What's new

Official Quin Snyder coach’s challenge watch

infection

Well-Known Member
Staff member
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
What will Quinn’s record be? What is an acceptable percentage of challengers to leave on the table? What’s the over/under? What’s league average? This thread will be updated each game. For games where I’m not certain, I’ll need to bump with someone’s help. For each challenge used, he’ll get one in the W column.

Quin as of 1/5/21:

0-7.

Opposing coaches:

3-4.
 
Last edited:
Out of 72 games I'm guessing we'll see less than 25.
 
What will Quinn’s record be? What is an acceptable percentage of challengers to leave on the table? What’s the over/under? What’s league average? This thread will be updated each game. For games where I’m not certain, I’ll need to bump with someone’s help. For each challenge used, he’ll get one in the W column.

As of 12/28/2020:

0-3.
How did you get his name right in the title then mess it up in your post??
For the love of god people it's Quin with one 'n'.
 
How did you get his name right in the title then mess it up in your post??
For the love of god people it's Quin with one 'n'.
Autocorrect doesn't know that. For the love of God.
 
How did you get his name right in the title then mess it up in your post??
For the love of god people it's Quin with one 'n'.
My posting history indicates my long familiarity with the single N. 85% of my posting is on iPhone. I’m attributing this one to being his name with an apostrophe and, frankly, the new board software + my iPhone is making some tremendously bad autocorrects and it comes out real bad on anything I don’t proof-read. Also the text box randomly shutting off.
 
I'll say he uses five, and I'm shocked each time. Just before using them there will be an assistant coach pleading for him to do it and if it's close to their birthday, it just may happen.
 
I was trying to find out if there was any data on how often coach's challenges were used. I haven't found that yet, but I did find an interesting article here. It's a bit out-dated as this is from January, but there were some interesting things in there, in addition to quotes from Quin:


At least as of January, about 45% of challenges ended up in overturning the call.

Here's the part about Snyder:

“The way that the challenge is used by the coaches, you’ve kind of seen that evolve,” said Utah Jazz head coach Quin Snyder. “You’ve seen games where it’s been really impactful. There’s not as many of those, relatively speaking, because a lot of time you wanna hang on to your challenges because you might need it in a more impactful time late.”

Then there's this contrasting opinion:

“There are still quite a few challenges before the 4th quarter where we thought the high majority would be late in the game,” he said. “In other words, they would save it for that critical play where they wanna challenge. Some of it are doing it in the first quarter on an out of bounds. They’re saying a possession is a possession. If it means points, we want ‘em. We don’t care first quarter, fourth quarter.”

So Quin is basically taking the DL "keep the powder dry" approach. I think it's good to be prepared for using a challenge late in the game, but I think it's also foolish if so many of these are going unused, especially as there can be some pretty drastic impacts on the game with momentum swings and, particularly, foul trouble. If your guy gets blown for his 3rd or 4th foul and he plays 5 less minutes, does that not have an even larger impact than the hypothetical "crucial call"? Having your guy sit on the bench is probably much more likely to lead to you being in a situation where you need a crucial call to go your way. In this way, you can apply the analogy of an ounce of prevention being worth more than a pound of the cure.

An example happened last night, though when I mentioned it in the game thread someone had quoted me saying it wasn't a challengeable call. I'd have to look more into the rules, and maybe they changed this year, but this article references the overturning of out-of-bounds calls, so I'd assume this call last night was challengeable. The great thing about out-of-bounds challenges is that, as of January, the call was overturned 76% of the time. Last night I believe it was with around 5 minutes left or so, we had a chance for an offensive rebound and the ball was called off us, which it wasn't. Rudy and Clarkson were adamant, as well. They came down on the other end of the floor and hit a three. That could cost the game right there. Last season there were numerous occasions where players signaled to Quin to challenge a call and he would waive them off and even say he couldn't. But then he never uses the challenges.

Treat these like extra possessions. It's cool if you want to wait for a more opportune time to use it, but if that ends up being almost never, then you're completely wasting a resource. You're surrendering the free space on the bingo card for "nah, let's wait and see!"
 
Frankly he should use it every single game. It's ridiculous to let any weapon go unused. If you're getting beat up and have a gun that mis-fires half the time, you are stupid waiting until he is beating you up worse before pulling the trigger. At least you ****ing tried.
 
Maybe he thinks that if he doesn't use them they pass to the next game? So he can use 37 of them in one game at the end of the season?
 
Frankly he should use it every single game. It's ridiculous to let any weapon go unused. If you're getting beat up and have a gun that mis-fires half the time, you are stupid waiting until he is beating you up worse before pulling the trigger. At least you ****ing tried.
It's the guy dying in the desert with 4 ounces left in his water bottle. He wants to save it for when he needs it, but he's currently immobile and about to die, but can't get over the idea that if he uses it now, it won't be available later.
 
Question: what's the total effect on W/L record while using a challenge every game? There's been some number used that for however many points you add, it translates to a certain increase in wins over 82 games. What effect over 82 games is there when using your challenge every game have, regardless of when you use it, compared to if you use your challenge 1/8 games when it's "a good time" to use it? My money would be on getting much more traction and bang for your buck by just using it every game, regardless of when you use it.
 
This is also like people with flex-spending accounts vs. HSA accounts. First, why the hell would anyone have a flex-spending account? Second, if they did have flex-spending instead of HSA, why the hell wouldn't they use all their money as best they can before the end of the year? It makes no sense. Quin acting like this is an HSA.
 
Back
Top