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Perhaps this is the defining moment for Hayward

jimmy eat jazz said:
I can't help but wonder how you all are defining soft.
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To me Hayward is soft because he lets other players bully him and pick on him and because he pouts a lot when things don't go his way
 
fishonjazz said:
To me Hayward is soft because he lets other players bully him and pick on him and because he pouts a lot when things don't go his way
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Aside from Delonte West and the finger in the ear, do you have other examples?

BTW, LeBron didn't respond emotionally or respond in kind when Stevenson blew on him. Does that make him soft?

I'm just not sure I agree with the premise that 'toughness' requires emotional displays or retaliation for dumb slights.
 
jimmy eat jazz said:
I disagree with the argument that toughness involves shows of emotion; in fact, I can easily think of a number of scenarios where shows of emotion are contrary to toughness and leadership. The rest of it makes more sense to me, if true (and it might well be).
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If you are mentally tough you don't hang your head and mope when you make a bad play. Also never showing positive emotion means you are not helping the mindset of your team. Some shows of emotion can be detrimental to a team. Mental toughness to me would be knowing when and where to show the emotion and in the right way. A leader needs to do these things.
 
fishonjazz said:
To me Hayward is soft because he lets other players bully him and pick on him and because he pouts a lot when things don't go his way
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This I disagree with. He had the right emotional response to that. The problem I had is didn't he miss the FT afterwards? That is where he showed lack of toughness.
 
jimmy eat jazz said:
Aside from Delonte West and the finger in the ear, do you have other examples?

BTW, LeBron didn't respond emotionally or respond in kind when Stevenson blew on him. Does that make him soft?

I'm just not sure I agree with the premise that 'toughness' requires emotional displays or retaliation for dumb slights.
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Barea punked him also.

Do you think pouting it's a sign of toughness?
 
gregbroncs said:
This I disagree with. He had the right emotional response to that. The problem I had is didn't he miss the FT afterwards? That is where he showed lack of toughness.
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I think that if someone sticks a finger your ear, you should always get pissed and should probably earn yourself a tech. Especially if it was a finger wet with spit
 
Softness, passiveness, Aggressiveness, Fire, "nasty-streak", etc. are all qualities you are either born with or not. You can't teach a soft/quiet/passive person to become aggressive and vice versa, you can't teach someone like Kobe Bryant to be passive and soft. It doesn't work that way. I know Jazz fans want to keep hoping that Hayward will suddenly and miraculously transform himself into an alpha male...but it's not going to happen. He is what he is, time to just accept it.
 
fishonjazz said:
I think that if someone sticks a finger your ear, you should always get pissed and should probably earn yourself a tech. Especially if it was a finger wet with spit
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It was a west willy, not a wet willy. It's okay West is in the SL while Haywards got a max contract. I guess that's why he doesn't have to act tough. I would at least have liked to see a demeaning gesture at least, like with what LeBron did with Lance.

I guess he's too white.
 
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