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The official "let's impeach Trump" thread

colton said:
Wow, just wow. If any of you get your news by watching Ticket Carlson, you should know he is routing for totalitarian Russia to hammer the fledgling democracy of Ukraine.
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I didn't see where Carlson said that. Between Ukraine and Russia, the issues are not settled, will not be settled. But under Obama, Russia made moves for territory and Obama gave no lethal weapon assistance to Ukraine. Ambassador Yankovich didn't support putting weapons on the border. the idea was to contain Russia with publicity, and bring Russia to negotiate a cease-fire. Ukraine was considered unreliable. George Soros' money was enough to tilt the 2014 election.

To be fair about Russia, the negotiations around the START treaty, where Russia was letting go of the missiles in Ukraine, we settled on assurances that Westerners would not interfere in the Ukraine, that it would not be taken into NATO. Ukraine was supposed to be a buffer state between the East and West, but Russia figured it would be pretty much under their thumb. There is enough anti-Russian sentiment in the Ukraine, from historical events like Stalin's starvation tactics, that were in fact genocidal, it is pretty certain Ukraine will never really be happy to be a Russian satellite. But there are areas where the population in the Ukraine consists largely of Russians. It is clear there needs to be a change in the borders. That will be the only stable resolution there. Yes, Russia went in militarily..... in response to Soro's meddling in the Ukraine election which threw out a pro-Russian leader.

No need to say it was good as it was. No need to argue about arms. The truth is, a plebisite would be the fair resolution of the issue. Voting. Some people might wanna move. Let them. Russia should be given all the bad press it deserves, but newsmen like Carlson should NOT just be partisan. It sounded like that, some. But I think it was more of an effort to just not be partisan, and not in favor of arming the border and increasing the border violence.

Russia has made a serious media play in favor of Zelensky recently, trying to set the stage for a settlement I believe. They literally crowed about the news when it was evident that there was no deal for arms per se from Trump. That Zelensky would not just roll for the USA.

Don't make any mistake about this. The Huntsman line about Russia is wrong. Russia is nationalist. Ukraine is nationalist. There will be a peace made between these two if the West just gets outta the picture. Russia will tolerate some arms going into Ukraine, so long as the Ukraine is not being owned by US.
 
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Harambe said:
False. There's any number of reasons to put someone on ignore. Not caring what the truth is, would be one of the least likely.
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OK. This is a point worth talking about. I have one person on ignore because I failed to see any point is discussing anything with him. It was a style issue, an intellect issue. The comments went too heavily on the argumentative. Not a stupid person, just not someone I really didn't care to spend time on.

Fair enough if anyone puts me on ignore for such reasons. You can still discuss stuff and maybe learn something from the people you do respond to.

On the other hand, the point I was aiming at was that the discussion will actually go nowhere until someone decides it's worthwhile to reconsider some things. I think it's fair enough to imagine that might be because the issue has gone to bed on established commitments or decisions, though I admit that might not be exactly the same thing as not caring what the truth is.

I don't think I will ever really change Gameface, for example. But worth reading what he does. Fun, maybe..... in some weird sense.... like it's a proxy fight with my brother who says the same things.... and hence ups my game.....
 
For all my blasts on the CFR..... just so you know..... I worked for years for a member, and all the speakers coming to town came up to the office across the hall from where I worked. I could often hear what they talked about. Well, more than one such. Now you can get a membership roster.... incomplete because members can decline being listed, get announcements for coming events, and publications of speeches given and suggested reading lists, and apply for membership, subject to review and acceptance. But you promise not to disclose "news" from the meetings, or make attributions to what people said there. That's why the Biden tape, the boast of what he did in the Ukraine, will not appear in any media owned or produced or discussed by CFR members. Someone broke the rules.

I would want to start an organization like that which had a slightly different agenda, and some different speakers on tour..... but open to the public and allowing the Press to come in and interview members.

But I would be somewhat placated if any member in those meetings makes statements about illegal or unethical conduct should either be internally disciplined or expunged from the group, or if the illegalities would by rules be reported to appropriate authorities, and not just covered up and not talked about.
 
colton said:
Wow, just wow. If any of you get your news by watching Ticket Carlson, you should know he is routing for totalitarian Russia to hammer the fledgling democracy of Ukraine.
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literally was about to post this.

Again, serious question, where are we as a country when we “don’t care” that Russia is invading western democracies and testing potential weapons on them that they’ll use on us? The first country that Russia blitzed with disinformation trolls on social media wasn’t us, it was Ukraine.

And why ANYONE would root for Russia is beyond me. Russia is everything a liberal democracy stands up against. If you care about free and fair elections, if you care about Human rights, and if you care about corruption, there’s no way you can root for Russia. But apparently, Tucker finds it more lucrative to spew this nonsense.
 
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The Thriller said:
literally was about to post this.

Again, serious question, where are we as a country when we “don’t care” that Russia is invading western democracies and testing potential weapons on them that they’ll use on us? The first country that Russia blitzed with disinformation trolls on social media wasn’t us, it was Ukraine.

And why ANYONE would root for Russia is beyond me.
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To people really not understand the national interest in maintaining a stable Europe? The twentieth century wasn't that long ago ffs
 
Zombie said:
I just saw this and my jaw just about hit the floor.

I mean, what the ****?!
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Well, I'm not imagining that you care to be realistic here. I mean Biden can say everything's cool with China, right.

Tucker had a pretty effective proponent of the dem position in front of him, where the recent talking point is all about Ukraine's desperate need for advanced arms, anti-tank stuff. But the dems under Obama, and Ambassador Yankovich, declined requested lethal arms assistance to Ukraine, on the theory that Russia could be shamed publicly through media coverage, and would sit down and agree to something.

Tucker did say he was pro-Russian, and that he didn't favor arming the border. The other guy was claiming Trump is going to deny arms to Ukraine, crow a bit, and then go to war with China. That was the crazy man on the stage. Basically, it was a crazed imagination that Trump will totally ruin every possible foreign policy position we have with arbitrary uninformed swaggering stupidity. That should be the statement that rings your alarm bells and brings you to question the statements.

I have heard other republicans discussing the Ukraine sorta saying the same thing as the Obama policy. "We don't want to arm this fight". "Russia will behave better if we don't send in arms". Professing neutrality, or balancing the rhetoric in the discussion, is a level-headed and cool attitude that could build a settlement of the problems. Carlson, was just balancing the crazed loon on the left.

I did my bit above. Read that if you care to.
 
Zombie said:
To people really not understand the national interest in maintaining a stable Europe? The twentieth century wasn't that long ago ffs
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I think you bring up a really good question. It’s almost as if Fox News viewers have forgotten the lessons of WWI... and WWII... and The Cold War.

I was wondering, has nearly 3 decades of peace and relative calm after the collapse of the USSR, left our country feeling too secure? Have we reached a point where enough people have become so self-absorbed and intellectually lazy that they no longer feel the need to sustain western democracy as a whole? Seriously, do we need a new Extinction level threat to wake us up?

I wonder how many factory workers in Ohio watching Tucker at night and thinking he makes a lot of sense? It’s scary

I for one don’t want a return of genocide caused by nationalism. Or living under constant threat of nuclear war. Yet, it appears that so many are now taking safety and peace for granted.

“Why should I care what happens to Ukraine?”
“I root for Putin?”

Todays segment alone should be cause to fire Tucker.

btw, what’s up with Fox News? They’ve always been awful. But between peddling trump and kennedy’s russian disinformation and now cheerleading Putin, what’s the Fundamental difference Between Fox and RT?
 
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babe said:
OK. This is a point worth talking about. I have one person on ignore because I failed to see any point is discussing anything with him. It was a style issue, an intellect issue. The comments went too heavily on the argumentative. Not a stupid person, just not someone I really didn't care to spend time on.

Fair enough if anyone puts me on ignore for such reasons. You can still discuss stuff and maybe learn something from the people you do respond to.

On the other hand, the point I was aiming at was that the discussion will actually go nowhere until someone decides it's worthwhile to reconsider some things. I think it's fair enough to imagine that might be because the issue has gone to bed on established commitments or decisions, though I admit that might not be exactly the same thing as not caring what the truth is.

I don't think I will ever really change Gameface, for example. But worth reading what he does. Fun, maybe..... in some weird sense.... like it's a proxy fight with my brother who says the same things.... and hence ups my game.....
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Babe, changing his goal posts. As is tradition.

When you no longer believe a person has a point other than to be an argumentative bitch that conveniently forgets facts pointed out to them multiple times, multiple ways, by multiple posters, it's acceptable to put them on ignore
 
In other news, Mr Trump has appointed his son-in-law Jared Kushner, already tasked with bringing peace to the Middle East, to oversee the construction of his US-Mexico border wall, according to reports, as the row over his decision to pardon Navy SEAL Eddie Gallagher of war crimes rumbles on.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
 
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