Summer 2019 Roster Discussion

Discussion in 'Utah Jazz' started by LoPo, Feb 8, 2019.

  1. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    From what I read she seems pissed about the outside influences on the team... I bet you she won't do business with the Lakers unless Boston and other suitors offers are like 50% what the Lakers is... to give in to them now (or a week ago) would be letting those influences get what they want. She might move him for less to another team just as an eff you to the Lakers, AD, and Rich Paul.

    She should have dug in and told the NBA to shove it and that she'd take the fines and use her legal team to fight the hell out of them. Could start a small market rebellion. I get it... players want to be in better markets... can't blame em and not gonna stop em... but the NBA caters to big markets and stars a bit too much. Whether they like it or not the big markets need the small ones. If small markets just become super team feeder programs it ain't good for the league as a whole.

    Now... NO isn't blameless here... they had 8 years to put something around the guy and couldn't get it done, but AD trying to strong arm his way to the Lakers when he could have signed a shorter contract or added options is kinda his choice too... so if you sign the deal you better be prepared to ride it out or you work with the organization on a solution. Using back channels and pressure to strong arm the organization was wrong.
     
  2. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    It was a couple years overdue... I think the Boogie trade bought saved him from getting fired last season.
     
  3. LoPo

    LoPo Well-Known Member

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    I can't stand people blaming Demps for not doing a good enough job putting a team around AD.

    - he traded for Jrue
    - he traded for Boogie
    - he traded for Mirotic
    - he signed Randle
    - he was able to dump Asik

    Sure he made some poor moves as well, but for the most part, the guy did an admirable job trying to build around AD. It's more on AD and his own short comings. Before this season, he has averaged missing 13.67 games per year. The other major factor was Cousins. It's not Demps' fault that Cousins got hurt, declined a $20 million per year offer, and accepted chump change to go to GS.
     
  4. LoPo

    LoPo Well-Known Member

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    There is blame to go all around, but I blame Klutch Sports most of all. This is less than a year ago: https://www.thebirdwrites.com/2018/...-contract-demarcus-cousins-watch-video-quotes

    “I don’t go into any year saying, okay, I don’t want to be here or nothing like that, but of course at some point, you want to win — and I feel like we are trying to get the right pieces around here. I think our front office is doing a better job. They’re doing the best job they can do. I feel like we’re moving in the right direction, but you do have to take it year by year and see where it goes. That’s how I’m approaching it. You know, of course, Cuz is a big factor and what he’s going to do or not, but I’m here until 2021, man, and then {I’ll} make a decision from there. I don’t plan on leaving in the next couple of years or anything like that. Like I said, I’ve always wanted to be here and that’s still true.”
     
  5. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    He traded a **** ton of picks and signed a bunch of bad contracts. Niko and Randle were too little too late. Just didn't seem to be a plan there. AD can be blamed for some of it for sure... but Demps ain't great.
     
  6. infection

    infection Well-Known Member Staff Member 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    If we were able to trade for Drew, then all of the sudden having Niko’s bird rights would look like a genius move.

    It doesn’t matter. We’re trading for Love, anyway.
     
  7. Jingled

    Jingled Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    I'm a big believer in Brogdon but I think the Buck's likely match any offer for him. I also still like Niko at the right price. I don't really see anyone else on that list that would move the needle all that much. I think our third piece is going to have to come through trade and not free agency.
     
  8. infection

    infection Well-Known Member Staff Member 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Can we get Niko by offering a full max to Brogdon, whereby Niko becomes collateral of the bloated contract?
     
  9. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    It would be tricky... you have to get him or other free agents to wait. Restricted clock doesn't start until after the offer is submitted and the offer can't be submitted until after the moratorium ends.

    They could agree with Niko/Bled/Middleton and then go oh ****... and you either end up with Malcolm on a max deal (big overpay, but I guess movable... probably) or they match and figure out how to make the dollars work by moving a guy in season.

    Might be easier to bid up Bled/Niko and then make the match on Malcolm hurt. I think one of Bled/Niko/malcolm are gone. I think Bled and niko are more likely to be out.

    So maybe here is how you do it... you float that you will make a max offer to Brogdon and make their offer to Niko budget for that. If we really want him I think $20M a year gets it done... they won't go that high. You can front load it a bit to make it better for us long term and to make it less palatable for them to give something equivalent.

    4/80ish is a lot for Niko. But FA is tough to get value until you are in a lower tier of player.

    We have to hit on a draft pick or two in my opinion. Look at Denver... Morris in the second round, Beasley and Hernangomez now playing well, like a win on that level in combo with a slightly overpaid but good FA really moves us up the ladder a bit. If Allen got more comfortable and played well next year it would sure help. Exum might continue his strong play... Maybe we hit on this year's pick. I still think we are in a good position if we execute and get a little lucky. Time is ticking to shoot our shot though.
     
  10. infection

    infection Well-Known Member Staff Member 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Here’s a better question:

    At what dollar value do you think the FO values these FAs? I mean, they didn’t value Bjelica at like $6.5M.
     
  11. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    that one stings. He is older and a worse defender, but might be a better shooter.

    If I say Niko at $20M then you say WTF didn't we just get Bjelica for peanuts. I think I'd rather spend/overspend on the wing or guard to add to Ingles/DM and see if we can find a bargain on a stretch four. I'm also pretty cool with rolling Royce and Crowder out as the stretch 4 pairing.
     
  12. infection

    infection Well-Known Member Staff Member 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    You might be, but what about them? I don’t think it’s compketely unreasonable to see Favors on his second year, in the event Cleveland won’t give them Love.
     
  13. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    there is a real chance of that. In the Conley deal I can't believe there wasn't a three team scenario where we could send Favs to Charlotte and they send Bismack and their lotto protected pick. Maybe they wouldn't do it for Favs, but they were reportedly willing to do it for Gasol... and he has a player option that really could screw up their cap.

    Is it possible we were unwilling to go Favs/Ricky/ 1st for Conley because we are seriously considering keeping Favs on his option? I wouldn't do it, but I can absolutely see DL doing it.

    If we trade for Love I will be so sad.
     
  14. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    But time hasn't stopped. There will be more deadlines

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
     
  15. David Stern

    David Stern Well-Known Member

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    I think DL isn't a risk taker. That's pretty obvious. He likes to make safe trades and sign safe free agents. Favors on a 1+1 isn't a risk, and I think there's a really good chance they're bringing him back on that option. Exum on a 3 year, 30 million dollar deal isn't really a risk. Hood for Crowder definitely wasn't a risk either. I guess you could call his draft-day trades risky, but nobody really knows for sure what they're getting with the kinds of picks/players he's traded for. The only significant risk he's taken while being GM was hiring Quin as a coach, and that obviously worked out well. The problem is, in order for the Jazz to become contenders with the current roster he's either got to take a significant risk by trading for or signing a difference maker, or he's got to strike gold again in the draft.
     
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  16. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Making moves ruins chemistry and destroys cakes

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
     
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  17. LoPo

    LoPo Well-Known Member

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    Picks are a crapshoot, but yes, he did trade some of them. However, some unproven guy isn't the way to make a superstar happy. Cleveland constantly traded picks when they had LeBron and that team was always in the Finals. Houston constantly trades picks, but they stay relevant in the West. Demps signed Asik and Hill to bad deals, but in hindsight, those deals were $12 million a year. Wasn't like either was Parsons or Ryan Anderson who got almost twice as much.

    Demps did his best to build around AD in a small market. Demps brought in very good players to put around AD. With zero free agency appeal, he still was able to get 2 All Star calibur players (Jrue and Cousins) AND secure good players like Rondo, Randle and Mirotic.

    At end of the day, the Pelicans would be a better team if their superstar didn't miss over 13 games a year for his first 6 years in the league. I still put more blame on AD and Klutch Sports than I do with Demps. After those two, I blame Cousins. Lastly, I blame Demps.
     
  18. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    Wow... you know what... this is pretty spot on. Add in not signing someone using space when we had it around 2015 and 2016... I mean one of those contracts could have been bad.

    I don't want a riverboat gambler, but scared money don't make none.

    What is the riskiest move DL has done?
     
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  19. Saint Cy of JFC

    Saint Cy of JFC Well-Known Member

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    DL hasn't taken risk?

    Lmfao
     
  20. Saint Cy of JFC

    Saint Cy of JFC Well-Known Member

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    People are constantly moving the goalpost for what is a risk and what isn't.
     

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