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Was Fes' Play Last Night An Aberration?

GlassEater said:
Good points.
It was a back-to-back against an up-tempo team...after playing big minutes the night before. Fes would have needed oxygen last season if asked to do that.

While I partially agree with IGS that Fes needs actual game time to develop, up to this point he had done little to deserve it.
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Here's how you "deserve" playing time:
Be the best player available at a given spot, independent of off-court activity. Just ask Allen Iverson. In Fes's case he "deserved" to be backup center for much of last year, even without the work ethic (which would've been gravy). He showed is repeatedly, although not consistently (as rookie-time players rarely do), even though it didn't show up on the individual stats.

And over time, Fes is proving my point that playing time was the #1 need. Don't give me BS about conditioning; Okur played for years out of shape, and AJ is the latest exhibit. Fes probably doesn't have as much talent as Jefferson, but he does have the potential to be a better center than Okur. Because centers are for interior defense and scoring before 3-point shooting.

Whether teams (including perhaps the Jazz) didn't recognize that is their problem. Even in these modern times, teams still overrate and underrate players all the time.
 
InGameStrategy said:
Here's how you "deserve" playing time:
Be the best player available at a given spot--in Fes's case, backup center, which he "deserved" to be for most of last year, even without the work ethic. He showed it repeatedly, although not consistently (as rookie-time players rarely do). \

And over time, Fes is proving my point that playing time was the #1 need. Don't give me BS about conditioning; Okur played for years out of shape, and AJ is the latest exhibit. Fes probably doesn't have as much talent as Jefferson, but he does have the potential to be a better center than Okur. Because centers are for interior defense and scoring before 3-point shooting.

Whether teams (including perhaps the Jazz) didn't recognize that is their problem. Even in these modern times, teams still overrate and underrate players all the time.
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How is Fes proving your point that playing time was his #1 need? The way I see it, what we right now are seeing before our very eyes as a new improved Fes is proving the point that sitting him so he got Jerry's message (and not offer after offer like perhaps he and his agent presumed they would) and in turn worked his butt off to get into shape was exactly what he needed.

Bro, I understand your point. But it's very flawed and your obsession with Fes is as bad as write4u's with One Ball, Hopper and the Grassy Knoll.
 
KrazeeEyezKilla said:
How is Fes proving your point that playing time was his #1 need? The way I see it, what we right now are seeing before our very eyes as a new improved Fes is proving the point that sitting him so he got Jerry's message (and not offer after offer like perhaps he and his agent presumed they would) and in turn worked his butt off to get into shape was exactly what he needed.
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How did Fes spend the playoffs? Gathering crucial playing time. The difference from first game Denver was dramatic.

How did Fes spend the summer? Gathering playing time in international play. He also lost weight, but the playoffs were already proof in the process. His conditioning is only a portion of the reason why he's better.

KrazeeEyezKilla said:
Bro, I understand your point. But it's very flawed and your obsession with Fes is as bad as write4u's with One Ball, Hopper and the Grassy Knoll.
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Nope, because Fes showed during the playoffs in beforehand that he should've gotten more PT in regular season because he was an x-factor in beating the Nugs and held his own against the World Champions. Losing weight is helping him with length of minutes, but it helping him to make free throws or know where he is on the floor. In-game playing time is, and Fes didn't get even enough minutes to test his conditioning last year anyway.

BTW, it's not an obsession with Fes. It's an obsession with putting the best combination on the floor that can win a title. By given Fes 10 MPG last year (and more if he "deserved" more), they would have done better last year, and he'd be farther along this year. Probably wouldn't have won a title, but the #1 need last year and this year was controlling the paint. Sloan might have figured that out by now, but it might be by accident.
 
InGameStrategy said:
If you're talking to me, then yes, I'm omniscient, if doing one's homework and having one's theory coming true is omniscient.
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LOL. You're insane bro.

You have zero idea if Fes would be playing like this (2-3 whole games by the way) if he got more playing time or not. Like you said, he showed flashes of this in playoffs even though he didn't get the needed playing time during the season. Ya know, the same playing time that according to you is what he needed to improve. So why did he play well in the playoffs if he didn't get the PT you say was necessary?

You have zero idea whether or not his improved conditioning has improved his mindset and confidence and if it's that that's created a more astute Fes on the court.

You have zero idea whether he's really improved that much considering he pretty much sucked in games this summer--go back and check some box scores against crappy talent. You mention these games as if they helped a ton but for the most part, he was awful in them.

You have zero idea whether this will translate into the regular season.

Fes is inconsistent and an enigma, two things you don't really want in a professional athlete. I love the guy a ton but your blindness here is baffling.

In short, again, I understand your points and in many ways agree with them in the sense that he should have gotten more time last year in blowouts or to a lesser degree, if he had seemed to be working harder and had favorable match-ups. But I'll trust Sloan here. So far it seems to have worked. Perhaps we'll now see a B- Fes for the rest of his career rather than a D Fes had Sloan just played him whenever and wherever like you wanted, and the kid not got a freakin' wake-up call and not tried to perhaps maximize his talent. Well, semi-maximize it.

You have zero idea.
 
Fes' Legend grows with each passing day. I can't understand why Sloan has oppressed Kyrylo Olajuwon-Jabbar.
 
i tend to agree with the theory that once he got the guaranteed contract he won't be working as hard. it is pretty obvious that the agent is instructing him to say all the right things. he repeatedly stated that he had been practicing with his national team since June 24. i mean, if he didn't memorize it like a script, it must be his birthday or something.
 
You guys can argue all you want about whether Fes deserves playing time or not, but the bottom-line truth is that no one but Jerry and his assistants will decide what (if any) minutes he gets.

Fes, by now, knows what Jerry expects out of him in order to get playing time. It's up to Fes to accede to Jerry's wishes, not the other way around. If Fes doesn't do that then he won't play. Simple as that.

And please don't compare Fes to Iverson. I see more parallels with Ostertag (has a brilliant stretch of minutes followed up by a few games where he output is pretty bad).
 
Twin Towers said:
There is a huge difference that most fans do not understand about big men. You need to have a wide frame to put on more weight. i have said this multiple times on this board.

Tomic is a small frame. Not just average or barely below average. He has a very slender frame. He cannot put on much weight. He will get pushed around in the NBA. He also is not quick enough to blow past NBA PF's. And he is way too thin to play Center.

Gasol has a wide frame. He might be skinny when you look at them but his frame is much wider and this allows him to get his shot off easier. And allows him to put on more weight. Which Gasol did and he did not lose quickness.

Tomic won't stay in the NBA. He will play 3 years than realize he can't handle the NBA game. Fesenko is a NBA center. Tomic is a PF in the NBA but a weak one.
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After watching the worlds, I agree Tomic is not an NBA center. He could still do very well as a PF and help spell some time from Milsap against the many 7 foot power forwards in this league. Considering KOC would not trade his rights, I would be absolutely shocked if he is not offered a contract/buyout in a year or two.
 
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