When is this a wasted season?

[NUMBERICA]

It's wasted when/if the Jazz don't have at least one real franchise player either in the upcoming draft or out of the guys already on the roster. It's kind of sad that Trey looks to be far and away the best of those players already (and I'm not dogging on Trey).

 

[fishonjazz]

It's kind of sad that Trey looks to be far and away the best of those players already (and I'm not dogging on Trey).

I think trey is not far and away our best player, I think alec, and favors have looked very good for a decent amount of games too.... but we still need that superstar cause burks burke and favor playing pretty good ain't enough

 

[NUMBERICA]

I think trey is not far and away our best player, I think alec, and favors have looked very good for a decent amount of games too.... but we still need that superstar cause burks burke and favor playing pretty good ain't enough

Burke is playing in a manner that the Jazz haven't had since Deron. It's not a strictly positional thing, and I'm not saying he's an all-star (yet), either. The Jazz haven't had a ballhandler that can bend a game to his will with anywhere near the quality of Burke. That applies to Hayward, Burks, Harris, and Mo. He's not exactly Stockton or Malone-esque in terms of consistency, but he's more consistently good than anyone else on the current team as well (except for maybe Marvin, who has an entire career of underperformance and his own inconsistency issues to answer for), regardless of position.

Burke's had a few poor games while Hayward's had vast stretches where he can't score efficiently and Burks has still blown terribly for half of this season. Kanter is going for some sort of negative +/- record and you never quite know what you're getting out of Favors on a given night. I feel I know what I'm getting out of Trey already, as a rookie.

So yes, far and away.

All that said, you can bet your god damn balls I don't want to win a lot of games this year with this roster.

 

[Avery]

We're no longer guaranteed to be the worst team of all time, so as long as we lose our next 48 games, we're good.

 

[fishonjazz]

We're no longer guaranteed to be the worst team of all time, so as long as we lose our next 48 games, we're good.

This lol

 

[LogGrad98]

Failed season - 36-46, 14th pick, no action in free agency, yet another late lottery year. This would set us up for a half decade of mediocrity minimum.

 

[DForceAUS]

Id be happy if we didn't win anymore (the tanker in me) at least we now are sure not to end up with worst ever record- that said I'm sure we end up 25-30 wins.
wasted season as several others well said would be- 1. keeping Jefferson, Williams, Lucas (although I think sadly we're stuck with him) and keep playing them over younger -Kanter, Gobert and Garret/Clarke even
2.Winning more than 30 games and then getting a pick 6-14, superstars in this draft may only be top two picks out to six solid players- lets hope we get a top 4 anyway
3.Corbin- this is the clincher he has to go at the end of the season, if we get a top 3/4 pick or and end up with jabari (etc) he's not the right man to lead the young ones to their best.

 

[Notes]

The Jazz have appeared to be much more aggressive and foward thinking blah blah blah...

Forward thinking? forward thinking?? Tyrone Kennedy Corbin is far and away the least forward-thinking individual on the planet. Given our circumstance, playing Richard Jefferson 40 minutes so we can beat the HornCats is the opposite of forward thinking.

Playing Raja Bell, Josh Howard, C.J. Miles, Earl Watson, Jamal Tinsley, etc. anything more than garbage minutes the past three seasons at the expense of developing young talent is not forward thinking.

You know what franchise is forward-thinking? The Golden State Warriors. When they acquired young talent via the draft, they did what they could to DEVELOP that young talent into playmakers. Our very own Richard Jefferson rarely saw the court in the Bay Area because Mark Jackson and Co. were trying to accomplish the very thing Ty Corbin is too dumb to do: forward thinking. They knew the youth they had on that team was capable of developing into a legitimate playoff-caliber team. The W's have had their challenges so far this season but there's no denying their long-term outlook is very positive, largely because the growth of their youth was not stunted from being benched in favor of washed up, hack vets.

I loved the moves Dennis Lindsey made over the summer. They indeed showed forward thinking. I even thought to myself, "This is perfect. Not even Corbin is dumb enough to screw this up." Little did I know.

Lindsey can still show some big time forward thinking and right this mess before it's too late. He's got to know the only way this franchise will ever become anything worth caring about is by getting a star. Well, this just happens to be the ideal draft for getting one of those. By far, the most forward-thinking thing we could possibly do right now is TANK. I don't want to hear anything about "honor". In today's NBA, only two types of teams accomplish anything worth a damn: teams that can sign star free agents like Miami (NOT the Jazz), and teams that TANK like San Antonio. Meanwhile, the "honorable" teams wallow in mediocrity. The Jazz have a rare opportunity NOW and who knows if we'll ever get it again.

So the OP asks, "When is this a wasted season?"

If we don't get ourselves into position to draft a super star, this season is a waste. It's as simple as that. We have too ideal a situation to let such a very rare opportunity like this get away. It's all right there for the taking.

/rant

 

[Stoked]

Forward thinking? forward thinking?? Tyrone Kennedy Corbin is far and away the least forward-thinking individual on the planet. Given our circumstance, playing Richard Jefferson 40 minutes so we can beat the HornCats is the opposite of forward thinking.

Playing Raja Bell, Josh Howard, C.J. Miles, Earl Watson, Jamal Tinsley, etc. anything more than garbage minutes the past three seasons at the expense of developing young talent is not forward thinking.

You know what franchise is forward-thinking? The Golden State Warriors. When they acquired young talent via the draft, they did what they could to DEVELOP that young talent into playmakers. Our very own Richard Jefferson rarely saw the court in the Bay Area because Mark Jackson and Co. were trying to accomplish the very thing Ty Corbin is too dumb to do: forward thinking. They knew the youth they had on that team was capable of developing into a legitimate playoff-caliber team. The W's have had their challenges so far this season but there's no denying their long-term outlook is very positive, largely because the growth of their youth was not stunted from being benched in favor of washed up, hack vets.

I loved the moves Dennis Lindsey made over the summer. They indeed showed forward thinking. I even thought to myself, "This is perfect. Not even Corbin is dumb enough to screw this up." Little did I know.

Lindsey can still show some big time forward thinking and right this mess before it's too late. He's got to know the only way this franchise will ever become anything worth caring about is by getting a star. Well, this just happens to be the ideal draft for getting one of those. By far, the most forward-thinking thing we could possibly do right now is TANK. I don't want to hear anything about "honor". In today's NBA, only two types of teams accomplish anything worth a damn: teams that can sign star free agents like Miami (NOT the Jazz), and teams that TANK like San Antonio. Meanwhile, the "honorable" teams wallow in mediocrity. The Jazz have a rare opportunity NOW and who knows if we'll ever get it again.

So the OP asks, "When is this a wasted season?"

If we don't get ourselves into position to draft a super star, this season is a waste. It's as simple as that. We have too ideal a situation to let such a very rare opportunity like this get away. It's all right there for the taking.

/rant

So you agree that Lindsey has shown to be forward thinking. That's all you had to say.

 

[Stifle Tower]

It's quickly becoming a wasted season with Williams and Jefferson as the featured "stars" and Kanter and Burks the forgotten players. And, as a result, the Jazz are gaining on the other tankers. They could easily finish in the 8-10 range, picking up a solid, but not great player. Meanwhile, they'll do nothing at the trade deadline, not wanting to tie up cap space by trading any of their expirings for overpriced veterans. It happened with Big Al and Millsap; it will happen again with Williams and Jefferson.

 

[Mission Accomplished]

I think he put forward a great argument that GS has made the sacrifices by actually playing their youth. He is complementing DL on his move that he has made. Yet, he is laying down the plan is not working out perfectly right now. We could be both developing and moving forward to that top pick. He put forward players that were role playing vets in the past to show how little we care about what they did to make our current team's structure. Just like next year if we don't get one of those game changers we will look back and scratch our heads at the minutes Jefferson and Williams are getting.

 

[l Abach l]

If we don't obtain a franchise player I think most here in Utah will remain asleep. There are a ton of "fans" disguised in green seats. I've never seen so much green in the Delta Center. Literally, no one talks about the Jazz anymore. Fandom is at an all time low, IMO. If the Utes make a run in the next year or so while the jazz remain boring and suck, they will continue to dig a deeper hole for themselves.

If the jazz hope to remain in this market then they need to obtain a franchise player this summer. It's that simple. 3 straight poor/mediocre seasons without any real hope of improving drastically by obtaining a franchise player who can sell jerseys and tickets will spell doom for this small market franchise.

This x 1,000,000
I don't think people realize that if the jazz continue to suck, not only will the organization suffer losses through attendance, but also through lack of sponsors, ads in the ESA, etc... Who will want to spend $500,000 a year advertising to 5,000 people a game? I think Thriller is spot on. If the Jazz don't get a franchise player who can sell, then this team could move within the next 3 years imo.

 

[The Fresh Prince]

When is this a wasted season? I guess when Lindsey tells the team they can take the year off and show up to games drunk.

WASTED Season.

 

[Notes]

So you agree that Lindsey has shown to be forward thinking. That's all you had to say.

Yes but Corbin is showing he will ruin everything if DL doesn't do something. Now he's going to have to demonstrate more forward thinking to salvage the forward thinking he showed during the summer by doing one of the following:

a) Fire Corbin and sign a puppet interim coach to drive the tank.
b) Force Corbin to stick to the plan of Develop & Tank. No more heavy minutes for RJ & Marv. 35 minutes a night for the youth, then finish the game with the JLIII's, Mike Harris's and Biedrins's of the team.
c) Force Corbin in a little more subtle fashion, trading away RJ & Marv for draft picks. I'm also of the opinion we should trade Hayward though I'm sure some will disagree.

Option A would be ideal, obviously, but it doesn't really matter how Lindsey does it as long as he gets it done.

 

[slc]

It seems like Corbin already is a company man.
He never bad mouths the Jazz and the Millers.
He seems like he's willing to follow orders.
He seems like he's willing to fall on his sword for the Jazz.
Maybe he already is following orders.
Can't really figure out what Lindsay's up to right now.

 

[NUMBERICA]

It seems like Corbin already is a company man.
He never bad mouths the Jazz and the Millers.
He seems like he's willing to follow orders.
He seems like he's willing to fall on his sword for the Jazz.
Maybe he already is following orders.
Can't really figure out what Lindsay's up to right now.

It's really, REALLY ****ing simple:
-Corbin is coaching to win. That's what coaches do, and the Jazz won't tank on the floor.
-Lindsey setup the team so that the young guys would have to get minutes and for the team to be poor by filling out the roster with odds and ends. Making trades isn't something that's done willy nilly and it shouldn't be.

From here, I'm not sure what happens. Ultimately, Lindsey is under the directive of the Millers and I am just hoping that Gail (the actual owner of the team) isn't getting jumpy for wins. Lindsey has to do something, though. Has to.

 

[One Brow]

Failed season - 36-46, 14th pick, no action in free agency, yet another late lottery year. This would set us up for a half decade of mediocrity minimum.

There will be at least two teams in the WC at .500 or better, not in the playoffs. You would you feel about 44-38 and the 14th pick?

 

[Stoked]

This x 1,000,000
I don't think people realize that if the jazz continue to suck, not only will the organization suffer losses through attendance, but also through lack of sponsors, ads in the ESA, etc... Who will want to spend $500,000 a year advertising to 5,000 people a game? I think Thriller is spot on. If the Jazz don't get a franchise player who can sell, then this team could move within the next 3 years imo.

Missing this draft does not mean that they will continue to suck. The Jazz have shown over the last 30 years that they can build teams that at least appear to challenge. That will be enough for the masses.

 

[Stoked]

There will be at least two teams in the WC at .500 or better, not in the playoffs. You would you feel about 44-38 and the 14th pick?

Keeping it in context of this thread (wasted season) I would be OK with that if it is coupled with an aggressive free agency. Keep in mind I said OK not happy or thrilled.

Only way, for me, that this is a wasted season (fairly strong phrase) is if Utah ends up at that 14th pick on the backs of our vets and then have a dud of a free agency.

As long as the Jazz have either a high (top 3-5) draft pick or a great free agency I will be somehwere from OK to thrilled. However I am rooting for a top 3 pick and a stellar free agency. Reach for those damn stars my friend.

 

[LogGrad98]

There will be at least two teams in the WC at .500 or better, not in the playoffs. You would you feel about 44-38 and the 14th pick?

Basically any record that gets us a 9-14 pick and a crappy free agency period will constitute a failed season. They need to get aggressive somehow, and show they are serious about putting a winning team on the floor. Another mediocre season followed by another passive off season will constitute a failed season and set us up for years of crap.

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