Renegotiate John Collins

[Hedda Gambler]

It seems like the only move left this off season is to R&E Lauri Markkanen. After this we would still have cap room and instead of using this to sign players we really don`t want, I have this real stupid idea of renegotiating John Collins.

John Collins is due to make $26,58 million for the next two years, which is $53,16 million in total. With cap space, we could bump his salary for next season up to the full 30% max, which is just over $42 million. If JC was willing to decline his player option for 2025-2026 and instead make the max in 2024-2025, this would be a no brainer move for the Jazz. He would get a lot more money this year and would be off our books for next season. If he does not want to give up that much guaranteed money, we could add on a year with a 40% decrease in salary. That would be $25,3 million which would obviously have to be a team option with a bit of it guaranteed. If 5 million is guaranteed, he would only have $6 million less in guaranteed money if/when we release him and would be free to go to any team of his choosing.

 

[whatthe]

Hmm..hmmm...so we keep him around. Tank commander at the 5. If Kessler isn't starting then his stats are not as impactful. I would do this if we trade Kessler AND we felt we couldn't trade Collins. But I do think we could trade him next year

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Nah

 

[homeytennis]

But but everyone said he was free when the Jazz traded for him.

 

[NUMBERICA]

It seems like the only move left this off season is to R&E Lauri Markkanen. After this we would still have cap room and instead of using this to sign players we really don`t want, I have this real stupid idea of renegotiating John Collins.

John Collins is due to make $26,58 million for the next two years, which is $53,16 million in total. With cap space, we could bump his salary for next season up to the full 30% max, which is just over $42 million. If JC was willing to decline his player option for 2025-2026 and instead make the max in 2024-2025, this would be a no brainer move for the Jazz. He would get a lot more money this year and would be off our books for next season. If he does not want to give up that much guaranteed money, we could add on a year with a 40% decrease in salary. That would be $25,3 million which would obviously have to be a team option with a bit of it guaranteed. If 5 million is guaranteed, he would only have $6 million less in guaranteed money if/when we release him and would be free to go to any team of his choosing.

Can't do the full max this upcoming season for both Lauri and Collins. However, if the Jazz end up trading Lauri, this is actually a fantastic idea and I fully endorse it.

 

[Peter Effin' Parker]

But but everyone said he was free when the Jazz traded for him.

Guilty.

 

[Hedda Gambler]

Can't do the full max this upcoming season for both Lauri and Collins. However, if the Jazz end up trading Lauri, this is actually a fantastic idea and I fully endorse it.

That is true. We would have to trade JC or someone else to create that space. We could still do a $34/$20 renegotiation, making him cheaper and more tradeable for next season.

 

[SoberasHotRod]

I think it might easier/more likely that we use our space to help teams get under the tax. With only us and Detroit able to do that, we should be able to gain some good seconds/late firsts for that service this year. We could even use those assets to trade Collins for expiring contracts. Or potentially there is a deal out there where we could straight up take enough expiring contracts to get a team out of the tax and they take Collins.

 

[whatthe]

I think it might easier/more likely that we use our space to help teams get under the tax. With only us and Detroit able to do that, we should be able to gain some good seconds/late firsts for that service this year. We could even use those assets to trade Collins for expiring contracts. Or potentially there is a deal out there where we could straight up take enough expiring contracts to get a team out of the tax and they take Collins.

Cough, cough Zach Lavine..cough

I would do a John Collins + Space for Zach and picks.

And then a Walker, Sexton, Scrub for Ingram.

Embrace the high offense, low defense suckage.

Unrelated point, Cooper Flag's strong suit is defense (natural pivot point as we can add defense with him with all our high octane players).

 

[KqWIN]

I am intrigued....Don't think it will happen, but I do think it makes some sense for both sides. The cap space route is more likely.

 

[idiot]

No expert on this whatsoever, but don't NBA renegotiations essentially have to be beneficial to the player?

If I'm reading the OP correctly, this would be asking Collins to give away millions in guaranteed salary (with the expectation of being cut next year and hoping that being free to sign with another team will allow him to recoup the money).

Not really sure why Collins would go for this.

 

[KqWIN]

No expert on this whatsoever, but don't NBA renegotiations essentially have to be beneficial to the player?

If I'm reading the OP correctly, this would be asking Collins to give away millions in guaranteed salary (with the expectation of being cut next year and hoping that being free to sign with another team will allow him to recoup the money).

Not really sure why Collins would go for this.

Theoretically, Collins could have the same amount of guaranteed money. I think OP is shaving off some money because Collins could earn more money next year. There’s a slight risk for a potentially very big reward for Collins.

 

[The Jazz Wonderbra]

Cough, cough Zach Lavine..cough

I would do a John Collins + Space for Zach and picks.

And then a Walker, Sexton, Scrub for Ingram.

Embrace the high offense, low defense suckage.

Unrelated point, Cooper Flag's strong suit is defense (natural pivot point as we can add defense with him with all our high octane players).

Zach Lavine is like signing 2 John Collins contracts for twice as long. He is a pseudo fake All Star with descending numbers and an albatross contract. He won't win you a championship as one of the top 2 players on a team. We can get Cooper Flagg without the Lavine signing.

 

[whatthe]

Zach Lavine is like signing 2 John Collins contracts for twice as long. He is a pseudo fake All Star with descending numbers and an albatross contract. He won't win you a championship as one of the top 2 players on a team. We can get Cooper Flagg without the Lavine signing.

I want the Jazz to stink for two years but still acquire talent.

 

[idiot]

Theoretically, Collins could have the same amount of guaranteed money. I think OP is shaving off some money because Collins could earn more money next year. There’s a slight risk for a potentially very big reward for Collins.

The OP has Collins accepting a change from player option to team option. The scenario under which Collins gets a big reward is when he's desired by teams next year (in other words, does well this year). But the Jazz could (and maybe would) keep him in that scenario if there's a change to a team option. So he wouldn't get the "big reward."

If Collins stinks it up or muddles through the season, the Jazz will surely waive him under the OP's scenario. But there's also unlikely to be a "big reward" at the end of that rainbow.

It sounds like too much risk if I were in Collins's situation.

 

[KqWIN]

The OP has Collins accepting a change from player option to team option. The scenario under which Collins gets a big reward is when he's desired by teams next year (in other words, does well this year). But the Jazz could (and maybe would) keep him in that scenario if there's a change to a team option. So he wouldn't get the "big reward."

If Collins stinks it up or muddles through the season, the Jazz will surely waive him under the OP's scenario. But there's also unlikely to be a "big reward" at the end of that rainbow.

It sounds like too much risk if I were in Collins's situation.

As OP has it, Collins would take $17M more this year at risk of losing $6M overall. You can do the math on having $17M more one year earlier, but he would only have to sign a contract of $6M or more to make even without considering inflation. He has a lot more potential to earn more than $6M, including the chances that his contract is guaranteed (to facilitate a trade for example) where he would make out like a bandit. If the Jazz keep him he would essentially gain $17M for free. His contract wouldn’t be $42M and $5M. It would be $42M, then $25M with $5M guaranteed.

The exact amount could be negotiated, $5M is a made up number. Like I said, you could theoretically give him the exact same amount guaranteed.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

But but everyone said he was free when the Jazz traded for him.

Not what I was saying bub!!

 

[NUMBERICA]

The OP has Collins accepting a change from player option to team option. The scenario under which Collins gets a big reward is when he's desired by teams next year (in other words, does well this year). But the Jazz could (and maybe would) keep him in that scenario if there's a change to a team option. So he wouldn't get the "big reward."

If Collins stinks it up or muddles through the season, the Jazz will surely waive him under the OP's scenario. But there's also unlikely to be a "big reward" at the end of that rainbow.

It sounds like too much risk if I were in Collins's situation.

I think you’re overthinking getting a $17 million raise. I’m sure he can get an $8 million deal even if he has a down season.

But yeah, it’s worth thinking through the issue. He can’t really get a bigger raise than the max, and if he does have a total outlier season (he suddenly becomes a legit modern 4 and/or gets really good at defense), his extension number next year doesn’t require cap-space to re-up.

I can see some downsides to your point but I mostly see this as a no-brainer for Collins. I think the biggest hitch is that I don’t know if it’s legal (I think you have to extend for several years in order to renegotiate… but maybe not)?

 

[The Jazz Wonderbra]

Would we prefer to give the salary cap to Collins for an extended buyout? Or just give the money to Lauri and wait out Collins with the chance we can trade him next year as an expiring contract?

 

[NUMBERICA]

As OP has it, Collins would take $17M more this year at risk of losing $6M overall. You can do the math on having $17M more one year earlier, but he would only have to sign a contract of $6M or more to make even without considering inflation. He has a lot more potential to earn more than $6M, including the chances that his contract is guaranteed (to facilitate a trade for example) where he would make out like a bandit. If the Jazz keep him he would essentially gain $17M for free. His contract wouldn’t be $42M and $5M. It would be $42M, then $25M with $5M guaranteed.

The exact amount could be negotiated, $5M is a made up number. Like I said, you could theoretically give him the exact same amount guaranteed.

The Jonathan Isaac R&E is probably the model here. You have to offer a total contract length of at least 4 years (1 + 3 in his case and this case). This is largely what you’ve laid out, but you make years 3 and 4 non-guaranteed to work around the obligation, but year two (‘25-‘26) would/could be $25 million with, say, $6 million guaranteed.

Another wrinkle would be that he can only receive an offer of this nature starting August 4th (which is three years after he agreed to his current contract). So, if the FO has already tossed around this idea at all as part of the Lauri trade/salary floor construct, things really do start to come to a head for all of it right about now.