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François Isaac de Rivaz, the first one to put an internal combustion engine into a frame as an automobile was a surveyor and notary.

Thank you for helping to make my point. That was a year after he had patented an internal combustion engine. He knew the field well enough to be an inventor in it.
 
Provide no guidance to a 16-year-old who is making decisions that will affect them when they are 40?

Several thoughts.

It’s not like they can’t change their minds later. People do it all the time now.

I didn’t say provide no guidance. I said put it all in front of them and see what you get. What catches their eye, what questions do they come up with? Actually let them take a driving role in shaping their future. What decisions do they make?

Also high schoolers don’t have to make that decision at 16. They can do so at 18 or even later if they wish.
 
Provide no guidance to a 16-year-old who is making decisions that will affect them when they are 40?
You do realize many developed nations do exactly this right now and very successful right? Of course there is some level of direction and guidance but the choice is still made pretty early. Of course it does not entirely preclude college but it sets them early on a vocational tract.
 
Thank you for helping to make my point. That was a year after he had patented an internal combustion engine. He knew the field well enough to be an inventor in it.
The question is how did he get the knowledge? Was it broad institutional learning or specified focus in a given area? Just shows there are multiple ways to get specialized knowledge of a given subject.
 
The money that is allocated for education is given to parents in the form of vouchers. The parents decide which schools and programs they are willing to spend their vouchers on. The idea is to create competition in the marketplace in order to promote quality education.

The marketplace has done a fantastic job of providing Americans with quality health care
 
It’s not like they can’t change their minds later. People do it all the time now.

I teach a lot of adults who didn't go past algebra in high school. It's much harder for them to pick this up at 30 than at 16.

Also high schoolers don’t have to make that decision at 16. They can do so at 18 or even later if they wish.

That's been my point.
 
You do realize many developed nations do exactly this right now and very successful right? Of course there is some level of direction and guidance but the choice is still made pretty early. Of course it does not entirely preclude college but it sets them early on a vocational tract.

In America we value the pretense that anyone can go on to do anything.
 
The question is how did he get the knowledge? Was it broad institutional learning or specified focus in a given area? Just shows there are multiple ways to get specialized knowledge of a given subject.

I expect some of both. As you pointed out, he was a surveyor and a notary in addition to an inventor.
 
I want people who aren't in education to quit telling us how we need to fix education.

Well, I agree with this with a simple stipulation..... that we agree that public education is not actually "education". Well, at least not since John Dewey and the socialists wrecked the concept. "Trained to the Task" is not real education.

I like the idea of vocational/technical education a lot..... skills training not indoctrination/socialism. But for higher education we need to get the Marxism outta the schools. Call it "Separation of Propagandists Indoctrination from State Management", the modern "Separation of Church and State".

We can sell off all the public schools, largely. All a kid needs today is a computer and a little cubby hole.... a desk in his/her bedroom. The public school teachers can learn to deal cards for the casinos.... it's less harmful to society than being "Bricks in the Wall" of global fascism.

I would concede that we need sports programs. My kids go to the high school to do the sports. So we can build rec centers on a convenient frequency for still having "local sports" kids can do.

I'm damned impressed when I finally get home. My computer/study has been taken over by my dau, who just got picked up for the hs varsity track team and does pretty good with a basketball too. So I come in, and have to go over her schoolwork sitting in neat piles on my desk. She's way ahead of me for her age.
 
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Karl Benz designed and built industrial scales and Bridges before he started working in engines.

The critical issue here is liberty. In a society that goes to an extreme.... like ours does currently imo…. in reliance on professionalism/experts in ever narrower specialties.... people lose the ability to be truly innovative as a cultural value. It goes more and more to knowing how to do the traditional thing.

Just having the liberty to break outta the mold and do it all different is essential.
 
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