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Pres. Of Baskettball Operations Says Interesting Things About Draft, Tomic, and Neto...

Sexual Favors said:
True, but the rest of my argument stands.
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I don't agree. See my edited post.

Looking at efficiency without considering context only gives you part of the picture. Gordo wasn't effective out of isos or scoring out of pick and rolls before this past season. His handle is loose, he has a slow first step, and he's not a strong finisher. I don't see that changing. He doesn't have the physical ability to be an offensive hub.

I have no trouble believing Gordo would be more efficient playing off-ball as he did in his first 3 seasons. How much do you want to pay for an average halfcourt defender and average spot-up shooter? The extras Gordo gives you are going to be far less valuable on teams with top-level talent, as Gordo's going to be in possession of the ball a lot less.

Kanter regressed as a team player this past season. It looks like he got caught up in minutes/role, and worked/fought a lot less than in previous seasons. That's not a good sign, no matter who's coaching. It's a competitive league, and nothing comes easy. Sulking doesn't win championships.
 
Also, a big majority of us here wanted to be bad and tank. You can't have both a bad team and have a good chunk of our young players break out.
 
GVC said:
I don't agree. See my edited post.

Looking at efficiency without considering context only gives you part of the picture. Gordo wasn't effective out of isos or scoring out of pick and rolls before this past season. His handle is loose, he has a slow first step, and he's not a strong finisher. I don't see that changing. He doesn't have the physical ability to be an offensive hub.

I have no trouble believing Gordo would be more efficient playing off-ball as he did in his first 3 seasons. How much do you want to pay for an average halfcourt defender and average spot-up shooter? The extras Gordo gives you are going to be far less valuable on teams with top-level talent, as Gordo's going to be in possession of the ball a lot less.

Kanter regressed as a team player this past season. It looks like he got caught up in minutes/role, and worked/fought a lot less than in previous seasons. That's not a good sign, no matter who's coaching. It's a competitive league, and nothing comes easy. Sulking doesn't win championships.
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I agree Gordon's not an offensive hub in the sense that he's a #1 option, but he is easily a #3. With the way our books are designed, the new tv deal increasing the cap for the next two years, knowing his character and chemistry with team, etc, signing him is a no brainer. He's not getting maxed.

As for Kanter. I see an increased awareness of team play from him, as evidenced by his increase in passing, and improved D by the end of the year. Passing and D were two things he was never taught. He didn't play AAU, for a decent high school program, or college. He was always the best player in the gym, so patience is needed as he learns these new skills. He is obviously interested in learning them, as evidenced by his upward trend with them, but it will continue to take time. You are blurring the context of his locker cleanout comments and allowing them to distort your perception of him and his work ethic. Try to remember the kid who was ecstatic to be drafted by the Jazz. Some of the first words he told the media was "I finally have a team!" I believe that excitement was real and genuine. The kid used to wake up in the middle of the night to watch Jazz games so he could see Okur. And as for his dedication that has been questioned, remember the kid who transformed his body after his rookie season and ate nothing but seafood. That kid is still there, he was just robbed of an offseason of training because he was fighting for the ball, for his team, and wrecked his shoulder.

Kanter cares. Book it.
 
Doublea said:
Also, a big majority of us here wanted to be bad and tank. You can't have both a bad team and have a good chunk of our young players break out.
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Uhhh. Wrong. We sucked and didn't have any players break out…except Richard Jefferson. That is what was most disappointing. No one broke out. One of the "core 4" should have broken out.

I guess maybe Burks broke out and showed he was a very good sixth man. Yay! We have our sixth man of the future!

This is what we know so far:

Burke - rookie pg. He may be good, he may suck. We don't know. He looked like a rookie that hit a wall and had holes in his game.
Burks - Not good enough defensively to start. Very good sixth man.
Hayward - third option on a decent team. fourth option on a great team.
Favors - decent rim defender. below average offensive player. Not a great post defender.
Kanter - terrible defender. Not good in a team offensive scheme. Good one on one in the post. Bench player right now.

So, who showed you anything that makes you excited? All we know right now, is we have the making of the best bench in the NBA. That's it. Oh, we have a good third/fourth option and sixth man.

Yay! Utah Jazz!
 
Sexual Favors said:
I agree Gordon's not an offensive hub in the sense that he's a #1 option, but he is easily a #3.
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What does that mean? Ideally, how is he being used in halfcourt sets? Where might he add extra value? How does he fit in defensively? How replaceable is he? At what cost?
 
Enes CanTear You Apart said:
He hasn't proven but he has shown great signs for it. Enes can always be in top 20 at rebounds in the NBA and his ceiling is up to the top 5.

He was in top ten in his rookie year and top 25 in his second year. The most plausible reason for his drop in his third year is obviously his injury. He was always an elite rebounder all his career long including his rookie year in the NBA. So I believe that there is no reason for him to get it back again.
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I think using his injury as an excuse for his rebounding is wishful thinking.

Kanter has NEVER been in the top ten in the NBA in defensive or total rebound rate category. He's been in top 10 in offensive rebound rate, which isn't nearly as important as defensive rebounding. Kanter was 59th this year in defensive rebounding rate.

Do you know where he ranked the previous year? You know, before the injury? 89th. His first year was his best year both in raw number and ranking, and he was 37th in the league.

He's NEVER been a great defensive rebounder, pre nor post injury.
 
green said:
Uhhh. Wrong. We sucked and didn't have any players break out…except Richard Jefferson. That is what was most disappointing. No one broke out. One of the "core 4" should have broken out.

I guess maybe Burks broke out and showed he was a very good sixth man. Yay! We have our sixth man of the future!

This is what we know so far:

Burke - rookie pg. He may be good, he may suck. We don't know. He looked like a rookie that hit a wall and had holes in his game.
Burks - Not good enough defensively to start. Very good sixth man.
Hayward - third option on a decent team. fourth option on a great team.
Favors - decent rim defender. below average offensive player. Not a great post defender.
Kanter - terrible defender. Not good in a team offensive scheme. Good one on one in the post. Bench player right now.

So, who showed you anything that makes you excited? All we know right now, is we have the making of the best bench in the NBA. That's it. Oh, we have a good third/fourth option and sixth man.

Yay! Utah Jazz!
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I am actually excited about Hayward and Favors, and to some extent Burke. (I know everyone is excited about Burks, but I have always thought he was at least the player he showed he was last year)

Reasons to be excited about Hayward: If we get that number one guy, Hayward is suddenly going to look great. When he plays without the pressure of having to be the focal point of the team, he is pretty awesome. And, every once in a while (that game against OKC when he scored 17 straight) he can take things over. That is what you want from a number two or three on a good to great team. Hayward plays so much more confidently when he has someone to go to war with. We just need to make sure that they mesh well together, and I think he could be part of a pretty special team.

Reasons to be excited about Favors: He proved he was the anchor of the team. When you take Favors out of the lineup, the Jazz went from bad to horrible. Favors adds a lot of value in many different ways. He is not a GREAT defensive player, but he can certainly be a good defensive player. His offense was not below average, as you suggested, but it was right about average. With some coaching, he can be an above average offensive player, and an above average defender. That makes his net impact pretty high, as a lot of players can only contribute on one end of the floor. One other thing is that Favors had a midrange jumper this season that looked much improved.

Burke looked pretty effing great playing on a team with only 3 other NBA players, and as a rookie. Hopefully he will figure out how to drive in the NBA, and get to the free throw line, and hopefully his shot can become at least respectable.
 
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