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The Jazz ought to trade for Zion Williamson

fishonjazz said:
He has been injured a lot. Being injured doesn't mean he doesn't like playing basketball and it's hard to work on your craft when you are injured.
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Look at his weight issues. It’s a good way to be injured all the time. Hes been accused of not having good rehab work ethics, and when healthy he’s lazy about his conditioning. I see what I see
 
SoberasHotRod said:
Why was he not as good last year then? (I don't know the answer to the question)

I would assume that his injuries have taken a toll on him and maybe other things have changed to make him less effective. Or maybe it could just be a ramp up from being injured the year before, maybe the monthly splits bare that out? I'm not an expert on Zion and haven't followed his career that closely to know.

I would be interested to hear from people who have followed him more closely why they think he can be significantly better than he was last year when he was fully healthy. What was holding him back last year?
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I'll answer some of my own questions with a semi-deep dive I just did. I compared his 20/21 season to his 23/24 season to see what the difference was between those two healthy years. I didn't find anything in the monthly splits of the 23/24 season to suggest that he started slow and then was ramping up to his previous form at any point. In fact, he hasn't played much this year, but his numbers are pretty similar to last year.

His usage and efficiency are both down in 23/24 compared to 20/21. His assists are up and rebounds are down. From what I understand NOP started using him as more of a distributor, which probably explains all of the usage being down, but not the efficiency. I would think the efficiency would go up with lower usage.

When I looked at his shooting numbers I think it tells the story pretty clearly. He has shifted a significant number of attempts at the rim to the floater range and his efficiency in the floater range has dropped. In 20/21 he attempted 1.1 floater range shots per game and made 41% of them in 23/24 he attempted 3.5 and made 34% of them. His percentages at the rim only dropped from 65.4% to 64.4%, but he went from attempting 14.3 shots at the rim per game to 11.7.

Have his injuries effected his ability to get to the rim? Has the league adjusted to him in a way that is effecting his ability to get to the rim? Did NOP strategy effect him getting to the rim? I think these are the questions that are important when figuring out if he has the potential to get back to the 20/21 numbers or not.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
Why was he not as good last year then? (I don't know the answer to the question)

I would assume that his injuries have taken a toll on him and maybe other things have changed to make him less effective. Or maybe it could just be a ramp up from being injured the year before, maybe the monthly splits bare that out? I'm not an expert on Zion and haven't followed his career that closely to know.

I would be interested to hear from people who have followed him more closely why they think he can be significantly better than he was last year when he was fully healthy. What was holding him back last year?
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I was simply saying his best case scenario wouldn't be last season since that wasn't his best season and he is only 24 years old. I had no other point to make.
Can he get back to those numbers from his best season? Idk. But that, add a little experience improvement bump, would be his best case scenario. Not his most likely scenario though however.
 
fishonjazz said:
I was simply saying his best case scenario wouldn't be last season since that wasn't his best season and he is only 24 years old. I had no other point to make.
Can he get back to those numbers from his best season? Idk. But that, add a little experience improvement bump, would be his best case scenario. Not his most likely scenario though however.
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OK, got it. NOW we are just arguing semantics, so I apologize.

To be clear, when I say best case scenario, what I'm referring to is best reasonably likely scenario. If people think it's reasonably likely that a 24 year old improves and gets back to what he had already done before, I can see where they are coming from, and maybe they are right. I can also see the argument that he's been in the league for 6 years and hasn't really improved or added anything to his game, he has had multiple instances that point to him not being serious about basketball, his injuries and the league adjusting to him have minimized his effectiveness, and so it's not reasonably likely he ever gets back to his best season.
 
fishonjazz said:
Might as well give a couple of our own picks in the trade since we would be planning to be good after the trade which would make our own picks worth less.
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So if Zion never plays we've dumped great picks for the pleasure of waiving the ever-injured Zion? I'll pass.
 
Zion's issue is that he plays overweight. Until he solves this he will be injured all of the time. I'm struggling to think of any players that overcame this as a pro, especially later in their careers. Maybe Barkley and Deron Williams, but in the later half of their careers they lost that battle.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
OK, got it. NOW we are just arguing semantics, so I apologize.

To be clear, when I say best case scenario, what I'm referring to is best reasonably likely scenario. If people think it's reasonably likely that a 24 year old improves and gets back to what he had already done before, I can see where they are coming from, and maybe they are right. I can also see the argument that he's been in the league for 6 years and hasn't really improved or added anything to his game, he has had multiple instances that point to him not being serious about basketball, his injuries and the league adjusting to him have minimized his effectiveness, and so it's not reasonably likely he ever gets back to his best season.
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Great post. Fair and reasonable
 
hgb said:
So if Zion never plays we've dumped great picks for the pleasure of waiving the ever-injured Zion? I'll pass.
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Yep, it's risky to go after a player like Zion if the price is high.
 
Our picks are going to be waisted and used up anyway. Why not take a risk? It would keep things interesting and you can justifiably rest him for the next year or so.

It may help him realign, refocus and improve OR more likely he is out of the league which would be true for a couple of our picks anyway.
 
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