I learned all that, as well. All of that is a comparison of a potential PG with the actual PG. None of that means Parker was not outplayed Lopez, even if Lopez dribbled higher.
Sanders is much better than Hayward
- Thread starter oldtimer
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I learned all that, as well. All of that is a comparison of a potential PG with the actual PG. None of that means Parker was not outplayed Lopez, even if Lopez dribbled higher.
carolinajazz
Well-Known Member
...anybody as tall as Hayward and Klinko can't help but have a high dribble! And that's why they don't dribble that much, pass more and have to use other assets to contribute!
You are completely missing the point. No, the logic is not such that if player A's team is ranked #2 and player B's team is ranked #5, player A is better than player B. The point here is that leaders of both of these teams took their teams to the highs of NCAA ranking, which is a huge credit to guys like Hayward and Wall. Babbit was unable to take his team anywhere, and that is a big knock on him as a prospect. He was not a difference maker in NCAA. Hayward and Wall were, and that is a big credit to them. Hayward's team was not ranked before he got there. When he did, they made top 25 ranking with him as freshman, and #2 ranking with him as a sophomore. The guy was a difference maker in NCAA. Babbit was not. You get the point now?
ncoloradojazz
Banned
Hayward wasnt a leader of butler. Best guard they had was shelvin Mack. ALso we wouldnt need babbit to be a vocal or team leader. WE got best pg in game for that. Go study up on butler cuz the games i saw in the tourny it was mack and not hayward who carried them plus they also got a very nice big man wgho i forgot name. Butler was stacked with talent compared to nevada. Babbit will be a better pro then hayward. Bigger,stronger, more athletic, just as good of a stoke. Dont know how you can justify caLLING HAYWARD a better player.So we drafted hayward to be a leader then? Um...No we did not. The jazz whiffed its that simple. Not saying hayward wont be a nice 7th or 8th man off the bench but babbit will have a better and longer career..Hayward wasnt even best player on butler and wasnt the team leader. Do you watch college ball at all or are you just a stat nerd?
ncoloradojazz
Banned
Shelvin Mack was the leader of butler. Go ask their fans if you dont believe me?
All the attention was on Hayward, thats why Mack and others did so good.
Your argument now boils down to discounting the difference Hayward made in NCAA, because Mack was better? This is pathetic. KOC already said that under 19 wold champion Team USA coach declared Hayward was the best player on the team. He also made all tournament team. Mack was on the same team, but did not get these accolades. Hayward also was Horizon player of the year (I suppose the guys that voted for him do not watch college basketball either?) and MVP of the West Region (perhaps these folks also don't watch college ball?). It is beyond doubt Hayward made a difference in NCAA. The fact you are even debating that and don't want to acknowledge something that obvious, shows your bias against him, hence completely destroying your credibility on the subject.
Mack is a good player too, sure, but it is simply ridiculous to discount Hayward as a difference maker in NCAA because Mack was good also.
Hayward actually accomplished something during his College career. Led Team USA to worlds title. Was best player on that team according to the coach. Led Butler twice to national rankings, including #2 ranking last year. Babbit has accomplished nothing in NCAA. I am not even saying he should have gotten to NCAA title, but to even get his team ranked. Hell, even Snyder got Nevada ranked once, if I remember correctly. Plus Babbit is a year older. Hayward was clearly a better prospect (and already has shot 20% better from the floor in the summer league than Babbit).
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
When was the last time a guy was named conference player of the year without being the best player on his team that season? I guess it could happen.
IMO, both Gordon and Luke were excellent prospects. The "tell" for me was KOC's pre-draft comments about mismatches. He said that when you can get a guy that would create mismatches at his position you have to consider that player, regardless of position. I think he was talking about Hayward. And Ty Corbin has said they consider "Flash" a SG.
Luke is strictly a SF. And perhaps as a SF, he MIGHT be a better prospect than Hayward. But if Gordon indeed does have the ballhandling and playmaking abilities to be a SG (and can defend the 2), then WOW! How many teams can guard a 6'8" shooting guard? And Deron is a big PG. The Jazz would have one of the biggest guard combos in the league. And that's another reason why the acquisition of Raja is key. If the Jazz face a quicker off-guard, you can match him up against Bell. The more I think about it, especially given the comments of Ty Corbin, the more I think Hayward may see minutes at the 2 and CJ will remain at SF.
Hopper
Banned
Happened with Deron, eh, Glass? Dee Brown was named the player of the year by Sporting News, and I think he was also named Big 10 player of the year, with Deron on the team. If I recall correctly, Brown was first team all-american and Luther Head, another one of Deron's teammates was named to the second team. Deron was 3rd team, or mebbe honorable mention, I forget.
They where all better College players than Dwill though, Dwill was the clear cut better Pro prospect though, no one argued that.