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College Debt Forgiveness

RandyForRubio said:
Why?
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isn't usury considered to be a huge sin in Christianity?

Makes you wonder why the fixation on this is absent while it isn't on...idk...abortion and homosexuality.

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this is a much better plan than Warren's. Scores of other countries have figured out how to cover school from Pre-K to PhD but Americans are too busy climaxing to the thought of war that they can't figure it out themselves. There's scores of research comparing the debt load that current generations of Americans carry in comparison to the 80-90s (housing market, tuition cost, etc.) but if you're going to carry on with the myth of "greater things aren't possible!" then that's your prerogative.

final note: this meme of "THIS BENEFITS RICH KIDS MOSTLY!" is beyond stupid, and asinine. Who's going to be paying most of the taxes to fund these sorts of programs?
 
RandyForRubio said:
Ah yes.

State funded institutions raising prices because of federal funded guaranteed loans SCREAMS capitalism.
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That's pretty much what happens when a state subsidy is applied in return for poorly defined parameters, its basically what happens here with private health insurance which receives a government subsidy (of sorts you receive a tax rebate or penalty if you are a certain age and income and have or don't have private health cover, its a joke, private health schemes should more or less be abolished in my opinion.) the companies adjust their prices to the rebate and continue to raise prices on consumers.
 
dalamon said:
isn't usury considered to be a huge sin in Christianity?

Makes you wonder why the fixation on this is absent while it isn't on...idk...abortion and homosexuality.

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this is a much better plan than Warren's. Scores of other countries have figured out how to cover school from Pre-K to PhD but Americans are too busy climaxing to the thought of war that they can't figure it out themselves. There's scores of research comparing the debt load that current generations of Americans carry in comparison to the 80-90s (housing market, tuition cost, etc.) but if you're going to carry on with the myth of "greater things aren't possible!" then that's your prerogative.

final note: this meme of "THIS BENEFITS RICH KIDS MOSTLY!" is beyond stupid, and asinine. Who's going to be paying most of the taxes to fund these sorts of programs?
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Don't forget adultery that's a lot of fun. i honestly could never imagine America having properly free education, we used to have it and probably could have had it again during our last economic boom if the government had made sensible choices but tax cuts for the rich was more important. We have the HECS system or whatever they call it now, basically you end up owing the government a debt (the amount increases with CPI i think) and you pay it back once you earn over a certain amount, 55k I think. It actually ends up as a pretty good way to save money I continue to pay the higher tax rate like i did when I had a HECS debt so I can claim it back as a lump sum every financial year.
 
Ron Mexico said:
In SLC there is simply a housing shortage which is why rent is going up. But a lot of housing is low income housing that isnt filled. So it is creating an arbitrary higher housing shortage for people who dont qualify for the low income and this is driving up prices. I dont know if that is happening other places as well but I would guess its a common problem in bigger cities. Apartments have a lot of incentive in SLC to be low income housing.
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In most parts of the country, there are at least two types of public housing assistance. There are directly subsidized, but there is also section 8. Landlords who rent section 8 properties are not limited from taking higher-income clients who do not qualify for section 8 assistance. However, many people would rather pay higher rents than live in properties that also have section 8 clients. So, the shortage of units is partly driven by this factor.
 
dalamon said:
isn't usury considered to be a huge sin in Christianity?

Makes you wonder why the fixation on this is absent while it isn't on...idk...abortion and homosexuality.

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Hi Dala!

Lending money with interest in the Bible is directed towards God's followers, specifically the Jewish people. It's also on a personal level, not a state issue. As the government is not a follower of God, I cannot expect them to follow the same steps. I myself do not account for interest when loaning money to people. I feel the same way about legislating for homosexuality, and other similar issues. As I believe abortion is murder, that behaves differently in regard to government intercession. The context of all of those things matter, a bit.

Fwiw, I'm just fine with lowering the interest rate on loans. 6% seems pretty crazy. Eliminating it seems just as crazy. Interest has to account for inflation plus some. Money doesn't just appear from nowhere.
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One Brow said:
In most parts of the country, there are at least two types of public housing assistance. There are directly subsidized, but there is also section 8. Landlords who rent section 8 properties are not limited from taking higher-income clients who do not qualify for section 8 assistance. However, many people would rather pay higher rents than live in properties that also have section 8 clients. So, the shortage of units is partly driven by this factor.
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This reminds me.

I had a boss who rented out some properties. He used to do section 8 bc it was guaranteed money, didn't have to worry about rent checks coming in late or not at all. He ended up stopping because the properties got wrecked, constantly.

Anecdotal, of course, but it's not just that people don't want to live near section 8 inhabitants bc of socioeconomic status.
 
The real question is why the **** is college that expensive in the first place.

I graduated in 1994 and I paid about 300% less than what people pay today? Is the quality of education 300% better today? Doubt it. I paid for about 85% of my college education by working part-time during the school year and full time in the summer.

The admin to student ratio has skyrocketed in the last 30 or so years. The government should audit these universities and refuse student loans to schools that will take government money to fund their bloated bureaucracies
 
Americans typically have the narrowest and least historically relevant views on debt.

The student loan issue is nothing short of a crisis. Look at the amount of debt out there and then tell me that something drastic shouldn’t be done.

And please stop pushing exceptional cases like on page 1, post number ****ing 2. We could barely wait a minute before chucking sand into the machine of Clear Thinking on this issue. Do better, franklin.
 
candrew said:
The real question is why the **** is college that expensive in the first place.

I graduated in 1994 and I paid about 300% less than what people pay today? Is the quality of education 300% better today? Doubt it. I paid for about 85% of my college education by working part-time during the school year and full time in the summer.

The admin to student ratio has skyrocketed in the last 30 or so years. The government should audit these universities and refuse student loans to schools that will take government money to fund their bloated bureaucracies
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Bc universities were essentially told they could charge whatever they wanted when they found out that students could get guaranteed no caps federal school loans.

Issa big problem. Short sighted "solution" to a problem without thinking of what might occur from that. AND PEOPLE WANT TO DO IT AGAIN!
 
candrew said:
The real question is why the **** is college that expensive in the first place.

I graduated in 1994 and I paid about 300% less than what people pay today? Is the quality of education 300% better today? Doubt it. I paid for about 85% of my college education by working part-time during the school year and full time in the summer.

The admin to student ratio has skyrocketed in the last 30 or so years. The government should audit these universities and refuse student loans to schools that will take government money to fund their bloated bureaucracies
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College is still cheap at many places. It's the big name schools and out of state tuition prices that are crazy high. State universities in state tuition is still pretty reasonable.
 
Ron Mexico said:
College is still cheap at many places. It's the big name schools and out of state tuition prices that are crazy high. State universities in state tuition is still pretty reasonable.
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Totally.

At my local school (which is a fine school, but it's just average overall) the in-state tuition is $7800/yr. The out of state tuition is $26k. 325% higher for out of state! Why would anybody do that if they don't have a scholarship?!

The local 2 year program is $3400/yr.

There are a bevy of affordable options, if one so chooses.
 
Ron Mexico said:
He makes 4k per month and has a partner who could be making money and should be. Yet he makes his poor parents pay $600 per month. What a ****** kid. He should have gone to a cheaper school or worked harder for a scholarship. Also I'm guessing there were programs in place to help offset costs that they didn't use. Hopefully because of ignorance. Someone at their school should have helped them with that. Schools should help with that.
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Agreed.

Also actually working to pay for school seems to be an option no one considers anymore. When I went to college I worked a full 40+ hour work-week, including at least one overtime shift every week or 2, while attending full-time and my wife working part-time to take care of the kids. In that I completed a double-major (German with commercial emphasis along with logistics and operations management) which I then blew out into 2 degrees with minors in economics and international management. I did that in 5 years during which time we added 2 kids to our family, in addition to the 1 we had when I started.

But since I worked through it all I only needed loans for about half of my school costs. Paid off those loans within 5 years or so after school. I had a lot of friends in college who did very similar to pay for their school. But It just seems like no one wants to put in the effort to do that now. I know my son says he can't afford to go to school because he would have to get so many loans, but when I ask him how much he could pay towards his own school he tells me he would have to quit working or switch to a barely part-time schedule to go to school. This is not a limited thing either. My daughter and her husband are mostly working their way through what expenses they have after scholarships, but she says very few of the people they know are doing the same thing.
 
One Brow said:
Rent prices are also going up, and there are no federal rent tax credits.
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To see the impact of the tax credit you would have to compare home prices with the tax credit to home prices without the credit. Obviously, people can afford a more expensive house when they get a tax break.

Since home prices have "always" been deductible, you can't make that comparison.

The fact that rents and houses have both gone up or down due to some other exogenous factor has nothing to do with this issue.
 
silesian said:
To see the impact of the tax credit you would have to compare home prices with the tax credit to home prices without the credit. Obviously, people can afford a more expensive house when they get a tax break.

Since home prices have "always" been deductible, you can't make that comparison.

The fact that rents and houses have both gone up or down due to some other exogenous factor has nothing to do with this issue.
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While I'm not really interested enough to do the research, I suppose a partial answer could be had by looking at the rate of increase in rents vs. the rate of increase in home prices. If they are basically the same, the tax credit would not be contributing much to the rate of increase.
 
One Brow said:
While I'm not really interested enough to do the research, I suppose a partial answer could be had by looking at the rate of increase in rents vs. the rate of increase in home prices. If they are basically the same, the tax credit would not be contributing much to the rate of increase.
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If it is in place both before and after the change, you cannot see the impact of the change. It is experimental design stuff, you know?
 
silesian said:
If it is in place both before and after the change, you cannot see the impact of the change. It is experimental design stuff, you know?
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A bias in absolute value does not imply a bias in change in value. That's also basic experimental design stuff.
 
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