don't want to lose him because we chose Bogey instead. If we can't get that two for one trade for a better player I would still like to trade Bogey for a different kind of player.

The Joe stuff basically comes from Joe. He isn't looking to relocate in the NBA... he wants to go home. If he plays in the NBA next year I am basically 100% certain it will be for us.

 

[KqWIN]

The Joe stuff basically comes from Joe. He isn't looking to relocate in the NBA... he wants to go home. If he plays in the NBA next year I am basically 100% certain it will be for us.

Either way, regardless of what Joe's plans are I think we should have been looking to move Bogey...especially now that we have Gay, Paschall, and Butler.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I said we should have been looking to move Bogey all summer. He's a good player, but still overrated IMO and we have much greater needs than another scorer. His reputation and trade value exceeds his actual production and on court value more than any of the tradeable guys. Almost all of his value comes from scoring, and that is what is most overrated by the general consensus. It's also what we have an extreme surplus of on this team. The advanced numbers have never been kind to Bogey and I have to agree with them.

I think a lot of the Ingles rumors stem from the fact that his contract is up and the Jazz might not want to bite the bullet and pay the tax. IMO, Ingles is a better player than Bogey and I don't want to lose him because we chose Bogey instead. If we can't get that two for one trade for a better player I would still like to trade Bogey for a different kind of player.

I also think they kind of were looking to move him (or someone) this offseason... there were certainly rumors. I think the trade is just difficult... I know you love Kyle Anderson but not sure that works for us and is likely not on the table. I think you are looking at like Kyle Kuzma, Thad Young, or Josh Hart type of deals... not sure what would be on the table but those don't excite me. I like those guys but we have Paschall, Gay, and Royce that give us some of what we'd want there.

Maybe if Portland decides to dump RoCo... if there was a Dame or CJ for BS trade they might need/want more shooting. I've not been impressed by RoCo at all when I watch Portland. I also think we might undersell what Bojan brings a bit. Unless we got a bonafide perimeter defender who could shoot respectably I think we'd be in trouble.

 

[KqWIN]

I also think they kind of were looking to move him (or someone) this offseason... there were certainly rumors. I think the trade is just difficult... I know you love Kyle Anderson but not sure that works for us and is likely not on the table. I think you are looking at like Kyle Kuzma, Thad Young, or Josh Hart type of deals... not sure what would be on the table but those don't excite me. I like those guys but we have Paschall, Gay, and Royce that give us some of what we'd want there.

Maybe if Portland decides to dump RoCo... if there was a Dame or CJ for BS trade they might need/want more shooting. I've not been impressed by RoCo at all when I watch Portland. I also think we might undersell what Bojan brings a bit. Unless we got a bonafide perimeter defender who could shoot respectably I think we'd be in trouble.

I think Kyle Anderson is very much on the table right now. Melton and Bane both moved ahead of him and Brooks still is yet to come back. I'm not sure if they want Bogey, but Anderson is falling out of priority there. He's also played like trash so far.

I don't think those players are super exciting exciting, but for me Bogey is not that exciting as a player either. I think Ingles and Clarkson are both better players than him and if it were up to me they'd be closing more games than Bogey. We could lose Bogey (like we did in the bubble) and I don't think we're in any more trouble than we are now. I'd still have full confidence in our team to score at an elite level.

I would be willing to mix things up and move Bogey for someone like Anderson/Hart and if we did so I think we could also bring back some young players and/or draft capital as well. If we don't want the future assets we can do a multi team trade and get another useful player that can play right now. If we had Hart and Kenrich to being with, for example, I don't think I'd be looking to move those for another scorer like Bogey. Dok for Kenrich should already be a standing offer to OKC btw.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Either way, regardless of what Joe's plans are I think we should have been looking to move Bogey...especially now that we have Gay, Paschall, and Butler.

I think the phone line is open but that is likely an offseason move once we know what Gay/Paschall bring. You might bring in someone through trade that then replaces Joe's minutes at guard or add another solid 3/4 at a more budget friendly price. I'm not shaking things up if I am the Jazz unless something too good to pass up comes along. Waiting until the offseason also lets you see what the market for Paschall is... he is restricted I believe so it will be our choice if we want to keep him.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I think Kyle Anderson is very much on the table right now. Melton and Bane both moved ahead of him and Brooks still is yet to come back. I'm not sure if they want Bogey, but Anderson is falling out of priority there. He's also played like trash so far.

I don't think those players are super exciting exciting, but for me Bogey is not that exciting as a player either. I think Ingles and Clarkson are both better players than him and if it were up to me they'd be closing more games than Bogey. We could lose Bogey (like we did in the bubble) and I don't think we're in any more trouble than we are now. I'd still have full confidence in our team to score at an elite level.

I would be willing to mix things up and move Bogey for someone like Anderson/Hart and if we did so I think we could also bring back some young players and/or draft capital as well. If we don't want the future assets we can do a multi team trade and get another useful player that can play right now. If we had Hart and Kenrich to being with, for example, I don't think I'd be looking to move those for another scorer like Bogey. Dok for Kenrich should already be a standing offer to OKC btw.

You don't have to tell me about Kenrich... I been on that bus since last trade deadline. I don't think I'd hate Hart for Bogey given the money savings and long term approach... anyone in NO could be better than they are showing as well since its been a **** show down there forever. It would likely be Hart and something (young guy or sweetner) I think NO is desperate and likely to make a bad move or three. That's still a move that can wait for the offseason though unless NO overpays.