Please read this! SLC Dunk- Black Lives Matter

One Brow

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I’m not too familiar with ANTIFA, but my understanding is they have the same goals as BLM but are aggressive and violent in their Mission in obtaining these goals am I correct?
First, antifa are not in an organized group with organized goals. As Snopes recently put it, all they really have in common as a group is opposing fascism, usually by opposing state violence and discrimination.

Many are aggressive, and they to not swear to non-violence. However, almost always when there is violence, antifa are acting as a responder or protector, not an instigator.

Also, antifa stands for "anti-fascism", so if you were to use capitals, it would just be Antifa. However, since they are not in an organized group, I see even the capital "A" as misleading.
 

Joe Bagadonuts

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Could you read the ****ing abstract to the paper, at the very least?

They find that although minority suspects are disproportionately killed by police, white officers appear to be no more likely to use lethal force against minorities than nonwhite officers

Right there "minority suspects are disproportionately killed by police". Do you think black people care if they are killed by black police instead of white police?



Sure, what the authors need is for all these angry people to go away, so nothing needs to change.



Sure. Tell that to England, France, Germany, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland, ...
I read the abstract. Nobody denies that blacks are killed at a higher rate. The study I pointed to shows that they are not disproportionately killed by white police. That matters and is contrary to what a lot of people are saying. The next part of the equation is whether blacks are killed more often because of the color of their skin or because they are involved in violent crime more often. There are studies that show the latter to be the case. There are studies that show that economic strata is a larger factor in these sort of incidents than race is. My belief is that better education (I'm a fan of school vouchers) and greater economic opportunity are far more likely to solve the problem than welfare programs. There is lots of data that shows that the welfare state in impoverished neighborhoods bears great responsibility for the crime problem. Prior to the explosion of welfare programs beginning in the 60's black Americans were progressing economically faster than the general population by many measures. Since that time they have been falling behind the general population by many measures. All of this while immigrant black populations like Nigerians continue to do better than the general population and far better than the non-immigrant black population. But I'm not going to go round and round with you as I know you love to do because I long ago realized that your goals and mine are not in alignment at all. You appear to be in favor of the utopian idea of a society where everything is fair above all else. I am in favor of a world where people are incentivised and rewarded for their efforts to take charge of their own lives and make them better.
 

DasJazz

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I read the abstract. Nobody denies that blacks are killed at a higher rate. The study I pointed to shows that they are not disproportionately killed by white police. That matters and is contrary to what a lot of people are saying. The next part of the equation is whether blacks are killed more often because of the color of their skin or because they are involved in violent crime more often. There are studies that show the latter to be the case. There are studies that show that economic strata is a larger factor in these sort of incidents than race is. My belief is that better education (I'm a fan of school vouchers) and greater economic opportunity are far more likely to solve the problem than welfare programs. There is lots of data that shows that the welfare state in impoverished neighborhoods bears great responsibility for the crime problem. Prior to the explosion of welfare programs beginning in the 60's black Americans were progressing economically faster than the general population by many measures. Since that time they have been falling behind the general population by many measures. All of this while immigrant black populations like Nigerians continue to do better than the general population and far better than the non-immigrant black population. But I'm not going to go round and round with you as I know you love to do because I long ago realized that your goals and mine are not in alignment at all. You appear to be in favor of the utopian idea of a society where everything is fair above all else. I am in favor of a world where people are incentivised and rewarded for their efforts to take charge of their own lives and make them better.
But, but, but, the narrative!
 

One Brow

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I read the abstract. Nobody denies that blacks are killed at a higher rate. The study I pointed to shows that they are not disproportionately killed by white police.
You missed the words "just the", and in "they are not disproportionately killed by just the white police".

That matters and is contrary to what a lot of people are saying. The next part of the equation is whether blacks are killed more often because of the color of their skin or because they are involved in violent crime more often. There are studies that show the latter to be the case.
Please link to one, because the study you just linked to was saying the race of the officer is not a factor, and not talking about the race of the victim.

Except, you won't find one. You'll find studies that people claim say what you want them to say, only if you actually read the study, they never actually say that. Every single time, that's what happens.

There are studies that show that economic strata is a larger factor in these sort of incidents than race is.
This is likely true.


My belief is that better education (I'm a fan of school vouchers) ...
Vouchers do not lead to better educations.

The rest of your post reads like someone selectively believing studies that tell them what they want to hear.

You appear to be in favor of the utopian idea of a society where everything is fair above all else. I am in favor of a world where people are incentivised and rewarded for their efforts to take charge of their own lives and make them better.
I don't think fairness is something that can be measured, much less be possible. I don't expect utopia, and certainly utopia is not present in England, France, Germany, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden, etc. I think you find people very incentivised to improve their circumstances in England, France, Germany, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden, etc. Why can they have both a decent social safety net and an ambitious populace, but not us?
 

Ostertag>Duncan

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When you're quoting wingnut-welfare recipients to support positions that say racism does not need to be fought, what do you think that says about you?
Yeah no. Racism bad? Duh. No one is suggesting racism doesn't need to be fought, but its certainly not the issue you make it out to be in 2020. Police and crime statistics don't match your worldview pal. Well maybe in your warped mind the needs to defeat the white supremacist power hierarchy.
 

Ostertag>Duncan

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Institutional raciam has been tested, measured, and examined about as thoroughly on a scientific basis as any social phenomenon can be. To deny it is like denying the earth is round.
Let's see the studies then. I'd prefer them to not be created by indoctrinated woke social scientists though. Thnx in advanced bb.
 

One Brow

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Yeah no. Racism bad? Duh. No one is suggesting racism doesn't need to be fought, but its certainly not the issue you make it out to be in 2020.
That's a very white person thing to think.

Police and crime statistics don't match your worldview pal.
Except, they do, and it's been researched pretty extensively.

Well maybe in your warped mind the needs to defeat the white supremacist power hierarchy.
When my mind warps, white supremacy is seldom involved.

I get you are scared by not being in the boss group anymore.
 

Ostertag>Duncan

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Racist tendencies" would be close to 95%.
Yeah, you world view is ****ed dude. I feel sorry who see's everyone around them in that manner. I couldn't imagine having a conversation with you in person knowing every time I speak to you and try to have a normal conversation with you, all that is running in your head at the time is the racial dynamics of it and how your going to try and dominate the conversation and fit me below you on the power hierarchy. Good times.
 

One Brow

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Let's see the studies then. I'd prefer them to not be created by indoctrinated woke social scientists though. Thnx in advanced bb.
How will you identify which which studies are by "woke social scientists"? Why do you think being "woke" is a bad thing for a scientist to be? Should they be "sleepy" social scientists?
 

One Brow

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Yeah, you world view is ****ed dude.
The world is a terrible place.

I feel sorry who see's everyone around them in that manner.
I don't care about the pity of the "sleepy".

I couldn't imagine having a conversation with you in person knowing every time I speak to you and try to have a normal conversation with you, all that is running in your head at the time is the racial dynamics of it and how your going to try and dominate the conversation and fit me below you on the power hierarchy. Good times.
That's a pretty strange internal life you have going on.
 

Ostertag>Duncan

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No one has a perfect view of the world. That's why I trust the science to tell me what it like more than wing-nut welfare recipients who tell me what I want to hear.
Yeah we already discussed this. The statistics and police killings don't match with what you're preaching. Yes he's only just a wing-nut welfare recipient, way to be dismissive of anything he says. Such a good person you are.
 

One Brow

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No this is about your warped world view. I'm a good person who doesn't treat everyone like a racist and where I place them on a ******** power hierarchy.
What does "treat everyone like a racist" mean? When did I have any ability to place anyone on a "power hierarchy"?

It feels like you're spewing out buzzwords you haven't really thought about.
 

Ostertag>Duncan

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What does "treat everyone like a racist" mean? When did I have any ability to place anyone on a "power hierarchy"?

It feels like you're spewing out buzzwords you haven't really thought about.
Don't be daft. In response to this:
"There are over 330 million people in the United States. Let's say 5% have racist tendencies...that's about 16.5 million people."
You purport "Racist tendencies" would be close to 95%."
Are you not implying 95% of the population has a racist disposition? Pretty ****ing racist dude.

I've seen you discuss the "Power Hierarchy" several times in the past, you know exactly what I mean.

Also what did you imply by this?
I get you are scared by not being in the boss group anymore.
Hmmm, gee I wonder.
 
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