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Brooklyn should also be another destination for Dlo.... straight Dlo for Dinwiddie swap would be fair with how crappy Spencer is.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I have no links... just based on pods from Katz/Begley/others. I think we are asking for that package. I think if it was just Grimes and Fournier it gets done. Its weird but I think the sentiment with Thibs is once he's out on you its kind of over and it seems they are out on Grimes.

Also it sounds like NY would love to get Brown or AB... but the AB salary match is tricky and Detroit sounds like they would love to re-sign him... and he might be all for that since its likely his last big payday.

I too am skeptical that a pick would be included but I think the bloom is off with Grimes a bit and we might be surprised at what they trade him for. I think picks in this draft also might be a bit undervalued after everyone has been ******** on the draft for a year or so.
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We might be asking for that. But like I said, I would be completely shocked if he actually got both.

I know time has passed and things have changed, but it was like a year and a half ago they wouldn’t include this guy for Mitchell so I would also be surprised if Clarkson got us Grimes alone. I haven’t thrown myself into the rumors as much as you….but it just seems like too far of a fall in too short of a time in terms of how NYK values him.
 
KqWIN said:
We might be asking for that. But like I said, I would be completely shocked if he actually got both.

I know time has passed and things have changed, but it was like a year and a half ago they wouldn’t include this guy for Mitchell so I would also be surprised if Clarkson got us Grimes alone. I haven’t thrown myself into the rumors as much as you….but it just seems like too far of a fall in too short of a time in terms of how NYK values him.
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Clarkson’s contract is a steal starting next year though. That has a lot of value in itself.
 
KqWIN said:
We might be asking for that. But like I said, I would be completely shocked if he actually got both.

I know time has passed and things have changed, but it was like a year and a half ago they wouldn’t include this guy for Mitchell so I would also be surprised if Clarkson got us Grimes alone. I haven’t thrown myself into the rumors as much as you….but it just seems like too far of a fall in too short of a time in terms of how NYK values him.
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I mean 1.5 years is an eternity in the NBA. Less than a year ago the Lakers wanted Dlo over Conley. Anchoring yourself to something that happened a year and a half ago isn't wise. The sample size of his play has more than doubled since then.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I mean 1.5 years is an eternity in the NBA. Less than a year ago the Lakers wanted Dlo over Conley. Anchoring yourself to something that happened a year and a half ago isn't wise. The sample size of his play has more than doubled since then.
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Yeah, I know it's not the best way to think about things....and to be fair his play has dropped of a cliff and is approaching Ochai levels. It's still one of those situations where I'll believe it when I see it. I've never been a Grimes guy and have mostly **** on him, still think he's probably worth more than Clarkson in a vacuum. I could be wrong on that, but Clarkson+first seems like an a huge stretch to me. Let's not forget that Clarkson has had a bad year.
 
KqWIN said:
Yeah, I know it's not the best way to think about things....and to be fair his play has dropped of a cliff and is approaching Ochai levels. It's still one of those situations where I'll believe it when I see it. I've never been a Grimes guy and have mostly **** on him, still think he's probably worth more than Clarkson in a vacuum. I could be wrong on that, but Clarkson+first seems like an a huge stretch to me. Let's not forget that Clarkson has had a bad year.
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The reason his value was high back then was because of a mix of potential and production. Potential based stock drops real fast if there is not progress. If he is worth more than JC its not by much and certainly in a value window where the trade straight across makes sense. Adding a first has always been a stretch but it could also be the worst of the two firsts they own this year... in a draft that is viewed pretty poorly. IF a deal happens I bet it includes no firsts.

JC had a bad stretch to start the year. Since moving to the bench he is 20/5/4 on 57% TS. Legitimate 6th man of the year stuff. There's a history of play there that anchors his value that is more established than Grimes. Any acquirer would be using him off the bench and his contract is very easy to digest. I think he's worth a late first in this draft... which is where I'd probably put Grimes value too.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
The reason his value was high back then was because of a mix of potential and production. Potential based stock drops real fast if there is not progress. If he is worth more than JC its not by much and certainly in a value window where the trade straight across makes sense. Adding a first has always been a stretch but it could also be the worst of the two firsts they own this year... in a draft that is viewed pretty poorly. IF a deal happens I bet it includes no firsts.

JC had a bad stretch to start the year. Since moving to the bench he is 20/5/4 on 57% TS. Legitimate 6th man of the year stuff. There's a history of play there that anchors his value that is more established than Grimes. Any acquirer would be using him off the bench and his contract is very easy to digest. I think he's worth a late first in this draft... which is where I'd probably put Grimes value too.
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I don’t necessarily disagree with the last statement. But doubling that value and saying both….its a stretch to me.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
If a team closes out to you, that's guarding you. IDK if you watch basketball, but only the most elite shooters get a defender stuck to them. It's impossible to play defense in the NBA without your defenders sinking in to help guard the paint.

And again, you're using tracking as some holy grail of measurements. I'm telling you, it's not. It's very inaccurate.
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I remember reading one place that the tracking uses feet position at the time the players elevate. So if you got a 7 footer jumping towards you from 6 feet out and you are 6'3, then the shot is classified as "wide open" even though it might end up getting blocked.

I definitely agree with your main point that defenders close out on Ochai every time, his defenders dont even cheat towards the help nearly as much as Dunn's/THTs for instance.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I just cant imagine it's that hard to find a home for D'Lo.

The Pistons wouldnt be giving up 2nd rounders for him?
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I think his toxic behaviour towards Rudy last season really put a stench on him. Also last year after being sent to the Lakers he whined about his role/minutes, which he probably shouldnt do when he is supposed to be just another foot soldier serving for AD and the King.

Also on the court everyone remembers how much better the Lakers got towards the end of the season, and DLo and Beasley minutes were dwindling down during that good run. I think DLo got that associated to him more than Beasley did in the media, but I think it was more about flow/fit than it was about DLo being a net negative.

But the attitude and being on the wrong end of minute distribution during the Lakers late run are few negative "what have you done for me lately" things surrouding him.

I think he is better than Clarkson as a scorer, facilitator and a defender. Also doesnt turn the ball over nearly as much and is absolutely deadly from 3 for long stretches when he turns hot. Can turn super cold occasionally as well though.
 
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