Court: California gay marriage ban is unconstitutional

[kwb]

I can understand that.

My point is that we all affect each other. Who I am, and what I do even in the privacy of my own home will affect other people. As a citizen of the United States and as a part of the world as a whole I can have an opinion as to what is best for me, my family, my state, my country, and the world. It may be one opinion but it's my obligation to state my mind and attempt to make all of those better the way I see fit. Of course my opinion will differ from that of others, and that's fine, but I will stand up for what I think is right especially when I see things happening that I feel will hurt one or all of those. Yes people have choices and are not obligated to make a choice that will make me happy. It is also my freedom to call someone out that "chooses to be useless to the continuing existence of this nation" because I want and expect something better of and from this nation. I will do whatever I can as one person to stand up for what I think is right and good, and to encourage or help others to rid themselves of any apathy or selfishness to do more, be better and help make America "great and prosperous" again. I can't force someone, but just as I can help dress my kids or help an old lady across the street, or give advice to a teenager that is going through a rough time, or give someone a ride somewhere, or give someone some food who is going through a tough time, or teach and encourage people around me good things I've learned... I can help some individuals around me and encourage them to be and do better. Sometimes I lock a drawer with tools or door so my kids don't get into it and do something dangerous. There are times that we need to lock a drawer or door to ensure safety. Does that always work? No. If a kid is determined to get into the locked drawer or door they will often find a way in. Sometimes locking the door encourages them to find out what is on the other side, so we have to determine if it's really the best thing to keep it unlocked so they don't really care or if we should lock it and by doing so pique their interest. Whatever, I am rambling now.

/ramble

In this example, you're talking about your children. You know what's best for them as a father and that's why you are locking the drawer. You raised them. Plus they are kids and don't know better. That's fine. But for you to use this example and "locking" things for others because you see fit when you don't know them is just odd to me. I see where you are coming from but I just don't agree. I put a child safety lock on my back door so my kid can't get out because I don't want him running off. I know it would be bad. Would I do that if a friend of mine came over because I'm afraid of him running off? No, he's a grown *** man and can choose for himself what he wants whether I think it's harmful or not. Once again, him doing that will not affect me.

 

[kwb]

I can understand that.

My point is that we all affect each other. Who I am, and what I do even in the privacy of my own home will affect other people. As a citizen of the United States and as a part of the world as a whole I can have an opinion as to what is best for me, my family, my state, my country, and the world. It may be one opinion but it's my obligation to state my mind and attempt to make all of those better the way I see fit. Of course my opinion will differ from that of others, and that's fine, but I will stand up for what I think is right especially when I see things happening that I feel will hurt one or all of those. Yes people have choices and are not obligated to make a choice that will make me happy. It is also my freedom to call someone out that "chooses to be useless to the continuing existence of this nation" because I want and expect something better of and from this nation. I will do whatever I can as one person to stand up for what I think is right and good, and to encourage or help others to rid themselves of any apathy or selfishness to do more, be better and help make America "great and prosperous" again. I can't force someone, but just as I can help dress my kids or help an old lady across the street, or give advice to a teenager that is going through a rough time, or give someone a ride somewhere, or give someone some food who is going through a tough time, or teach and encourage people around me good things I've learned... I can help some individuals around me and encourage them to be and do better. Sometimes I lock a drawer with tools or door so my kids don't get into it and do something dangerous. There are times that we need to lock a drawer or door to ensure safety. Does that always work? No. If a kid is determined to get into the locked drawer or door they will often find a way in. Sometimes locking the door encourages them to find out what is on the other side, so we have to determine if it's really the best thing to keep it unlocked so they don't really care or if we should lock it and by doing so pique their interest. Whatever, I am rambling now.

/ramble

In this example, you're talking about your children. You know what's best for them as a father and that's why you are locking the drawer. You raised them. Plus they are kids and don't know better. That's fine. But for you to use this example and "locking" things for others because you see fit when you don't know them is just odd to me. I see where you are coming from but I just don't agree. I put a child safety lock on my back door so my kid can't get out because I don't want him running off. I know it would be bad. Would I do that if a friend of mine came over because I'm afraid of him running off? No, he's a grown *** man and can choose for himself what he wants whether I think it's harmful or not. Once again, him doing that will not affect me.

 

[Jazz Spazz]

There are already plenty of gay people out there. How has society changed because of it? People being gay has had no affect on me whatsoever. I can respect your opinion but for you to say that it's having an affect on some one you don't know is kind of ridiculous.

Every member of society has an affect on that society as a whole, and therefore upon the other members of that society.
It's not ridiculous, your claim that other members of society have no affect on you is ridiculous.
I'm not mad about it, and I don't hate anyone that is homosexual or all of them as a whole at all.
I'm just stating what is the reality of things.

 

[kwb]

Every member of society has an affect on that society as a whole, and therefore upon the other members of that society.
It's not ridiculous, your claim that other members of society have no affect on you is ridiculous.
I'm not mad about it, and I don't hate anyone that is homosexual or all of them as a whole at all.
I'm just stating what is the reality of things.

Once again, how is some one being gay having an affect on me? I haven't seen it yet. Gay people have been around before I was born. I'm sure racists back in the 60's had the same argument that blacks were some how affecting society.

 

[Stoked]

I respectfully disagree. I will say there are plenty of worse things out there, but there is definitely an affect on you and society.
Each person is a part of society, each person affects society.

There is an effect. I just do not see a negative affect. Let us say two gay men/women get married. Are they not making a family and contributing to society? If so how is that negative?

 

[PearlWatson]

There's a big difference between holding an opinion and advocating that point of view and using the force of law to deny people the ability to exercise their own free will.

...to force governments to recognize their relationship as a marriage.

You want government out of the drug busting business and government involved in the homosexual relationship business. That doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Jazz Spazz]

There is an effect. I just do not see a negative affect. Let us say two gay men/women get married. Are they not making a family and contributing to society? If so how is that negative?

There is an effect. The negative depends on your perspective and opinion. I have my reasons for why I see it the way I do. You have your reasons for seeing things the way you do... but it seems at least we can both agree there is an effect.

 

[Stoked]

There is an effect. The negative depends on your perspective and opinion. I have my reasons for why I see it the way I do. You have your reasons for seeing things the way you do... but it seems at least we can both agree there is an effect.

Yes we both agree that there is an effect. KWB is arguing no effect. I am saying no negative effect. I do not see gay marriage as negative. I see individual marriages as good or bad depending on the peoples personalities that are in them. There will be positive and negative effecting marriages amoung straights and gays. Gay marriage itself is no more negative or positive then marriage as it stands now.

 

[Jazz Spazz]

Once again, how is some one being gay having an affect on me? I haven't seen it yet. Gay people have been around before I was born. I'm sure racists back in the 60's had the same argument that blacks were some how affecting society.

Maybe you are not part of society? Do you watch more and more TV shows that joke about homosexuality, that have homosexual characters? Are there products out there that target the homosexual audience? Do doctors and hospitals have to devote more time to homosexual specific treatments or issues? Was Aids a huge deal years ago when it was thought there was nothing anyone could do to help with it? There are more ways... but just because you don't have first person interaction or contact with homosexual individual doesn't mean you don't get 2nd, or third, or fourth level "contact".

As to the blacks affecting society argument, blacks do affect society just as any other person does. You decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing for yourself. Personally I think it is a good thing depending on the individual, and in general a good thing. Lame argument though.

 

[kwb]

Maybe you are not part of society? Do you watch more and more TV shows that joke about homosexuality, that have homosexual characters? Are there products out there that target the homosexual audience? Do doctors and hospitals have to devote more time to homosexual specific treatments or issues? Was Aids a huge deal years ago when it was thought there was nothing anyone could do to help with it? There are more ways... but just because you don't have first person interaction or contact with homosexual individual doesn't mean you don't get 2nd, or third, or fourth level "contact".

As to the blacks affecting society argument, blacks do affect society just as any other person does. You decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing for yourself. Personally I think it is a good thing depending on the individual, and in general a good thing. Lame argument though.

You are seriously not blaming the whole AIDS things on the gays are you? Wow! Keep up the great work!

 

[Jazz Spazz]

Yes we both agree that there is an effect. KWB is arguing no effect. I am saying no negative effect. I do not see gay marriage as negative. I see individual marriages as good or bad depending on the peoples personalities that are in them. There will be positive and negative effecting marriages amoung straights and gays. Gay marriage itself is no more negative or positive then marriage as it stands now.

Maybe we can agree to disagree on this then. I know there are plenty of negative things going on with marriage, and as I stated in prior posts I think it all stems from the selfishness that is so prevalent in today's world. For the most part I'm not disagreeing with you on this, other than that I still see homosexual marriage as a whole as a negative for society. I see many issues with heterosexual marriage as a negative for society as well, but that's not the topic of this thread.

 

[kwb]

Also, doctors have to devote a lot of their time for many things other than some one being a homosexual. They always have and always will. I guess I should clarify my statement. I don't see how having gay marriage in a society has a negative effect. Like you said, we all have our opinions and I can respect yours.