Omnibus Gordon Hayward Thread (To clean up the Board some)

[Stifle Tower]

He started with a playoff team with decent assets. The Jazz are young now, but the team is far worse, and it's not clear if the players/picks on the team now are worth more than the players/picks DL inherited.

Fair enough. But a bit generous on the team outlook.

The Jazz were a "fringe" playoff team? They barely made it as the 8th seed and got swept in the first round. They missed the next season despite having pretty much the same roster. At some point, you have to decide whether you want to just contend for the 8th seed or try to rebuild. Keeping Millsap, Carroll, etc. would have made the team competitive. Would they have made the playoffs? Doubtful. The number 8 seed in the WC won 49 games. So let's say they finish around .500 and get the 12th pick in the draft.

Also factor in new contracts for Big Al and Paul if you want to maintain that "playoff" team. Give them raises, keep other vets and there is little room to make any other changes. You also face losing Favors or Hayward (or others) in 2014/15 because paying $12M for Favors and the same or max for Gordon puts the Jazz into the luxury tax or, even if you CAN fit those two, you certainly can't fit Kanter and Burks the year after.

Scenario 1: Jazz add Lavine or Warren to a lineup that has Millsap, Favors, Kanter as the bigs, Carroll, Hayward and Burks as the wings and Mo Williams (or another vet PG). And we're talking about 2012 DeMarre, not the one who claims he developed his game under Snyder.

Outlook: Can they win 48-50 games and make the playoffs? Who do you keep/trade starting in 2014/15 to stay under the tax threshold?

Scenario 2: Time to rebuild. Out with the old, acquire additional assets, "tank" to get a top-8 pick.

Outlook: Will Exum be a franchise player. Will he have more impact than Warren or Lavine? Does Hood contribute (Jazz don't get the pick without the rebuild).

I'd have to give Lindsey a "B" grade. I understand the plan, even though the outcome is not yet known. And in the last draft, arguably one of the weakest in NBA history, he at least got some serviceable players in Burke, Gobert and probably Neto. All 3 have shown indications they can - at the very worst - be rotation players. That can't be said for the majority of 2013 picks.

 

[GVC]

They were stagnant with that first group. They simply weren't going anywhere. Sometimes you have to give up to go up. Sure it might not work, but if you want to win, you have to take your swings.

Is this collection better? The jury is still out. As a fan, even if it ultimately doesn't work, I'm glad they took a chance rather than being an 8 seed or drafting 14th in the lottery every season.

2 things:

1. None of that changes the fact that DL sat on his hands in Year 1, getting nothing for his top players in trades.

2. Letting players walk is easy if ownership gives you the green light. GMs should be evaluated on how well they do with that freedom. Jury is still out on DL's moves.

 

[GVC]

damn, that's a pretty good haul.

But what are we going to do with the cap space?????

****ing morons.

 

[fishonjazz]

But what are we going to do with the cap space?????

****ing morons.

Cap space sucks

Overpaying and handing out bad contracts rulez!!!!!

 

[Stoked]

Liar? Did he ever comment publicly that he would match any offer or have we just been relying on reports to that effect?

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Multiple reports, including people with a good record of accuracy.

 

[[size/HUGE] fixed [/size]]

DL has effectively traded:

Millsap, Jefferson, Marvin, Mo, Carroll, Foye, 2013 #21 pick, 2013 #14 pick, 2013 #46 pick, 2014 #35 pick

for:

Burke, Hood, Gobert, moving up ~10 spots in the 2014 draft (Exum), a 2017 1st-Round pick (from GSW) and a 2016 2nd-Round pick


Are the Jazz any closer to contention now than they were 2 years ago? Is the current collection of assets clearly better than the collection of assets DL inherited?

I agree with your apprehension, but Lindsey should get some nod for piloting us to Exum.

 

[Stoked]

2 things:

1. None of that changes the fact that DL sat on his hands in Year 1, getting nothing for his top players in trades.

2. Letting players walk is easy if ownership gives you the green light. GMs should be evaluated on how well they do with that freedom. Jury is still out on DL's moves.

From what I understood year 1 was a learning curve for him and KOC still ran the show. Is that not accurate?

 

[seattlejazzfan]

Multiple reports, including people with a good record of accuracy.

Right and I believe the reports, but if it didn't come from his mouth, he can always deny. Therefore, no liar.

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[Stoked]

Right and I believe the reports, but if it didn't come from his mouth, he can always deny. Therefore, no liar.

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Fair enough. Wonder if he mentioned it on one of his interviews with Locke or 1280.

 

[seattlejazzfan]

2 things:

1. None of that changes the fact that DL sat on his hands in Year 1, getting nothing for his top players in trades.

2. Letting players walk is easy if ownership gives you the green light. GMs should be evaluated on how well they do with that freedom. Jury is still out on DL's moves.

Agree on both counts. As a fan I'm glad they let those guys walk.

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[Park Bites]

lol Marvin for 7-8 he is only going to get offers for 4-5.

 

[colton]

But you can't skip steps! Never mind that the mysterious steps have never been named or numbered. It is good enough for the fans and media to know that we just can't skip any of them.

Yes, that continually bugs me whenever he says that.