50 Reasons Not To Go To BYU
- Thread starter scootsy
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jimmy eat jazz
Well-Known Member
Though I have grave concerns about BYU, I'll be the first to support it and say that it offers a first-rate education at a very modest price for LDS members. In fact, I'd go as far to say that they benefit/cost of attending BYU (education benefit compared to cost) is among the highest in the nation, again for LDS members who pay ridiculously low tuition. (I personally had a great time there when I was young and a devout believer.)
That said, I would discourage any of my children from attending because at the end of the day, BYU does not encourage true freedom of thought or intellectual honesty. In certain areas of belief/knowledge, it prescribes a rather fixed set of parameters and then marginalizes those who do not find these parameters fulfilling. I would say to anyone that if you are not 100% sold on LDS beliefs, and that you believe religious and personal knowledge is a path of discovery and not an established set of 'knowledge' determined by religious authority, and that you life might take you in directions not prescribed by LDS leadership, then stay the hell away from BYU and go find yourself and discover your own 'truths' somewhere else.
That said, I would discourage any of my children from attending because at the end of the day, BYU does not encourage true freedom of thought or intellectual honesty. In certain areas of belief/knowledge, it prescribes a rather fixed set of parameters and then marginalizes those who do not find these parameters fulfilling. I would say to anyone that if you are not 100% sold on LDS beliefs, and that you believe religious and personal knowledge is a path of discovery and not an established set of 'knowledge' determined by religious authority, and that you life might take you in directions not prescribed by LDS leadership, then stay the hell away from BYU and go find yourself and discover your own 'truths' somewhere else.
7StraightIsGreat
Well-Known Member
Thriller Wrote:
Can we officially put this in the "50 reasons you should go to BYU" thread?
Can we officially put this in the "50 reasons you should go to BYU" thread?
Reptiled
I felt like my experience was quite a bit different (graduated '08, so I'm not sure wen you were there). I think this is te general perception of BYU and a lot of the departments, in my opinion, had a chip on their shoulder about it and wanted to prove otherwise. This was, from what I saw, prevalent through the hard sciences and especially within social sciences (particularly psychology). I took a course titled something similar to 'Psyhology and LDS Perspectives,' expecting it to be viewing psychology through the lens of the gospel. Surprisingly, it was almost exclusively viewing the gospel through the lens of psychology. This was my first semester there (spent 1.5 years there) and then no longer was surprised when BYU continued to be conservative and hard line in reputation only.
HipHopAnonymous
Active Member
Some of the dirtiest girls I knew were currently at or ended up going to BYU.
The Black Swordsman
Well-Known Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mRM1VwUiYA
BYU girls not bad.
BYU girls not bad.
CONAN
Well-Known Member
Ya, I was thinking the same. Easiest A's there.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
If that's what floats your boat then cool. Meaningless sex with easy girls who hook up with 2-3 different guys a day is cool, then awesome. What I resent is deception. If you're a skank, then don't come to church on Sunday preaching how we are supposed to live when I know you do none of that during the week. Didnt it tick you off when boozer talked about playing better defense? It's kind of like that.
jimmy eat jazz
Well-Known Member
My frame of reference largely refers to religious issues. Outside of religion classes, I can't recall any professors who overtly inserted religion into the classroom instruction in areas not related to religious belief. BYU (unlike some other Christian universities) openly teches and supports evolution and appears to be to adhere rigorously to scientific process. That said, IF you find yourself reaching conclusions about religious truths different from LDS teachings, you must tread very very carefully. As someone who went through this experience, and who know other people who have gone through this experience, I know first hand just how intolerant BYU is institutionally to those who seriously question or lose their belief in Mormonism. This includes a good friend (and this is one of many examples I am aware of, and I only see the tip of the iceberg), former staff member there who was a 'liberal' Mormon but active and committed to the Church, who having said one intemperate thing to a student who he though was also a bit more liberal in her beliefs, and whose father happened to be among LDS hierarchy, was summarily run out of the school and terminated within a couple weeks time through a process that can only be described as inquisitorial in nature. While BYU will allow some divergence from orthodoxy, this is true only to a point. Once you cross a very ill defined boundary (which varies depending on who is in authority and how pious he happens to be), you become a threat and are treated as such.
To understand this, it helps to realize what BYU's primary mission is: to create a pipeline of dedicated, faithful, loyal, tithe paying members who form an important core of the Church's membership (at least North American based) and leadership. Institutionally, BYU is dedicated and active in seeking to root out perceived subversives who threaten this mission.
Years ago BYU (LDS Church) commissioned a panel study (longitudinal study of the same cohort of students) looking at students who were marginal acceptances (just above cutoff line for admission) and marginal rejections (just below cut off line). After tracking these students for several years, the study found that students admitted to BYU were significantly more likely to be active & contributing members to the LDS Church than those not admitted. The study concluded that the primary causal factor was the intense socialization process that is part of the BYU experience. (This was an internal study and not published.)
Understanding the implications of this study and BYU's mission, it makes perfect sense why BYU tends not to be tolerant toward perceived apostasy or perceived apostates (this makes perfect sense to me and in one respect I don't blame them), although this vigilance serves also to create an environment in which one is open about 'subversive' beliefs or opinions at his/her peril.
7StraightIsGreat
Well-Known Member
You make is sound so dirty.
All joking aside, I see exactly what you're talking about. Many on here think I hate on BYU so much because I'm anti-LDS, which couldn't be further from the truth. Many of my family members and closest friends are LDS. I may not agree with the doctrine, but I certainly love and respect them very much. What has always turned me off about BYU is exactly what you're talking about. In my eyes, there's always been a big chunk of hypocricy associated with the school.
Probably the best example of where my early hate came from is Jim McMahon. BYU promotes itself as a school who is not for everybody due to their strict moral compass, but Jimmy Mac was the complete and total anithesis to all of that and the worst part IMO, is that EVERYBODY knew it.
To be fair to BYU, these type of examples are few and far between, but when the school and it's fans (most of them anyway) carry themselves with a type of "we're better than you because of our standards" type of attitude, it resonates loudly when you see hypocritical behavior.
Duck Rodgers
Well-Known Member
Meh, the anti-BYU talk doesn't work on recruits that have actually been there. The important thing is that this guy was already in Provo when Wes started with his rubbish. One 6'6" WR that can run and jump is in the bag for BYU for next year - that's all that matters.
Duck Rodgers
Well-Known Member
BYU officially snagged the guy that spawned this topic today btw:
https://sports.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/recruiting/player-Nick-Kurtz-150862
https://www.hudl.com/athlete/1753766/nick-kurtz
Load up on that BYU stock now. They seem to be understanding and recruiting now as if they know their environment appeals to a much wider net of people than they ever believed. And it does. Some crazy guy once said something like, "throw your net on the other side of the boat" and some guys caught a lot more of whatever they were looking for. That's what is happening at BYU. Starting now.
https://sports.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/recruiting/player-Nick-Kurtz-150862
https://www.hudl.com/athlete/1753766/nick-kurtz
Load up on that BYU stock now. They seem to be understanding and recruiting now as if they know their environment appeals to a much wider net of people than they ever believed. And it does. Some crazy guy once said something like, "throw your net on the other side of the boat" and some guys caught a lot more of whatever they were looking for. That's what is happening at BYU. Starting now.
UGLI baby
Well-Known Member
Duck Rodgers
Well-Known Member
What? Troutbum is/was a wise man. You should heed his words more often.
Duck Rodgers
Well-Known Member
Half their class last year were JC lineman - guys that don't get evaluated. But yes, historically BYU has probably been in that 50 range most years according to the recruiting experts. Nothing to brag about for sure initially, but that talent usually turns about being good enough when it's all said and done - with a few glaring exceptions. BYU typically lacks depth at DB most years and BYU could use a few more explosive skill position players on offense. That's it. It doesn't matter if it bumps them up only 10 spots or whatever. Guys that can be solid at a couple of historically weak spots is all they need. They meet that need, they'll be much improved regardless of what some recruiting services, that pretend they know the value of each of the million or so high school kids that are playing football currently is, say.
scootsy
Well-Known Member
don't feed the troll
green
Well-Known Member
BYU and Utah have been pretty equal the last 20 years. Similar recruiting rankings, similar records, etc.
The past two years their difference has been has Schedule. You switch their schedules and their record switches.
Since Utah has joined the PAC-12, their recruiting ranks have jumped from the 50's to the 30's and they have still lost a lot of games. Since BYU has left the MWC, their recruiting ranks have dropped from the 50's to the 70's.
So, Utah's schedule has gotten harder, their recruits have gotten better and they have lost more.
This year will be big for BYU because their recruits have diminished in quality but their schedule is getting a lot tougher.
This is where your depth gets really tested. Big year for BYU. Win, and you can really do special things. Lose as an independent and you can quickly get forgotten, especially without having Utah on the schedule the next two years. What game do you get excited for? And not semi-excited, but really excited?
I'll make a confession here: I know Utah might only win 3-6 games this year. If Utah goes 3-9 and beats BYU, USU and WSU, I can live with that. I'd want Kyle's seat warm, but I'd want him to have a year with Erickson and a Jr QB. If Utah goes 3-9 and with loses to USU and BYU? I don't know if I bring Kyle back. All we've heard is how the recruits are better, the coaches are better, yet their program hasn't passed BYU yet and has regressed to where USU can consistently beat you.
3 wins does not equal 3 wins this year.
My point with the rambling is that Utah has games/rivalries that are fun to look forward to. If BYU is losing and can't play Utah, that could kill them.