Police arrest Julian Assange at Ecuadorian embassy in London

[Deleted member 365]

Killing journalists with radioactive poison..., Killing journalists as well as people who spied on them in foreign nations like the UK, with radioactive poison.

Research how Putin got his first high profile job under Boris Yeltsin. He blew up Russians in their apartment buildings and blamed it on terrorists. Then he started a war with the terrorists and became a national hero.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_apartment_bombings

Yep. Excellent post.

Coming up with ridiculous “tax fraud” accusations to intimidate political opponents, killing off CEOs who won’t sell their assets off to you, taking over media outlets to produce propaganda.... yeah that Putin is a real cool guy.

For those looking for some good reads on Putin and the stuff Bullet just highlighted:

Amazon product ASIN 1594486514
The new Tsar and Bill Browder’s book are good reads too. Browder is responsible for the Magnitsky Act, the “Russian Adoption” thing that Donald Jr discussed with Russians in Trump Tower in exchange for dirty on Hillary Clinton.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnitsky_Act

 

[LogGrad98]

Her name is Chelsea now. Getting closer...

Why you forcing these genders on people?

 

[Getting Traded]

No government on the planet is more corrupt than Putin’s Russia.

Russia isn't some boogeyman. Read a damn book or open a newspaper. Russia is meddling in elections, killing journalists, and providing aid to our enemies. Enemies of western democracies. This isn’t rumor, but proven fact.

Our CIA has been doing this since the 1950s. You want a list of books by agents to corroborate this?

 

[Deleted member 365]

Our CIA has been doing this since the 1950s. You want a list of books by agents to corroborate this?

Please provide me with a reading list of books that show the United States aided in killing journalists so that they could spread authoritarianism and anti-democratic governments around the world. Please provide me with a book reporting how we hacked into servers of the major political parties of a country and used that stolen information to influence an election. Please provide me with a book that reports how our president used radioactive toxins to kill off his political opponents in a foreign country.

I’ll wait.

You’re the only person in this thread still missing my main point about Assange. Why has he ONLY gone after western democracies? Why not Russia? Why hasn’t he ever exposed anything significant about Russia?

Do you believe the United States to be a greater evil on the world than Russia? Yes or no.

Do you believe Russia to be a more virtuous influence on the world than western democracies? Yes or no.

 

[Rubashov]

Our CIA has been doing this since the 1950s. You want a list of books by agents to corroborate this?

The moral high ground evaporated with Nixon

 

[Gameface]

The moral high ground evaporated with Nixon

Meh...

The U.S. is in no way an innocent player. We are not "the good guys." But we are using our position to further an overall good future for mankind. Our CIA believes in making this world safer for Americans, so that we can live according to our constitution. I 100% believe that. I will not justify their actions. I will not support their means. I think they have ham fisted their way through the last 70 years and ****ed things up more than they have helped. I think they have committed war crimes. Have been responsible for evil dictatorships. They have the blood of millions of people on their hands. But I absolutely believe that their mission is intended to make the U.S. safer and more secure, even if they've failed more than they have succeeded.

 

[Getting Traded]

Meh...

The U.S. is in no way an innocent player. We are not "the good guys." But we are using our position to further an overall good future for mankind. Our CIA believes in making this world safer for Americans, so that we can live according to our constitution. I 100% believe that. I will not justify their actions. I will not support their means. I think they have ham fisted their way through the last 70 years and ****ed things up more than they have helped. I think they have committed war crimes. Have been responsible for evil dictatorships. They have the blood of millions of people on their hands. But I absolutely believe that their mission is intended to make the U.S. safer and more secure, even if they've failed more than they have succeeded.

You hit it on the nose, for the U.S. But what about other nations, other people? What is even worse is that we've used the pretext to involve ourselves and interfere with other countries as foreign aid when we really have done this to further our own interests, very often to the detriment of these countries. This pride, this idea that we are better than anyone else is going to end up being our undoing. It's the fatal flaw of our culture.

 

[Rubashov]

Meh...

The U.S. is in no way an innocent player. We are not "the good guys." But we are using our position to further an overall good future for mankind. Our CIA believes in making this world safer for Americans, so that we can live according to our constitution. I 100% believe that. I will not justify their actions. I will not support their means. I think they have ham fisted their way through the last 70 years and ****ed things up more than they have helped. I think they have committed war crimes. Have been responsible for evil dictatorships. They have the blood of millions of people on their hands. But I absolutely believe that their mission is intended to make the U.S. safer and more secure, even if they've failed more than they have succeeded.

I really disagree, I utterly reject that anything the CIA does improves anything for mankind, in terms of making the world safer for Americans I think it does the opposite. They certainly make the world safer for American corporations and their vested financial interests, often to the detriment of the citizens of foreign countries that are either being exploited by American corporations or oppressed by the dictators the CIA supports. The CIA is probably the single greatest cause of resentment and hatred toward the USA and in a lot of countries that are nominally friendly and allies. Sections of the left here speculate on the role the CIA played in the removal of the Whitlam government, many suspect (and I think it is likely) CIA pressured the Governor General to remove the government. (Whitlam was going to nationalise the mining industry which the US at the time had i think around a 30 percent share in) 40 years later sections of the organised left still despise America for this.

I could go on and list numerous countries in which the CIA has operated to remove democratically elected governments, sponsored death squads, thwarted non-Americans hopes of a better life, in many cases forced them to live under dictatorship for American interests. People around the world hate America for this, as John Pilger said "The price for Yaclav Havel may have been house arrest and unemployment for speaking out about the Soviet regime, for Nicaraguans it was US backed death squads."

 

[Red]

A short opinion piece suggesting "Assange's indictment is Trump's next step in his war on press freedom". With opinions of the news media perhaps at an all time low, despite freedom of the press being absolutely essential in a democracy(you may cry "fake news" till you're blue in the face, authoritarian leaders certainly love that battle cry, but a free press is one of the essential venues for speaking truth to power), Trump may have the upper hand in this objective.

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...aks-trump-administration-war-on-press-freedom

"The case against the WikiLeaks founder is the justice department’s perfect vehicle to ultimately get what Trump wants".

 

[Gameface]

I really disagree, I utterly reject that anything the CIA does improves anything for mankind, in terms of making the world safer for Americans I think it does the opposite. They certainly make the world safer for American corporations and their vested financial interests, often to the detriment of the citizens of foreign countries that are either being exploited by American corporations or oppressed by the dictators the CIA supports. The CIA is probably the single greatest cause of resentment and hatred toward the USA and in a lot of countries that are nominally friendly and allies. Sections of the left here speculate on the role the CIA played in the removal of the Whitlam government, many suspect (and I think it is likely) CIA pressured the Governor General to remove the government. (Whitlam was going to nationalise the mining industry which the US at the time had i think around a 30 percent share in) 40 years later sections of the organised left still despise America for this.

I could go on and list numerous countries in which the CIA has operated to remove democratically elected governments, sponsored death squads, thwarted non-Americans hopes of a better life, in many cases forced them to live under dictatorship for American interests. People around the world hate America for this, as John Pilger said "The price for Yaclav Havel may have been house arrest and unemployment for speaking out about the Soviet regime, for Nicaraguans it was US backed death squads."

I don't think what I said is in disagreement with your post.

I said a few things that may have been misinterpreted.

First I said the U.S. is using it's position to further an overall good future for mankind. The U.S., not the CIA.

I said that our CIA believes in making the world safer for Americans. I didn't say they make the world safer, just that in their minds that's what they are trying to do. I believe that.

Finally I say that their (the CIA) mission is intended to make the U.S. safer and more secure. I used those words "believes" and "intended" on purpose.

I also say that the CIA has ham-fisted their way through the last 70 years and ****ed things up more than they've helped and have failed more than they have succeeded.

 

[Getting Traded]

I don't think what I said is in disagreement with your post.

I said a few things that may have been misinterpreted.

First I said the U.S. is using it's position to further an overall good future for mankind. The U.S., not the CIA.

I said that our CIA believes in making the world safer for Americans. I didn't say they make the world safer, just that in their minds that's what they are trying to do. I believe that.

Finally I say that their (the CIA) mission is intended to make the U.S. safer and more secure. I used those words "believes" and "intended" on purpose.

I also say that the CIA has ham-fisted their way through the last 70 years and ****ed things up more than they've helped and have failed more than they have succeeded.

There certainly have been competing interests even within the CIA itself. If you read some of the books by former agents, they started out with high-minded and altruistic motives. The information gathering and covert operations wings do seem to at times be in conflict as apparently occurred with the JFK assassination operation. Fletcher Prouty, a CIA operative, now deceased was one of the leading opponents of the covert wing. He wrote two books, The Secret Team, and The CIA, Vietnam and the Plot to Assassinate JFK. He suggests there is a secret power elite behind covert operations. The covert wing's mission is to protect corporate investment and interests around the world and suppress any political movements that would hamper corporate profits and influence in those countries. Generally, democratic leaders were suppressed or supplanted in favor of dictators who would give favors and license to American corporations detrimental to the interests of the people in those nations while taking huge kickbacks from the CIA. Sometimes this resulted in bloody affairs that were aided by weapons supplied by the CIA through the black market. One of those who learned of this and was about to expose one such operation was Sonny Bono when he was a California congressman. Unfortunately, before he made his report to Congress, he was murdered by hitmen and covered up as a skiing accident. Basically, the CIA is legalized organized crime, dealing heavily in drugs and weapons, while engaging in full-scale propaganda, all in the name of national security -- national security for whom, certainly not the American people.

I should add, I have three friends who were in the CIA, and one may still be connected to it, though I haven't seen him in at least 15 years. And they definitely believed they were serving an altruistic purpose. They are also very secretive about what they have done. One of them wrote a novel about it and I helped with the editing.

 

[Hotdog]

A short opinion piece suggesting "Assange's indictment is Trump's next step in his war on press freedom". With opinions of the news media perhaps at an all time low, despite freedom of the press being absolutely essential in a democracy(you may cry "fake news" till you're blue in the face, authoritarian leaders certainly love that battle cry, but a free press is one of the essential venues for speaking truth to power), Trump may have the upper hand in this objective.

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...aks-trump-administration-war-on-press-freedom

"The case against the WikiLeaks founder is the justice department’s perfect vehicle to ultimately get what Trump wants".

Im with you on it. I dont like this arrest of Assange. I hope this isnt the doing of Trump.

Im all for calling out fake news or real news, but dont think people should be arrested or banned for it.