The costs of gay marriage

[moevillini]

I don't oppose amending the tax code to extend joint-filing benefits to both marriages and civil unions. I don't think anyone would have a problem with that. However, I doubt the U.S. Supreme Court would be invoked just to resolve a simple proposed change to the U.S. tax code. I'm pretty sure tax status isn't what's driving the Prop 8 / No Prop 8 debate.

Again, I think this is about whether the state will make a statement to explicitly sanction same-sex couples on par with traditional married couples. It's an equal-status, equal-esteem debate.

I honestly don't know that much about the issues, but I believe there are two separate cases before the Supreme Court. One involves California's Prop 8 - but it has nothing to do with the tax code. The other case has something to do with contesting the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) that was signed into law about 20 years ago, and does specifically impact the US Federal tax code as it defines marriage as between a "man and a woman" and thus denies certain benefits to couples of the same sex (ie, they're not considered a "couple" in terms of estate taxes, and they cannot file a joint federal tax return)

 

[babe]

DOMA is goin' down, folks.

 

[One Brow]

The problems I see are how does an institution have to recognize them. I see lawsuits against any privat entity that does not play ball with a gay marriage once legal. That I have a problem with.

For example, some private health foundation places families of critically injured people into temp homes while their loved ones are being treated. A gay man is injured and his husband applies with that foundation and they deny him becuase they do not agree with gay marriage. The man sues them and wins and the foundation is forced to do business with him. That is something I do not agree with. They are a private organizationa nd should be able to deny anyone they want.

If the organization in question accepts no government funding/licensing/etc. and do not advertise themselves as open to the public, their free speech rights protect them in such suit.

 

[One Brow]

The only problem I can see arising if same sex marriage is allowed would be the government forcing religions to accept or even participate in them. That would not be cool.

Loving vs. Virginia was in 1967. In that time, not one single church/religion has been forced by the government to accept or participate in inter-racial marriage. Your fear is based on a counter-factual. It can't and won't happen.

 

[One Brow]

(about selfishness in general)
IMO this country/world has changed quite a bit towards being much more selfish, and I sincerely believe selfishness is at the heart of all/most of our worlds people related problems. I have not looked into all world problems/issues to see if selfishness is at the heart of it but I wonder if it is at the heart of all of them.

While I agree that selfishness (whether individual or group) has contributed to suffering, I disagree that the general levels of selfishness have increased. It seems to me that you are experiencing the nostalgia effect.

 

[One Brow]

The LDS church will not change their stance no matter the outcome.

Black men will never be priests, right?

 

[One Brow]

A gay man has the equal right to marry a woman just like a straight man does. So you cannot say that gays don't have equal rights.

A white person would have the right to marry a white person, and a non-white person to marry a non-white person, so laws forbidding white people from marrying non-white people are not discrimination?

 

[One Brow]

When private people/entities are being forced into business with people/entities they disagree with is it really? Go look up the people that have been sued for refusing their personal, private services to a gay couple.

People have been sued for refusing commercial, public services to gay couples, not personal, private services.

 

[Stoked]

Black men will never be priests, right?

I was wondering how long it would be before someone goes there. If you think the Mormon Church will embrace gay marriage and act like they always did then it shows your lack of understanding of the LDS church on a basic, fundamental level.

 

[Hartsock]

Black men will never be priests, right?

Comparing apples to avacadoes.

 

[Stoked]

People have been sued for refusing commercial, public services to gay couples, not personal, private services.

A self employeed photgrapher in new Mexico, a private baker in Seattle...

 

[One Brow]

Yes, and it makes you feel better to try to vilify my opinion by comparing it to slave owners and the KKK.

I agree that the comparison is bad. There is a really good comparison between your views and the views of people who opposed interracial marriages. You use the same arguments based on similar claims and cast in the same way. The comparison to slave-owners and the KKK is more tenuous.