Trade deadline discussion

[Handlogten's Heros]

The players going to the Jazz.

Ask Mavs fans how good Josh Richardson was in the playoffs.

Grant Williams isnt playing over Rudy Gay.

I hate watching Williams play... that alone would make me say no.

Richardson is a guy I liked at one time but he is a wildly inconsistent shooter and would prefer to dribble a lot.

 

[NUMBERICA]

I don't hate a deal centered around Conley for Smart (need a bit more back). But Josh Richardson? Not close.

We've gotta get a guard back that can legitimately run this team's offense + share the ball, hit an open three off the dribble, and provide resistance on defense. I'm pretty sure there is exactly one of those in the league, and that is the dude we'd be trading out. It is really hard for me to see a package that includes Conley going out that is either net-positive, or realistic. But sure, if the haul is right.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Our record with and without Conley doesn't show that he's integral.

If that's the litmus, why in god's name are you so obsessed with throwing shade at Rudy (or rather, "building a team around him" as though that is mutually exclusive to having other great players)? The Jazz don't get to .500 without him.

By that same metric, your boy Donovan ain't ****.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I just want to add that Bogey has been awesome and there would certainly be nights we wish we wouldn't have traded him. But you can't get something for nothing besides everything else I mentioned.

Bogey is one of the guys I'm keeping... dude is a gamer and is able to raise his level of play on both ends at times. Moving him takes away a lot of our upside potential imo. He can also slot in at 14-15 points super efficiently and space the floor so the other guys can cook. I honestly don't think Grant, Barnes, etc. are upgrades really at all. If Bogey was on a **** team he could put up 23-24 pts a night on solid efficiency too.

I also don't think we would get dollar for dollar in a trade.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Smart is very available, probably one of the more likely players to be traded in the next year.

If we got Ainge's guy (Smart) and Quin's guy (Schroeder), It would make sense from the "NBA is all about relationships" perspective.

It would give us one more depth piece, but I'm not sure we need that. If we wanted to move on from JC, Dennis+Juancho could also be a BOS deal. Combine it all together and maybe you do Ingles+JC for Smart+Shroeder+Juancho.

Woj said he doesn't think he will be moved. So he may not be as available as we would like to believe. It could be a smokescreen as well... but I think they are holding out to maybe use him in a potential BS deal.

I don't think he's off limits... but if I had to guess I'd say you need to do a better deal than we could.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Bogey is one of the guys I'm keeping... dude is a gamer and is able to raise his level of play on both ends at times. Moving him takes away a lot of our upside potential imo. He can also slot in at 14-15 points super efficiently and space the floor so the other guys can cook. I honestly don't think Grant, Barnes, etc. are upgrades really at all. If Bogey was on a **** team he could put up 23-24 pts a night on solid efficiency too.

I also don't think we would get dollar for dollar in a trade.

Bogey has real defensive limitations though, which is exacerbated by the size of our backcourt (further exacerbated by the putrid effort and focus of Donovan), Royce being a second-tier defensive player, and having absolutely 0 secondary rim protection or sufficiently quick but large perimeter defender. Conley, Gobert, and Mitchell are off the table, and trading Royce would exacerbate the catastrophic weaknesses of the main unit while also not being a piece that would get us the 2-way wing that we need.

I really don't think there's anywhere else to turn to improve the main lineup which at the end of the day is where games are won and lost. If we can get that player without sending Bogey and Quin isn't ride-or-die with Bogey (another big assumption) in the main (closing, especially) lineup, then great. But I try to rely on assumption as little as possible.

 

[LogGrad98]

Bogey is one of the guys I'm keeping... dude is a gamer and is able to raise his level of play on both ends at times. Moving him takes away a lot of our upside potential imo. He can also slot in at 14-15 points super efficiently and space the floor so the other guys can cook. I honestly don't think Grant, Barnes, etc. are upgrades really at all. If Bogey was on a **** team he could put up 23-24 pts a night on solid efficiency too.

I also don't think we would get dollar for dollar in a trade.

I'd keep Bogey. If we could swap Clarkson for say Grant, slot Grant as a starter and bring Bogey off the bench as pure scoring punch that would be great. Easily lift us up another level.

 

[Eminence]

We've gotta get a guard back that can legitimately run this team's offense + share the ball, hit an open three off the dribble, and provide resistance on defense. I'm pretty sure there is exactly one of those in the league, and that is the dude we'd be trading out. It is really hard for me to see a package that includes Conley going out that is either net-positive, or realistic. But sure, if the haul is right.

1) Mike doesn't really take 3s off the dribble

2) Steph can certainly do all those

3) Most notably, I don't think we need all of that in one package.

 

[NUMBERICA]

1) Mike doesn't really take 3s off the dribble

2) Steph can certainly do all those

3) Most notably, I don't think we need all of that in one package.

1) He most certainly does; When he's open. As importantly, though, he doesn't chuck.
2) You know Steph Curry can run our offense after a midseason trade (this is not a dig)? More relevantly, is he available?
3) Why wouldn't we? Donovan is just not good at running the offense and spreading out the scoring, the primary ball handler has to be able to punish a defender that goes under the screen (which Mike is great at), and the Jazz cannot lose any defensive ability.

 

[NUMBERICA]

I'd keep Bogey. If we could swap Clarkson for say Grant, slot Grant as a starter and bring Bogey off the bench as pure scoring punch that would be great. Easily lift us up another level.

We can't swap Clarkson for Grant though. Trust me, I'd love it too if our arguably most self-destructive rotation player returned us a player that theoretically checks off all the boxes of the player we need. Doesn't seem likely though.

 

[LoPo]

If that's the litmus, why in god's name are you so obsessed with throwing shade at Rudy (or rather, "building a team around him" as though that is mutually exclusive to having other great players)? The Jazz don't get to .500 without him.

By that same metric, your boy Donovan ain't ****.

Don is there when it matters most. I want to win a title - not a regular season best record

Sent from my SM-A516U using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Bogey has real defensive limitations though, which is exacerbated by the size of our backcourt (further exacerbated by the putrid effort and focus of Donovan), Royce being a second-tier defensive player, and having absolutely 0 secondary rim protection. Conley, Gobert, and Mitchell are off the table, and trading Royce would exacerbate the catastrophic weaknesses of the main unit while also not being a piece that would get us the 2-way wing that we need.

I really don't think there's anywhere else to turn to improve the main lineup which at the end of the day is where games are won and lost.

All 48 minutes matter. Bogey normally sucks on defense but he has some matchups where he is solid. Royce has not been as good this year and I think the knee is an issue. If we had a different type of perimeter defender I think they could take Royce's minutes and help. You could also move Bogey to the bench in some situation for Gay if you need rebounding.

In the clips series we got terrible contributions from Niang, Favs, Conley (the one game he played). Getting a defensive boost in those spots would have helped. Bogey was really good in that series. He's also an iron man. If we had to make a bold move to improve the defense I might prefer it be Conley over Bogey.