Are the Jazz going to trade Rudy?

[infection]

To risk losing a cornerstone over 40-50M difference while paying JC 50M+ seems like having your priorities a little backwards.

Spend big on the appetizers and skimp on the entrées. But it doesn’t matter because by the time you load up on the appetizers, you’re no longer hungry for the entrée.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Spend big on the appetizers and skimp on the entrées. But it doesn’t matter because by the time you load up on the appetizers, you’re no longer hungry for the entrée.

This is a bad comparison because there are many times dinner appetizers are just flat out better. Sometimes I will pick an appetizer for my dinner. I will not have my dinner bound by your rules and social norms.

 

[LoPo]

To risk losing a cornerstone over 40-50M difference while paying JC 50M+ seems like having your priorities a little backwards.

But you're not losing Rudy for nothing.

If he wants to leave after the season, we can sign and trade him. Or we use cap space.

The more we discuss, the more I want to just play the season out. I was extremely against this before, but so many sign and trades happen these days. We shouldn't be left with nothing.

If we want to keep Rudy next summer and our playoff run warrants it, then we can give him more than anybody else to keep him.

Sent from my SM-G970U using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

But you're not losing Rudy for nothing.

If he wants to leave after the season, we can sign and trade him. Or we use cap space.

The more we discuss, the more I want to just play the season out. I was extremely against this before, but so many sign and trades happen these days. We shouldn't be left with nothing.

If we want to keep Rudy next summer and our playoff run warrants it, then we can give him more than anybody else to keep him.

Sent from my SM-G970U using JazzFanz mobile app

Yes and no... we'd have maybe 15M in cap space if he walks and we don't keep Mike. We could work a sign and trade... but those happen when the team signing the player does not have cap space. There is no incentive for the player or the team to help us for no reason. Dallas is the team to watch... maybe they send us Maxi Kleber because they are just shy of the cap space needed. You happy with Maxi Kleber and a trade exception?

Toronto might let you get the trade exception if they are feeling nice... NY and SA the same. Similar to Boston and Hayward this offseason.

Maybe the Clips or Lakers give something up to get him in a sign and trade if they can stay below the apron (a requirement) but they are asset poor. Maybe Boston does a sign and trade... I just wouldn't bank on that return being good.

Playing out the season might still be the best strategy. If you had him on an extension I just think that's a better trade asset than what you would get in a sign and trade.

We are in a tight spot.

 

[LoPo]

Yes and no... we'd have maybe 15M in cap space if he walks and we don't keep Mike. We could work a sign and trade... but those happen when the team signing the player does not have cap space. There is no incentive for the player or the team to help us for no reason. Dallas is the team to watch... maybe they send us Maxi Kleber because they are just shy of the cap space needed. You happy with Maxi Kleber and a trade exception?

Toronto might let you get the trade exception if they are feeling nice... NY and SA the same. Similar to Boston and Hayward this offseason.

Maybe the Clips or Lakers give something up to get him in a sign and trade if they can stay below the apron (a requirement) but they are asset poor. Maybe Boston does a sign and trade... I just wouldn't bank on that return being good.

Playing out the season might still be the best strategy. If you had him on an extension I just think that's a better trade asset than what you would get in a sign and trade.

We are in a tight spot.

Good breakdown. I rank the options as:

#1 Standard Max (can it be declining)
#2 Trade Him
#3 Play The Season, Decide in Summer
#4 Let Him Leave

Supermax isn't an option. It will not be as easy to trade that as people are making it out to be. We would have to use assets to dump it.

And if Don and Rudy have another public falling out, it could get really, really ugly for us in a hurry.

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[slc]

Jazz and Rudy are going to get a deal done
No insider talk of trade talk yet
Rudy is a fan favorite and top 25 type player
Nobody Jazz trade for will be anywhere near his stature
Rudy has already backed away from the ultra supermax talk

 

[candrew]

Andy gets off on being a bit of a buzzkill; but he's not out of line with his thinking here (read the thread)

 

[KqWIN]

I think playing it out it out this season is more or less letting him walk for nothing in the summer. If he gets to FA, he will be leaving. TOR and DAL are unquestionably better basketball situations and the money difference is negligible. If he didn't sign now, he won't sign later.

As for trading him, can we really get something in return that's worth more than one year of Rudy? Who is giving us that trade package? Any team that trades for Rudy has massive leverage on UTA and they would also be under the assumption that Rudy is likely to leave. If you want to make a trade, muster up a realistic offer. There isn't a good one. The logical landing spots for Rudy (DAL and TOR) already have max space and it wouldn't make sense for them to trade for him now.

Overpaying is not great, but it has a much more minor impact compared to the other options. The cost is either 1) Ryan Smith's money or 2) having to get rid of a role player down the line to make up the difference.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I think playing it out it out this season is more or less letting him walk for nothing in the summer. If he gets to FA, he will be leaving. TOR and DAL are unquestionably better basketball situations and the money difference is negligible. If he didn't sign now, he won't sign later.

As for trading him, can we really get something in return that's worth more than one year of Rudy? Who is giving us that trade package? Any team that trades for Rudy has massive leverage on UTA and they would also be under the assumption that Rudy is likely to leave. If you want to make a trade, muster up a realistic offer. There isn't a good one. The logical landing spots for Rudy (DAL and TOR) already have max space and it wouldn't make sense for them to trade for him now.

Overpaying is not great, but it has a much more minor impact compared to the other options. The cost is either 1) Ryan Smith's money or 2) having to get rid of a role player down the line to make up the difference.

I think we can still offer the super max in the offseason. I'd offer him the regular max or the 5 year kinda super max... so 5/195. I'd hold off on the 5/228 until the offseason and pull that out to beat the Dallas or Toronto offer. 228 is much better than 145.

The extra 33M is the premium for getting through the season healthy and having a good year. Would suck to start the super duper max contract and already have him hurt like John Wall was. If he wants to meet in the middle we can take that risk now. If he won't agree to 5/195 then he just doesn't want to be here and you weigh 1 year of Rudy versus what he can get in a trade. Also... I will be sad.

 

[KqWIN]

I think we can still offer the super max in the offseason. I'd offer him the regular max or the 5 year kinda super max... so 5/195. I'd hold off on the 5/228 until the offseason and pull that out to beat the Dallas or Toronto offer. 228 is much better than 145.

The extra 33M is the premium for getting through the season healthy and having a good year. Would suck to start the super duper max contract and already have him hurt like John Wall was. If he wants to meet in the middle we can take that risk now. If he won't agree to 5/195 then he just doesn't want to be here and you weigh 1 year of Rudy versus what he can get in a trade. Also... I will be sad.

I guess that's true. If he's willing to accept a certain amount of money now, he'll probably be willing to accept the same amount in the summer. But a lot of things can happen during the season. I'd really like to see a deal get done. I mean...if we're willing to go 5/195, 5/228 isn't too far off of that.

I would rather sign Gobert to 5/195 and Jake Toolson to 5/35 over losing for nothing or trading him for pennies.

 

[DasJazz]

I respect you for digging in and having a take. I also respectfully disagree.

I would love for both sides to come to a reasonable agreement. But like I said, for me, I'm just kinda done with the divaish antics and non-development on the offensive end.

I do agree he is a phenomenal player, but only on one side of the court which doesn't equate to max or even super max.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I guess that's true. If he's willing to accept a certain amount of money now, he'll probably be willing to accept the same amount in the summer. But a lot of things can happen during the season. I'd really like to see a deal get done. I mean...if we're willing to go 5/195, 5/228 isn't too far off of that.

I would rather sign Gobert to 5/195 and Jake Toolson to 5/35 over losing for nothing or trading him for pennies.

I kind of agree... I just think we don't have to go that far yet so currently we are negotiating against ourselves a bit... that seems like the natural compromise to get it done a year early. He'd be locking in $50M more than he can get from anyone else on the open market. If he gives us the Chandler Parsons "supermax or nothing bitch" then I think it is about more than money and hints at issues that could re-surface... so its not necessarily just the dollar amount.

If I was his agent and 5/195 was on the table I'd definitely be telling him to sign that ****. I don't think we have put that on the table... yet.