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The official "let's impeach Trump" thread



Trump should use the FBI like Obama did? Yeah, he should have gone to the FBI and informed them that our chief foreign adversary for the past 70 years was trying to help him attain the presidency of the United States. Damn straight he should have availed himself of the FBI. But the two bit traitor just couldn't bring himself to do that, now could he?
 
There's a lot of misinformation on this thread from people asserting they know things about Ukraine.

Ukraine is COMPLICATED. I barely feel like I have my arms around some of the biggest issues there and I've visited twice and read local newspapers every day. It's difficult for a Westerner to differentiate the single biggest political issue there, the insolvency and nationalization of PrivatBank, from pretty standard Western-style investment banking. Your frame of reference has to shift to get what's happening in that part of the world and you can't do it on the fly.

For example, the "foreign minister" quoted above (Vadym Prystaiko) is a holdover from the Poroshenko era (President pre-Zelensky) and WAS NOT FOREIGN MINISTER AT THE TIME OF THE CALL. I strongly doubt that Das Jazz is aware of the role of the foreign minister in Ukraine's governmental system, the significant turnover in Parliamentary members, or recent changes in rules regarding governmental immunity for ministers and members of the Rada. All of these things touch and concern the statement from Prystaiko, but require more than a simple validation of what you want to be true.

That Trump and Giuliani have been trying to pressure the government to open a bogus investigation has been well-known in Ukraine for months. No one there had any illusions that the decision to withhold military aid was a power play, and one that was calculated to put maximum pressure on a new president trying to actively negotiate a draw down of a frozen conflict on his most important border. If you want to see what the Ukrainians are saying about the last few days, here's an explainer from the top English language news source in the country

https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/trump-whistleblower-scandal-explained-from-ukraine.html

These investigations have been covered for months by the best journalists in Kyiv. There's no there there. There is no indication that Burisma was actually being investigated, or that Shokin's removal had anything to do with that investigation. Shokin had dragged his feet on prosecutions following the Maidan revolution and there was a multilateral push to have him removed. The worst this can be spun as a potential conflict of interest that occurred because Biden is a government official while his son was in the private sector: a standard that no politician can meet - and particularly not the Trumps.

If you want to look at Russian language news sources, their reaction to the story Trump/Biden is trying to tell is even more perplexed. Ukraine is a fragile country trying to do something big under very difficult circumstances. Personally I'm a Zelensky believer, and it's gonna crush me if he gets the Trump stank on him over this.
 
There's a lot of misinformation on this thread from people asserting they know things about Ukraine.

Ukraine is COMPLICATED. I barely feel like I have my arms around some of the biggest issues there and I've visited twice and read local newspapers every day. It's difficult for a Westerner to differentiate the single biggest political issue there, the insolvency and nationalization of PrivatBank, from pretty standard Western-style investment banking. Your frame of reference has to shift to get what's happening in that part of the world and you can't do it on the fly.

For example, the "foreign minister" quoted above (Vadym Prystaiko) is a holdover from the Poroshenko era (President pre-Zelensky) and WAS NOT FOREIGN MINISTER AT THE TIME OF THE CALL. I strongly doubt that Das Jazz is aware of the role of the foreign minister in Ukraine's governmental system, the significant turnover in Parliamentary members, or recent changes in rules regarding governmental immunity for ministers and members of the Rada. All of these things touch and concern the statement from Prystaiko, but require more than a simple validation of what you want to be true.

That Trump and Giuliani have been trying to pressure the government to open a bogus investigation has been well-known in Ukraine for months. No one there had any illusions that the decision to withhold military aid was a power play, and one that was calculated to put maximum pressure on a new president trying to actively negotiate a draw down of a frozen conflict on his most important border. If you want to see what the Ukrainians are saying about the last few days, here's an explainer from the top English language news source in the country

https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/trump-whistleblower-scandal-explained-from-ukraine.html

These investigations have been covered for months by the best journalists in Kyiv. There's no there there. There is no indication that Burisma was actually being investigated, or that Shokin's removal had anything to do with that investigation. Shokin had dragged his feet on prosecutions following the Maidan revolution and there was a multilateral push to have him removed. The worst this can be spun as a potential conflict of interest that occurred because Biden is a government official while his son was in the private sector: a standard that no politician can meet - and particularly not the Trumps.

If you want to look at Russian language news sources, their reaction to the story Trump/Biden is trying to tell is even more perplexed. Ukraine is a fragile country trying to do something big under very difficult circumstances. Personally I'm a Zelensky believer, and it's gonna crush me if he gets the Trump stank on him over this.
I came across this the other day, pretty funny stuff.

 
I'm not a "dem" other than wanting Trump gone.

And Warren is going to bury him in the election. What all you conservatives don't get is that the Dem candidate doesn't need your approval to be a viable candidate.

Conservatives support this?



Really? They want 4 more years of this?
 
Sounds like the one phone call transcript might be released soon. My question is, will congress ever get the entire whistleblower complaint? If not, will democrats just wait until this blows over to move onto... whatever the next attack on our democracy is?

I’m just amazed at how they’re not pressuring this more. If trump is already acting like this now, what will he do in fall 2020 when he’s losing?
 


Sigh

This is how republicans have mastered to play the “liberal media” like a drum. They fling **** at the wall and the “protectors” of our democracy treat the **** like legitimate news, give it equal air time with real news, and the disinformation virus spreads throughout all of society.

“What happened at the game? Well Robinson claims that Malone threw an elbow which hit him in the face and knocked him out while Malone claims that robinson’s Face got in the way of his elbow. Both sides are legitimate and who are we to judge anything? We’re just the liberal media. Democracy does in darkness and stuff.”
 
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For those interested in additional background information - it's worth remembering that about 18 months ago the Ukrainian government concluded that it could not assist the Mueller investigation into Paul Manafort without risking the Trump administration dropping its financial support that keeps the country afloat - including the sale of anti-tank missiles critical to deterring further Russian incursions into the territory.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/02/world/europe/ukraine-mueller-manafort-missiles.html
 
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