Romney Fundraiser - Secret Taping

[NAOS]

tl;dr

I already know;

Poor me, but I did it anyway.. once you actually have done it, there WILL be a part of you that doesn't find it fair that the kids in your school that ditched class, did drugs, worked as little as possible .. now want you to pay a higher share of your income so they can have more.

It's not all fair, life sucks, some people who deserve it don't make it, others that don't deserve anything, do .. but for the most part, people like yourself, that start from nothing, work harder, accomplish more than those who didn't, grow tired at some point of taking care of those who didn't.

I'm actually not at all this cold, just got on a rant. As I say regularly, I hate both parties, I am a moderate. I like to help, a lot, actually. I just HATE being TOLD it's my job to do so. Moral obligation? Sure.

what should happen to the non-industrious poor? Simple question.

 

[Dr. Jones]

what should happen to the non-industrious poor? Simple question.

They should be helped.

Truth is I don't have any problem helping people. Truth is I don't even mind paying more than others.
What I detest, though, is any group that wants to tell me I'm a pig no matter how much I do. I can create more jobs, pay higher taxes, but it's not enough, because I still have more. It's that group I'm talking to.

 

[NAOS]

They should be helped.

Truth is I don't have any problem helping people. Truth is I don't even mind paying more than others.
What I detest, though, is any group that wants to tell me I'm a pig no matter how much I do. I can create more jobs, pay higher taxes, but it's not enough, because I still have more. It's that group I'm talking to.

Helped with strings attached? Is this some welfare-to-work derivative? How much Protestant work ethic should they show to be worthy of help? How much should they promise to repay the debt that we'll so nicely give to them?

Having more isn't a problem with most people; but the panoptic cracks, serious or not, are getting on people's last nerve ( I'm speaking about Romney, here )

 

[Dr. Jones]

Helped with strings attached? Is this some welfare-to-work derivative? How much Protestant work ethic should they show to be worthy of help? How much should they promise to repay the debt that we'll so nicely give to them?

Having more isn't a problem with most people; but the panoptic cracks, serious or not, are getting on people's last nerve ( I'm speaking about Romney, here )

Please re-read my reply and then your's to mine. You will kindly excuse me from not defending what I said from your baiting reply (intentional or not).

I meant what I said sincerely. No need to read between the lines.

 

[NAOS]

Please re-read my reply and then your's to mine. You will kindly excuse me from not defending what I said from your baiting reply (intentional or not).

I meant what I said sincerely. No need to read between the lines.

I would ask these frank questions to anybody in your position. I'm not baiting; I'm genuinely interested. You definitely have come out against certain kinds of spending, so it isn't a reach to think you're ALL IN for helping the non-industrious poor with zero strings attached. What are those strings? This is the real question. The other ones are baiting.

 

[Dr. Jones]

The trillion dollar question is who needs the help, not what strings are attached. I want to help real needs with no strings. Very difficult, if not impossible, to define lazy, etc.

There are people I know that I help. I know their circumstances and feel they truly are doing the best they can but fall short, financially. These people need help .. and the ability to accept with dignity.

I know others with their hands out and, by MY definition, are being just downright lazy. I don't empower them with handouts .. those involve strings, if you will.

How do you do that on a national scale? Well, I'm not smart enough to figure that out.

 

[NAOS]

The trillion dollar question is who needs the help, not what strings are attached. I want to help real needs with no strings. Very difficult, if not impossible, to define lazy, etc.

There are people I know that I help. I know their circumstances and feel they truly are doing the best they can but fall short, financially. These people need help .. and the ability to accept with dignity.

I know others with their hands out and, by MY definition, are being just downright lazy. I don't empower them with handouts .. those involve strings, if you will.

How do you do that on a national scale? Well, I'm not smart enough to figure that out.

I like this post.

But, FYI, there is an enormous amount of economic literature that hates the fact that creative and productive people aren't getting the breaks they need. The big questions are about the specifics of helping people that actually don't want to labor in the ways we recognize (which, for people at the bottom of the debt chain would only mean debt peonage anyway). Could you help someone if their goal was to make a political stance about NOT WORKING in these conditions?

 

[NAOS]

I wouldn't imagine Obama actually respects Americans generally. He is a visionary, and he has the path for us to a better way of life than we ever imagined, or understood, or wanted.

Anybody who actually respects Americans on average is not gonna run for office. "Who,. . . . me????" would be the wondering reply to anybody's suggestion that they run for dog catcher, or President.

That's why politicians talk down to the voters, and tell them things they imagine the people want to hear. And then go to New World Order UN committee meetings and plan how to manage, or manipulate us, into going along with the program.

Both political parties today are top-down propaganda outfits committed to imposing good government, as the elites imagine it, on us, whether we like it or not. Well, with the help of well-known sociological tools for inducing us to want what we're going to get.

babe nails it again.

 

[TroutBum]

First of all, I love this thread. Secondly, my opinions fluxuated from page 1 to 3, which is another reason I love this thread.

I read your paragraph and watched the video and it seemed like I watched something totally different from what you described. I'm guessing the "forget the politics" thing isn't going to happen here. I see a guy talking campaign strategy, no more, no less.

This was my first reaction as well. I don't think there is anyone here that dislikes Romney more than me, but I really saw nothing wrong with what was going on here. Was it a bit harsh? Ya, but it is what it is.

That's true - I never said that either. It just baffles me that a person with such a low opinion of American people is running for president.

It's hard to be optimistic when stats and facts pretty much tell you that you're wasting your time if you do. Again, I'm no fan of Romney, but having been around politics a little bit (lowest level, I know, but just go with it) I am starting to believe that the majority of people that run for public office DO have the best interests of the people they represent in mind. I don't know Romney's mind, but who's to say that deep in his heart he doesn't want to get elected simply to help that 47ish percent get off of Gov't aid and help themselves? In a world of bipartisan dog fighting, maybe the other side isn't as evil as you think. Just my two cents.

This is the part where the left wingers--regardless of their economic drain on our country--will pretend that they are the hard-working, artificially oppressed, no-we-built-its, and that anyone and everyone who has disagreements with them about how to grow and maintain a healthy society is a greedy pig trying to keep them from ever increasing their stage in life.

Just because you listened to every Al Gore speech doesn't make you environmentally conscious, it just makes you forever dumberer.

Brilliant. I hate repping your inflated ***, but it had to happen.

I wouldn't imagine Obama actually respects Americans generally. He is a visionary, and he has the path for us to a better way of life than we ever imagined, or understood, or wanted.

Anybody who actually respects Americans on average is not gonna run for office. "Who,. . . . me????" would be the wondering reply to anybody's suggestion that they run for dog catcher, or President.

That's why politicians talk down to the voters, and tell them things they imagine the people want to hear. And then go to New World Order UN committee meetings and plan how to manage, or manipulate us, into going along with the program.

Both political parties today are top-down propaganda outfits committed to imposing good government, as the elites imagine it, on us, whether we like it or not. Well, with the help of well-known sociological tools for inducing us to want what we're going to get.

As I said before, I think the people who represent you aren't as weird and crazy as you seem to think. Are some? I wouldn't doubt it. At the very worst, I enjoy reading your version of how things are, even if I think that 90% of it is rubbish. (the 10%, on the other hand, is down right provocative)

I didn't hear anything on that recording that is incorrect.

I hate agreeing with Scat O'Reilly, but again, I didn't either. Brutal, yes. Incorrect, no.

The trillion dollar question is who needs the help, not what strings are attached. I want to help real needs with no strings. Very difficult, if not impossible, to define lazy, etc.
There are people I know that I help. I know their circumstances and feel they truly are doing the best they can but fall short, financially. These people need help .. and the ability to accept with dignity.
I know others with their hands out and, by MY definition, are being just downright lazy. I don't empower them with handouts .. those involve strings, if you will.
How do you do that on a national scale? Well, I'm not smart enough to figure that out.

I admire the PKM's of the world. My old man is one, his dad was one, and one of my brothers is. If I wasn't so damn broke, I would be too -- but as it stands, I'm keeping it all for myself, thank you very much.

 

[NAOS]

And, to the OP:

Romney has always been a ****ing tool, but, yeah, this still found a way to irritate the **** out of me.

Have you all seen the video where he describes the condition of the Chinese factory he was buying? How about the one where he makes the joke about wishing he were Latino?

This guy is a bitch.

 

[Dr. Jones]

None of us are too good to take care of ourselves and our families if able. Even if we feel a job is beneath our qualifications. So what? That is entirely political and/or negatively motivated. Short answer, no I have no sympathy for anyone having an ability but turning their nose up, for what, a handout?

One example of someone I help. Family of 7.. husband and wife married 14 years, husband runs off with another woman and doesn't look back. Mom doing all she can. No way to work and be able to take care of 5 kids at home. She's trying, doing all she can, keeping her chin up .. for her kids. I asked her, one day, would you prefer to have help in the area of your rent/utilities being paid, or help with your kids so you can work. She emphatically said that though they were basically the same thing, she wanted her kids to grow up seeing their mom work, earn money, put food on the table, and rise above tough circumstances.

I found her a job and created an opportunity to have her kids wateched over in a positive and educational environment.

Not a week goes by that I don't have at least 3 or 4 people approach me and ask for a car, money, whatever .. 90% are just looking for a handout. I tell them no, politely. I also ask if they'd like an opportunity. Those same people find a creative way of saying no thanks...

 

[TroutBum]

None of us are too good to take care of ourselves and our families if able. Even if we feel a job is beneath our qualifications. So what? That is entirely political and/or negatively motivated. Short answer, no I have no sympathy for anyone having an ability but turning their nose up, for what, a handout?

One example of someone I help. Family of 7.. husband and wife married 14 years, husband runs off with another woman and doesn't look back. Mom doing all she can. No way to work and be able to take care of 5 kids at home. She's trying, doing all she can, keeping her chin up .. for her kids. I asked her, one day, would you prefer to have help in the area of your rent/utilities being paid, or help with your kids so you can work. She emphatically said that though they were basically the same thing, she wanted her kids to grow up seeing their mom work, earn money, put food on the table, and rise above tough circumstances.

I found her a job and created an opportunity to have her kids wateched over in a positive and educational environment.

Not a week goes by that I don't have at least 3 or 4 people approach me and ask for a car, money, whatever .. 90% are just looking for a handout. I tell them no, politely. I also ask if they'd like an opportunity. Those same people find a creative way of saying no thanks...

Dude, can I have a car?